Super 91 with pitted barrel

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dbowling said:
why not see if you can put a bright light at back of breech and take a pic of the bore and post it, we might be able to tell you if its really bad or minor..
I will get some pics using the bore scope when I get to my gun smith's shop and do just that.
 
If the receiver to your Super 91 is stainless and the bbl is going to be blue, you could have the whole rifle done in Black Ice, Duracoat or whatever coating you like.

Glad to hear it’s going to work out for you and you have a plan.
 
Are you shooting the Bull Shop in a .504 or .5045? The difference is in how many times they have been throuugh the sizer die. Most of my Whites prefer the .5045 with 80 gr of T7ff with a fiber wad over the powder. JB bore paste the heck out of that gun. Then start with the load development. You may take your .504's and try rolling them between 2 flat files to knurl them up in size.
 
redpep said:
Are you shooting the Bull Shop in a .504 or .5045? The difference is in how many times they have been throuugh the sizer die. Most of my Whites prefer the .5045 with 80 gr of T7ff with a fiber wad over the powder. JB bore paste the heck out of that gun. Then start with the load development. You may take your .504's and try rolling them between 2 flat files to knurl them up in size.

I have not tried the .504 Bull Shop bullets as of yet; only the .503 No Excuses thus far with less than impressive groups. I have a cast on my ankle at the moment which has hindered my range time and probably increased my tendency to "make mountains out of mole hills" with too much couch-time. I definitely have a couple flat files on my shopping list to knurl bullets and will give that a try. I hope to get by the gun smith shop this week to bore-scope the barrel and get a better understanding of what it is that I am seeing in that barrel. I have hit it with JB and while it seems to have helped, somewhat, there is still "something" in there. I have never had to deal with anything that could have leading so I simply don't know what it looks like, firsthand. I will pass along any comments from the smith, as soon as I can.
 
could be you need to experiment with powder charges my .451 when I tried 70 gr of 777 2f would shoot about 2.5 in. at 55 yds, when I upped it to 80 gr. bullet holes were touching.. your gun may just need that perfect charge to shoot good... as I said earlier unless it looks like a log chain has been dragged thru it, it will more then likely shoot.. with some pitting you may have to swab every 2-3 shots as it will cause fouling to build up quicker.
I think taking it to a gunsmith will just be money thrown away as about all he will say is you will have to shoot it and see what it will do, you may have to try quiet a few powder bullet combos before you hit the right one, but I would say the .504 bull shops with what ever powder combo will be what shoots best.. all my Whites like bull shop bullets.. you might order some of Ed Mehligs 460 gr conicals also to try they are very accurate out of my Whites.
 
dbowling said:
could be you need to experiment with powder charges my .451 when I tried 70 gr of 777 2f would shoot about 2.5 in. at 55 yds, when I upped it to 80 gr. bullet holes were touching.. your gun may just need that perfect charge to shoot good... as I said earlier unless it looks like a log chain has been dragged thru it, it will more then likely shoot.. with some pitting you may have to swab every 2-3 shots as it will cause fouling to build up quicker.
I think taking it to a gunsmith will just be money thrown away as about all he will say is you will have to shoot it and see what it will do, you may have to try quiet a few powder bullet combos before you hit the right one, but I would say the .504 bull shops with what ever powder combo will be what shoots best.. all my Whites like bull shop bullets.. you might order some of Ed Mehligs 460 gr conicals also to try they are very accurate out of my Whites.
Now that is definitely interesting to hear. This is only my third muzzleloader and I guess I got lucky with the other two as they shot great with the first loads I fed them. The bore on this 91 does not look like it has ever had a log chain run through it so I am optimistic I will get it to shoot, especially with the advice and thoughts being shared. My smith said he would be happy to take a look when I drop by, no charge, and it will certainly help my curiosity to get a professional opinion.
 
I finally made it by my local gunsmith's shop to have the barrel scoped. It was a valuable lesson in that it confirmed what I suspected I was seeing. There is still leading in the barrel in spite of my cleaning efforts and some minor pitting as well. Obviously, the leading can be addressed easily enough and thankfully the pitting is very near the muzzle crown. I am having the crown re-finished to knock out the last 1/4 inch where the pitting is present and will have some more cleaning to do but I am optimistic this one will shoot with a bit more effort. I should get my barrel back in a couple weeks and will post my results once I get back to the range. $75 for the re-crowning work...
 
Many have RE crowned with basic tool and had it come out fine if you want to save a few bucks
 
sbuff said:
Many have RE crowned with basic tool and had it come out fine if you want to save a few bucks


There is a DIY sort of tool that will take 1/4 inch of steel off the muzzle of a barrel and do so evenly and without a lathe?
 
Birchwood Casey makes a product called " lead remover & polishing cloth". Track of the wolf used to carry it and probably still does. I cut some into patches and on a tight jag removed lead from a 45 cal pistol barrel. Might give it a try?
 
Yes Ron L on this site has done so with basic pipe cutter. Many have cut the qla off of TC muzzloaders due to issues shooting conicals.
 
So……How did it turn out? Curious minds want to know!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
fiberoptik2313 said:
So……How did it turn out? Curious minds want to know!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Well, I haven't made it to the range, yet... But I have cleaned quite a bit more lead out of the barrel using Kroil and "Chore Boy" copper wool. One interesting thing I have noticed is how much more effective the Kroil seems to be compared to Hoppe's 9. (or maybe it is the copper wool wrapped around an old bronze brush?) I also had a surgery on an ankle which sort of slowed down the process but I expect to shoot next weekend. I will post my results.
 
Put the gun in a vise take the action screw out ant try to slide the action back and forth if it moves first step bed the action lug or full action bed. Second is the barrel free floated you should be able to slide a dollar bill between the barrel and stock if not float the barrel. Do you shoot with ramrod in the gun ? If so leave ramrod out and see if that helps if it does you have to adjust ramrod retainer clip to change affect on rifle. What weight bullets are you shooting ? One of my .504 rifles was throwing the 440 gr.bullets all over the place after I converted it to a super safari but it shot one inch groups at 100 yards prior I ordered a 600 gr mold and casted some up with a .504 sizer die and it started shooting one inch groups at 100 yards again I spoke to doc about this and he told me it's all harmonics and all of these things I described affect harmonics I'm not saying your situation is but I own a lot of white rifles and rebuilt all of them and they really shoot.
 
muzzlestuffer said:
Put the gun in a vise take the action screw out ant try to slide the action back and forth if it moves first step bed the action lug or full action bed. Second is the barrel free floated you should be able to slide a dollar bill between the barrel and stock if not float the barrel. Do you shoot with ramrod in the gun ? If so leave ramrod out and see if that helps if it does you have to adjust ramrod retainer clip to change affect on rifle. What weight bullets are you shooting ? One of my .504 rifles was throwing the 440 gr.bullets all over the place after I converted it to a super safari but it shot one inch groups at 100 yards prior I ordered a 600 gr mold and casted some up with a .504 sizer die and it started shooting one inch groups at 100 yards again I spoke to doc about this and he told me it's all harmonics and all of these things I described affect harmonics I'm not saying your situation is but I own a lot of white rifles and rebuilt all of them and they really shoot.
I appreciate your suggestions. I bedded the action and yes, the barrel is floating/no stock contact. The only bullets I have tried thus far are 460g No Excuses sized at .503 but I have since stocked up on Bull Shop 460g sized to .504, which I will be shooting next weekend. I have not tried tweaking the ram-rod but will keep that in mind. Thanks
 
I forgot to mention if you hold the gun with your hand around the barrel just in front of the action and insert the ramrod if you feel the barrel moving out or bulging out you could say your ramrod can be affecting accuracy which is ok if accurate and always keep things the same.
 
Finally got out to shoot yesterday. Nice day, temp in upper 40's and the barest breeze right in my face. Had time for two loads. First was RWS cap, 80g/volume Triple7 FFg, Bull Shop 460g sized at .504 and veggie fiber wad. 50 yards off a bipod, prone, three shot group of 1.75 inch
Second load, reduced to 70g, all else the same; 1.5 inch group.
I had mounted a Konus scope for this assessment right after I took it off a newly acquired M97 that gave me a .75 inch group with 80g load at 50 yards.
I was shooting the S91 without the ram-rod and swabbing between shots with blue windex and dry patches.
Still not satisfied, though an improvement over the No Excuses bullets and prior to having the crown re-done. I did find something last night after cleaning the S91. I removed the under-rib and there is a noticeable curve to it. I believe next session I will shoot without it and perhaps even try to find a bottle of Triple7 FFFg. One question I have about reducing the load further, say to 65 or 60 grains is, will I still have an adequate load for elk?
 
The "curved" under-rib was an identified problem according to Doc that led to accuracy issues when I inquired about it. That's why he got rid of it on later models. Mine doesn't seem to affect my accuracy and I haven't figured out a way to mount the ramrod if I remove it without doing some machining. Switch to the FFF. You'll see better accuracy with it.
 

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