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I still want to know how in the world they can claim to ignite ALL the 200gr of powder when that powder cant possibly completely burn. If it did completely burn you would NEVER need to swab. There would be no fouling. Its not chemically possible to completely burn (convert a solid to gas) Pyrodex, only smokeless achieves a near complete burn.

Their estimate of $750MSRP from a few months ago sure went up. :D I would rather buy a NULA and wait 6 months to get it or build my own. That huge X-Mark trigger recall is not going to win me over either. Rem has been pumping out too much garbage for years. Never seen that kind of mass problem with a Timney or Jewel trigger.

I would also like to see a third party post FPS results. IIRC Cecil at PR tried and didnt get his to achieve the claimed FPS. I doubt they will achieve 2450fps as they claim. Ultimate revised their fps claims several times over the years. At one time they claimed over 2500fps and it dropped atleast twice since then.
 
It just was released in the American Hunter Mag from the NRA too. It is fairly heavy at 8.5lbs too. :shock: That's not for me. I only like my Target and Varmint rifles that heavy.
 
I have to agree with GM.... a barrel of such a length can only burn so much powder in the time of the burn. And black powder is of such a nature that by nature it does not completely burn up. But hey... lets sell a rifle. Although for that price, I will add a little more and get a custom flintlock.
 
ShawnT said:
It just was released in the American Hunter Mag from the NRA too. It is fairly heavy at 8.5lbs too. :shock: That's not for me. I only like my Target and Varmint rifles that heavy.
Click to expand...

The article says: Both of the 47-inch-long Remington 700 Ultimate Muzzleloaders weigh-in at 9.5 - so that must be the complete package with scope - I actually thought at first it was the weight of the ML itself.
 
I saw that too.
The American hunter specs just say that the ML weighs 8.5lbs. I don't put much salt in what writers say. Who knows till it is posted on the Remington website, but I just looked and they don't show it on their site yet.

This is from todays NRA American Hunter magazine

■ Type: bolt-action inline muzzleloader
■ Caliber: .50
■ Barrel: 26"; 1:26" twist; stainless steel;
fluted
■ Trigger: single-stage X-Mark Pro; adjustable;
6.1-lb. pull weight
■ Sights: none on version tested; aperture
rear and fiber-optic front on second version;
both versions drilled and tapped for
scope bases
■ Safety: 2-position toggle
■ Stock: Bell and Carlson composite with
raised comb and beavertail fore-end
(tested); LOP 14‡"; laminated wood
■ Overall Length: 46‡ "
■ Weight: 8ˆ.5 lbs.
■ Metal Finish: matte stainless steel
■ Accessories:
20 pieces of primed brass;
20 bullets; aluminum ramrod with jag; polymer
hard case
■ MSRP: $1,295

The test shooting was done with Parkers Ballistic Extremes in 250, 275 &300gns.

Œ
 
GM54-120 said:
I still want to know how in the world they can claim to ignite ALL the 200gr of powder when that powder cant possibly completely burn. If it did completely burn you would NEVER need to swab. There would be no fouling. Its not chemically possible to completely burn (convert a solid to gas) Pyrodex, only smokeless achieves a near complete burn...........quote]

Well...hummmmm..... You're still going to get a patch come out lightly dirty but, the propellant completely burns in the first 9" and turns into fine powder like dust. With an Ultimate Firearms rifle, swabbing serves two purposes, one to wipe out the dust and the other to lightly lubricate the barrel for the next round. I can tell you from "first hand experience" that a patch will come out three or four times cleaner shooting T7M pellets, than it will shooting one charge of BH209.

I've shot two containers so far of T7M pellets with the .45 Winchester Magnum Brass. I haven't had to modify a single part on the rifle, the brass comes out AS CLEAN as it entered the chamber, inside and out. There is "0" blowback and the entire chamber is as clean after shooting as before shooting. I use one patch between shots while shooting the T7M pellets, as recommended, to remove the light dust and lube for the next round. I shot twelve (12) rounds the first time I shot the rifle. The first 3 rounds from just being bore sighted took me to an acceptable first time zero. The next nine (9) rounds went into the same hole, enlarging it. Cleaning it, is easier than any BP muzzleloader I've ever cleaned since I started shooting them in the "70's". Four patches, maybe five, including the lubrication patch and you're done. No breech plug to remove and clean, only the brake if one has it. A drill bit to clean out carbon can stay on the work bench.

Is there even a remote chance, that you may be putting to much emphasis on "complete burn"? I've shot thousands of rounds through a centerfire, which smokeless folks say burns completely, yet I end up with dirty patches when cleaning. I would highly recommend that if anyone is skeptic, they should find an owner near them and ask to shoot the rifle. You're going to review something different than you've seen before, just like I did.

If Remington followed the exact breech plug design that Johnston makes, the only thing left to test is the barrel they put on it. Get one out of the hands of a writer and into the hands of a shooter...........

FYI...... Western from their published test barrel, achieved 2,400fps with a 300gr bullet and 112grs BH by weight.
Click to expand...
 
Having just shopped the shops and stores in my area for a Rem 700 CDL DM in 7mm-08, I'm pretty sure that if the MSRP is $1,295 I could get one for $1,095 plus tax. Still a little rich for me, however I'm biased towards Knight and all of my ML fill a niche. I understand that the average hunter wants an out of the box gun, that means buy it clean load it and go. They are not into buying and upgrading to get to the end result which may just be a better or more versatile weapon such as a custom SML 700.
 
Why is the ultimate and the new remington only available in .50? Most others and home custom builders are going smaller and smaller in cal. Pretty much going to magnum CF rifle calibers in front stuffer.
I kind of like the new rem..But I also want to wait a bit for initial reviews. I think It made the list of 'want someday' but theres a few already slated as 'next priority'
 
Squeeze said:
Why is the ultimate and the new remington only available in .50? Most others and home custom builders are going smaller and smaller in cal. Pretty much going to magnum CF rifle calibers in front stuffer.
I kind of like the new rem..But I also want to wait a bit for initial reviews. I think It made the list of 'want someday' but theres a few already slated as 'next priority'
Click to expand...

IMO, its because the highest percentage of shooters want a .50 and also the highest percentage of available stock available is in .50. Yes, there's a small group of builders making 45's and most of them are smokeless rifles. Although those smokeless may shoot BH209, the "average" muzzleloader demands less work and more options.
 

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