Lehigh/Bloodline 50x325 Shoot

Today was a beautiful day and an excellent dat to get some recreational shooting in. Plus - I have located another place to shoot just a few miles from home. A fellow ML hunter just bought 300 acres just south of me and said I could shoot there most anytime I wanted. I drove out there with him yesterday to check the location out and today I decided to give the Pope Farm a shot or two.

On a couple of the forum the Lehigh/Bloodline .50x325 grain bullet has become a hot topic. I have been shooting this bullet for several months now and yesterday when I went to look for ballistic information on the bullet I was surprised that I did not have any. Today's mission was to shoot the bullet across a chronograph to get the actual information.

Took my Knight Western Ultra-Lite with a NECG Peep sight and loaded up all the equipment and headed to Pope's. This is the rifle and I think you will be able to see the sight setup.



This is a better picture of the sight mounted on a Warne Weaver scope base



Got to the farm and setup the portable shooting bench and Chrono - Placed the target at 50 yards.



Then setup my tailgate work area.



This is the a pic of the bullet loading process - powder dropped down the bore - MMP Sub-base inserted and bullet ready to be pushed down the bore. It has been slightly knurled gain a better grip on the bore.



The objective today was to shoot 3 shot groups of T7-2f and T7-3f. Shooting both 110 and 120 grains of each powder.

This is the target that was shot - I can not or did not identify what shots were what. I as just loading and shooting. This is the target and the information I collected.



And this is the ballistic sheet generated by the information. I do not really know the actual BC of the bullet until Grouse shoots the bullets across a 100 yards with a Chrono at the muzzle and one @ 100 yards just before the target. When he gets this information I will be able to get the shoot BC at his elevation.

The BC that I used was calculated by the Barnes calculator using the general information of the bullet. Diameter - weight - shape. I chose the flat base with round or flat nose. This normally generates the lowest BC possible for that particular bullet.

This is the ballistic sheet generated... Note that this was generated using my elevation - todays temp - open sights and a 6" PBR.

Great velocities!

Was the 110gr T7 2f test repeated, or is there a typo meant to say 3f?

Butcher45 said:

Great velocities!

Was the 110gr T7 2f test repeated, or is there a typo meant to say 3f?

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shoot - typo - Got it corrected - thanks

Very nice report SL. Just might have to try those in my UL...

Lookin very good!!!

Grouse said:

Lookin very good!!!

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Tom you know what I forgor to do... I should have shot some shot cards (Veggie cards) with bullets through the the chrono to compare the velocities with sub-base velocities. Guess I need to go back again this week and get that done.

Always looking for legitimate reason to shoot Dave`s bullets...

Sabotloader, any idea why 2f is faster? I thought 3f was supposed to be a little hotter due to the smaller grain size.

Dutch said:

Sabotloader, any idea why 2f is faster? I thought 3f was supposed to be a little hotter due to the smaller grain size.

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I was wondering the same. The bottle even states higher velocities with 777 fff. That's why it's best to have a Chrono.

Dutch said:

Sabotloader, any idea why 2f is faster? I thought 3f was supposed to be a little hotter due to the smaller grain size.

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Because t7-3f burns so much faster than does the larger granule 2f - T7-3f reaches peak pressure sooner than does 2f and in the normal weight bullets and smaller caliber rifles it will create greater velocities than does 2f.

In this case in a 50 cal - 3f burns so fast and with that heavier bullet it is not even out of the barrel before the pressure curve is dying... The larger granules of 2f burn a little longer so it ends up with more sustained pressure.

sabotloader said:

Dutch said:

Sabotloader, any idea why 2f is faster? I thought 3f was supposed to be a little hotter due to the smaller grain size.

Click to expand...

Because t7-3f burns so much faster than does the larger granule 2f - T7-3f reaches peak pressure sooner than does 2f and in the normal weight bullets and smaller caliber rifles it will create greater velocities than does 2f.

In this case in a 50 cal - 3f burns so fast and with that heavier bullet it is not even out of the barrel before the pressure curve is dying... The larger granules of 2f burn a little longer so it ends up with more sustained pressure.

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As Paul Harvey would say, "now you know the rest of the story!" Thanks Sabotloader.

What is the benefit of using a sub-base instead of a Sabot?

Or perhaps due to regulations some folks can not use sabots so they use a sub-base?

clarktar said:

What is the benefit of using a sub-base instead of a Sabot?

Or perhaps due to regulations some folks can not use sabots so they use a sub-base?

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Colorado and Oregon require full bore bullets during ML season. Idaho does also but it has to be full bore lead conical.

That bullet has some impressive numbers! And would sure lay the smack down on what it hits with that design. Good shooting and excellent report (as always).

With that open sight ... how far would you push a shot Mike? I mean what distance would you feel comfortable to shoot out to? I know some of the guys are doing amazing long distance shooting with their rifles.

Interesting.

Do you think the brass bullet obtutrates to the lands and groves or does it ride them down when loaded?

cayuga said:

That bullet has some impressive numbers! And would sure lay the smack down on what it hits with that design. Good shooting and excellent report (as always).

With that open sight ... how far would you push a shot Mike? I mean what distance would you feel comfortable to shoot out to? I know some of the guys are doing amazing long distance shooting with their rifles.

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Dave, I am not the best shot in the world with open sights - so in my mind I am limiting myself 150-175 yards - IF - all things are right - wind - rifle rest - animal movement. Shooting a 3" clay pigeon at a 100 of rests is no problem. Hitting a paper plate at 175 off rest - no problem. Shooting an animal takes a little more thought and concentration on my part.

LarryBud said:

Interesting.

Do you think the brass bullet obtutrates to the lands and groves or does it ride them down when loaded?

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I am really not counting on it and I guess I highly doubt it... but you would really be surprised how little contact with the lands is need to get very good accuracy. Using either sub-base or an shot card is a must to hold the gas behind the bullet. Also I am shooting T7 so it make it that much easier to get a complete burn behind the sub-base or card.

Lehigh Dave had me do an internet search for Lutz Moller - he has long produces what is often referred to as a bore rider bullet. This is picture of a Moeller bore rider

couldn't agree more. That is an impressive bullet.

Mike, where do you believe the trade off between weight and velocity is at the point od efficiency. Where I hunt elk long shots are common, I do not shoot over 200 yds. but I have never been completely comfortable with any bullet.

Another option for Colorado and Oregon is the 338gr Powerbelt Platinum. That's one terrific performing conical.

Lee 9 said:

Mike, where do you believe the trade off between weight and velocity is at the point od efficiency. Where I hunt elk long shots are common, I do not shoot over 200 yds. but I have never been completely comfortable with any bullet.

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I think you have touched on real concern and I really can agree, I am also never really comfortable either. I really try to use and shoot the most efficient 'terminal' bullet I can. But the real difference still comes in the animal and the reaction the animal might have reacting to the shock of being hit.

Weight and velocity... so many ways to validate the use of each. For myself - I have chosen not so much by weight as I lean more to energy and what the projectile does within the confines of the animal.

I wrote this several years ago as my thoughts on what I consider a great hunting bullet. After doing some searching and using information from those searches - this was generated

The Hunting bullet should be the most lethal big game hunting bullet available. The bullet design should allow the bullet to penetrate 2” to 3”, through bone or tissue, before it starts to expand the petals. After the bullet starts to expand or shed it petals it should adversely affect all the surrounding internal organs. The combination between the expansion of the bullet and/or release of the petals and the creation of hydrostatic shock produces a massive wound cavity within the vital area (internal organs) that can be 13” to 15” long. I believe that in most case the bullet should pass through the body providing a secondary exit hole for blood and debris. This massive wound cavity results in the animal dropping fast since most go into shock after such a tremendous blow. Those animals that don’t go down immediately will soon succumb to blood pressure loss and/or organ failure producing a quick ethical kill. Using a bullet matching this description will normally result in an animal that goes down fast so you can enjoy the results of your hunt without having to track the wounded animal after the shot.


I really do not know if this answers the question or thought you proposed - I am hoping it leans that way.