Peep vs fiber optic open sights

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Dave C

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I'm new to the ML game and recently bought my first inline that I'm working on turning into an accurate gun as I'm a little anal about this kind of stuff. I have to use open sights or a peep in ID and came across this article about converting from the fiber optics to a peep for better accuracy.

http://www.gohunt.com/read/skills/incre ... -190098273

Has anyone here done this? What are your thoughts/experiences with this conversion? Is it worth it? What are the advantages/disadvantages? Would cost me over $100 to convert. It's money I'm willing to spend if it's worth it. If it's not though, I'll keep the fiber optics.
 
I live in an "iron sight only" state. I've switched to using peeps for a rear sight set up, and here recently I've even bought a Lyman front globe sight (the same one as in your link.) I haven't had a chance to mount and use the globe sight, but even with just the rear peep I've found it to be more accurate. It's expensive to get set up, but the way I see it, people spend hundreds on a scope because "you owe it to the game animal to make the best possible shot" so why are open sights different? I will add that I would recommend a better rear peep than the WGRS. It's not terrible, but I hate trying to adjust it. It seemed like you loosen the screw and it slides around. There's no real precise adjustments. I bought an NECG peep that mounts to a scope base so you can swap back and forth between the two. I never really seem to put a scope on so this year when I bought the Lyman front sight I also picked up a Williams FP peep. It's click adjustable so more precise and easier to adjust.
It's a little harder to get a sight picture in the dark, but then I guess in my mind it helps keep you honest. I know last year while hunting I was waiting for a deer to come through the woods and kept checking my sights. When I finally decided it was to dark to ethically take a shot, I looked at the time and it was about 5 min. after legal shooting time had ended. If I would have had a scope I would have been real tempted to wait out there a couple more minutes.
What I'm getting at is if you can use a scope, I think you're best off to use one. If you can't, why not get the best irons you can?
 
The peep is a far better choice. I've used several types, including a tang mount and a globe front sight. This setup was great at the range, but much too slow in the woods. I now use the Lyman 57 with micrometer click adjustments on a couple of rifles. One has an ivory bead and the other uses a fibre optic front. In poor light, I just unscrew the rear sight insert and use the "ghost ring". Just look through the peep as your eye will automatically center the front sight. In my case, group size is cut in half with the peep versus irons. With a TC Hawken flintlock, shooting a 370 grain bullet over 90 grains of Swiss FFFg, I can shoot 2" all day at 100 yards.
 
Which is better .... impossible to answer. I have both kinds of sights. For iron sights I am the first to admit I DO NOT like the Thompson Center fat sights found on Renegades and some of the Hawken Rifles. Now the Buckhorn style or primitive sights on some of my rifles I find very effective for shooting.

Peep sights are good sights. On a good day and in the land of no shadows, I can and have shot some impressive groups off the various peep sights I have and do have. But I hunt marshes. Areas with deep shadows. Especially in the waning afternoon sun down hours when shadows seem to close in on me. There I found the peep a disadvantage and did on occasion refuse to take a shot do to the inability in my head to say, yes that is the sight picture I want. Hard line peep sight shooters say, take the aperture out of the sight. Shoot it out of a ghost ring. All fine and good but to me that is a sure nightmare of lost sight parts. That is just my luck.

Fiber Optics are a good choice but I find on some models they can get fat and thick sights too where the sights take up too much of what I want to focus on. So I suggest you look at the different sights and find the one that appeals to you. Use it. Practice with it. And stick with it.
 
I think I have the best of both worlds. I have a Williams rear sight and a small (fine bead) front fiberoptic sight. I center it in the peep and use a a 6 o'clock hold on the top of the front fiberoptic bead.

That said, I know a guy who uses a rear peep and a front iron sight filled down to a small triangular point at the top. He then puts the tip of the front sight on the bullseye.

I tried the globe with the fine cross hair but just couldn't see it well enough in deep shade or at dusk.
 
After shooting this morning, I've decided that the fiber optics have got to go. Way too much inconsistency in the accuracy dept for me even at 50 yds and I'm not even convinced my load testing is reliable using the fiber optic open sights. So, what I've decided is that I need a peep at minimum. I also would like to get a smaller front fiber optic as the stock one is already obscuring my target, even at 50 yds. Although I won't be able to use a scope in ID, I'm seriously considering going with a set-up where I can use a scope for load testing and development and also keep it on hand for states that allow a scope. Once I'm confident I have a suitable load, then I can start practicing with the peep and a variety of front sights to see what I like best. Here's the problem though, does Williams make a peep that mounts on a Weaver rail or does anyone know of a set-up where I can use a scope and peep interchangeably?
 
Dave C said:
After shooting this morning, I've decided that the fiber optics have got to go. Way too much inconsistency in the accuracy dept for me even at 50 yds and I'm not even convinced my load testing is reliable using the fiber optic open sights. So, what I've decided is that I need a peep at minimum. I also would like to get a smaller front fiber optic as the stock one is already obscuring my target, even at 50 yds. Although I won't be able to use a scope in ID, I'm seriously considering going with a set-up where I can use a scope for load testing and development and also keep it on hand for states that allow a scope. Once I'm confident I have a suitable load, then I can start practicing with the peep and a variety of front sights to see what I like best. Here's the problem though, does Williams make a peep that mounts on a Weaver rail or does anyone know of a set-up where I can use a scope and peep interchangeably?

You might look at this setup...





This is a NECG - Weaver peep sight that I use on my Ultra Lite..

On the front I switched the factory to a Williams Streamlined Ramp with 'Fiber optic and a Williams Fire Sight Hood.



I know you are not fond of the fire sight but for myself it really works well - but I have adapted to using a 6 o'clock hole so the size of the fiber is not relevant. Since the point of impact is above the fiber.

Really the best thing for me about this setup is that when you look down through the sights it appears that you are looking through a 1X scope.



So basically you are using example 'H'

And then whenever... with the twist of a few screws and a couple levers the NECG comes off and the scope goes on...

 
Sabotloader,
I think that's the route I'm gonna have to go. Would prefer a Williams peep but I imagine the NECG will work fine. What brand of bases and rings are those? Can't tell from the pic. Do the rings have a quick-release lever?
 
Dave C said:
Sabotloader,
I think that's the route I'm gonna have to go. Would prefer a Williams peep but I imagine the NECG will work fine. What brand of bases and rings are those? Can't tell from the pic. Do the rings have a quick-release lever?

I would agree with you that the Williams peep might be more desirable just because of the 1/4 min clicks that you and I are use to. Also Lyman makes a great peep with quick adjust release for elevation. I do not recall what rifle you are shooting, but the Williams FP is offered for many different rifles. he Lyman to a lesser degree. As far as I know neither of these two sites have the ability to match up with a Weaver base.



You could call Williams and then ext #228 to speak to Steve - he is the resident expert on Williams products and a good guy to talk to.

Bases the base you see are Warne Maximas, also Leupold now contracts for this same base and sells them as QRW rings. The thing I like about these bases is they are steel and they are LOW to the barrel. I normally use the Warne Quick Release Rings (medium height) and again Leupold offers a good QRW Ring set - but personally I have not used them.

Warne Rings

41rM17VTPAL._AA160_.jpg


Leupold QRW Rings

31UX%2BicrNQL._AA160_.jpg
 
I'm shooting a Knight Disc Extreme and saw the Williams FP's but I don't think I'd be able to do that along with a Weaver rail. I thought I might be able to sneak one on in front of the rail rather than mounting to it but it doesn't look like that will work.
 
Dave C said:
I'm shooting a Knight Disc Extreme and saw the Williams FP's but I don't think I'd be able to do that along with a Weaver rail. I thought I might be able to sneak one on in front of the rail rather than mounting to it but it doesn't look like that will work.

They do have a peep on a rail - with the peep at the back of the rail. It is called a Williams 'Ace in the Hole"

336RailA2.jpg


Not sure if they have to fit a DISC but again Steve @ Williams would know for sure. But then again a gun smith or machinist could probably make it work.
 

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