DROPPING A WHITE TAIL AT 200 - 300 YARDS

donparadowski · May 12, 2017

I am shooting a TC Strike 50 cal. using 3 pellets of Pyrodex pushing out a 295 grain Power Belt Aerotip bullet. Anything under 125 yards and I have tight on target patterns. When I reach further, I experience so much drop that I have a hard time hitting the target. I keep my weapon clean throughout my shooting.

I am looking at using a lighter bullet with also a higher B.C. Any thoughts?

ENCORE50A · May 12, 2017

donparadowski said:
I am shooting a TC Strike 50 cal. using 3 pellets of Pyrodex pushing out a 295 grain Power Belt Aerotip bullet. Anything under 125 yards and I have tight on target patterns. When I reach further, I experience so much drop that I have a hard time hitting the target. I keep my weapon clean throughout my shooting.

I am looking at using a lighter bullet with also a higher B.C. Any thoughts?

I'd suggest two things for your rifle. One, dump the powerbelts. There are many other better bullets, most of them can be cheaper. They are not a good long range bullet.
Two, unless you must/want to remain with pellets, BH209 would be the better choice (w/regular 209 primers or magnum primers).
Me, I'd first try 110grs volume of BH209 and a Barnes 290gr T-EZ bullet combo.
Regardless, you will have drop. You need to learn use your scope turret for distant ranges.

rangerod · May 12, 2017

110 grns Black Horn 209, 300 grn Parker Ballistic Extreme, Harvester smooth short black sabot,Federal 209A primer. :yeah:

rangerod · May 12, 2017

rangerod said:
110 grns Black Horn 209, 300 grn Parker Ballistic Extreme, Harvester smooth short black sabot,Federal 209A primer. :yeah:

You could also try the 250 and 275 grn Parker.

1874sharpsshooter · May 12, 2017

Practice, practice and more practice once you find the right load .
PR Dead Centers, Scorpion pt golds , shockwaves and lead conical have all taken deer over 200 yards for me .
307 being the furthest.

wolfer · May 12, 2017

"Belted" bullets have a terrible ballistic coefficient. You need to use better bullets. Better bullets are not really much more expensive than belted in a pak. Going to saboted bullets will allow use of 45 cal bullets which will be better at range. Getting a smoker to shoot minute of deer at 300 is doable but you need to upgrade your powder too. The suggested Blackhorn 209 is best for your goal. You need to use bullets of no less than 250 grains to have the energy and velocity needed at 300. 275 grain to 325 grain bullets best at long range. Lots of powder and big bullets mean prepare for lots more recoil. Shooting at longer distance is not just lighter bullets. So you need Blackhorn powder, good 275 to 325 grain bullets and sabots that fit and hold up to higher pressures, and a good BDC or range adjustable scope. And practice! If you plan to shoot 300 you need to practice at 300!

Other than a better scope and more practice = yes even some more practice particularly at long range! Encore, rangerod and sharpshooter have it all laid out for you in their post and I concur with those recommendations. W

WV Hunter · May 12, 2017

Good advice given.
It can certainly be done, and many of the folks here have done it and/or do it regularly. Bottom line, ML bullets will drop a ton and in a hurry past 150. I know I couldn't make a killing shot at 300. A few of my guns are likely quite capable, but I am not practiced enough to be confident at longer distances. 150 is my max right now. I hope to someday (soon) be confident further, though I may never shoot one that far. Most of my kills end up being are 30-75yds.

Given the choice, I think I'd like a CDS dial for longer range, vs a BDC reticle. That is just my personal preference.

donparadowski · May 12, 2017

I have been looking at the 250 grn Parker Ballistic Extreme but I have never seen any pix of how they mushroom out after hitting something. I forgot to mention I installed a Zeiss Conquest 3x9x40 on my weapon. What sort of pressure and muzzle velocity can I expect using 110 grns Black Horn 209? I have no problem switching powder.

Where I hunt, I am in a tree stand on the corner of a 260-yard-long ploughed field full of both beets and corn. The deer like coming out the other end and if I have to shoot to the far corner I would be shooting the 300 yards. Only occasionally does a deer come out of cover on my end of the field. I have gotten quite good “talking deer” to get them to come close.

I shoot at the 200-yard range at the Detroit Sportsmen's Congress. I have lots to time to practice, practice, practice, and I do. What gets me about the Ballistic Extreme bullets is the range of BC:

• 250 gr B.C.= .267
• 275 gr B.C.= .296
• 300 gr B.C.= .324

The 250 gr. Is only a little better B.C than I am shooting now. If anyone of you live in South East Michigan and would like to join me at the D.S.C. range, let me know and we can meet up. And then there is the selection of Sabots.

ronlaughlin · May 12, 2017

NOTE:--B.C. @ 2850 fps...............from Parker website

Parker BC are extremely optimistic considering a muzzle loader will shoot the bullets at far far less than 2850. When shooting the 300 grain ballistic extreme bullets, the ballistic calculations i tried to use for dialing the elevation, only started matching real life when i input about 0.240 for the BC. The 0.324 is a way way too much. The Hornady published Ballistic Coefficient for the 300g XTP, is 0.180; for me this actually matches real life.

My guess is the 250 BE would mushroom nicely on deer at 200 yard, assuming plenty of powder like 110g Blackhorn. Muzzle velocity should be around 1950 fps. The actual BC for the 250g Parker will probably be near 0.210.............just guessing.

For shooting out to 300 yard, you need a range finder to help with the aim. Me, i range the critter, then dial the needed moa on the elevation dial.

52Bore · May 12, 2017

donparadowski said:
I am shooting a TC Strike 50 cal. using 3 pellets of Pyrodex pushing out a 295 grain Power Belt Aerotip bullet. Anything under 125 yards and I have tight on target patterns. When I reach further, I experience so much drop that I have a hard time hitting the target. I keep my weapon clean throughout my shooting.
I am looking at using a lighter bullet with also a higher B.C. Any thoughts?

I tell people all the time, when in doubt - go heavier. Gravity has the effect on all bullets, with a 100yd zero, you will only get 10 more yards using the same powder charge and 50gr lighter bullet - then you have to start doing something...
We've gone over BC on this site, it seems published BC is a lot of BS (some a lot worse than others) - do your own testing.
Just practice, practice, practice as many have stated.

donparadowski · May 12, 2017

I understand. My 35 Remington 141 shooting a 200 gr. bullet has a B.C of .192 and at 300 yards, I would think carefully and take the shot. Using my Remington 7.62 shooting the same profile bullet (blunt Core-Lokt ) of .248...I'd take careful aim and drop the deer in his tracks. These weapons are not anywhere near 2800 f/s and they get the job done well. I see my problem as getting the right ammo and bullet combination. Yes before you ask, I do practice, practice, practice. I believe when it comes to accurate shooting more is better than less.

rangerod · May 13, 2017

donparadowski said:
I have been looking at the 250 grn Parker Ballistic Extreme but I have never seen any pix of how they mushroom out after hitting something. I forgot to mention I installed a Zeiss Conquest 3x9x40 on my weapon. What sort of pressure and muzzle velocity can I expect using 110 grns Black Horn 209? I have no problem switching powder.

Where I hunt, I am in a tree stand on the corner of a 260-yard-long ploughed field full of both beets and corn. The deer like coming out the other end and if I have to shoot to the far corner I would be shooting the 300 yards. Only occasionally does a deer come out of cover on my end of the field. I have gotten quite good “talking deer” to get them to come close.

I shoot at the 200-yard range at the Detroit Sportsmen's Congress. I have lots to time to practice, practice, practice, and I do. What gets me about the Ballistic Extreme bullets is the range of BC:

• 250 gr B.C.= .267
• 275 gr B.C.= .296
• 300 gr B.C.= .324

The 250 gr. Is only a little better B.C than I am shooting now. If anyone of you live in South East Michigan and would like to join me at the D.S.C. range, let me know and we can meet up. And then there is the selection of Sabots.

I would start with a Harvester crush rib. If loose try the smooth short.

LarryBud · May 13, 2017

I think a better option would be to move your tree stand to the middle of the 260 yard field. Then, you have a < 130 yard shot either way!

While 200 yards and up can and has been done. It's the real hard core shooters that can do it consistently. Just my my thoughts.

BuckDoeHunter · May 13, 2017

ENCORE50A said:
unless you must/want to remain with pellets, BH209 would be the better choice (w/regular 209 primers or magnum primers).
Me, I'd first try 110grs volume of BH209 and a Barnes 290gr T-EZ bullet combo.

That's a great combo and would be my first choice if they shoot good.

ENCORE50A · May 13, 2017

donparadowski said:
...............Where I hunt, I am in a tree stand on the corner of a 260-yard-long ploughed field full of both beets and corn. The deer like coming out the other end and if I have to shoot to the far corner I would be shooting the 300 yards. Only occasionally does a deer come out of cover on my end of the field. I have gotten quite good “talking deer” to get them to come close.
I shoot at the 200-yard range at the Detroit Sportsmen's Congress. I have lots to time to practice, practice, practice, and I do.......

Regardless of your rifle and load, you're at a disadvantage. Reason is, you're unable to practice beyond 200yds. Even if you have an accurate tight grouping 200yd rifle, taking hunting shots beyond your practice distance shouldn't be attempted. I know its very hard in MI to find a range that extends beyond 200yds. Those limited few that you can find, will be distant from you and most require a membership.

Giving an approximation as example only, if you send a 290 or 300gr bullet at 2,100fps and zeroed at 100yds, you'll have approximately 8 to 10" drop at 200yds, but beyond that the bullet will drop very quickly. At 300yds your bullet would be dropping approximately 35-40". Note: these are all approximate numbers.
This is why its IMPERATIVE to practice at the ranges you may plan on shooting while hunting. Once you settle on a bullet/charge that is accurate, you have to find a range that will allow you to practice at more distance range. As previously recommended, move your blind closer. Shooting to 200yds for highly practiced shooters isn't uncommon. However once you attempt to shoot 300yds, many things come into play and wind being a HUGE determining factor.

There is a public range, but quite west of you called the Shooter's Coral, which has a 300yd range. I'm fortunate that in Alpena they have a public 600yd range. I'd suggest you first get an accurate load for 200yds on your home range, then without question if you plan on taking hunting shots beyond that, find a range and practice, practice, practice at 300. If you ever vacation on the northeast side, send me a PM.

rangerod · May 13, 2017

LarryBud said:
I think a better option would be to move your tree stand to the middle of the 260 yard field. Then, you have a < 130 yard shot either way!

While 200 yards and up can and has been done. It's the real hard core shooters that can do it consistently. Just my my thoughts.

This being a good idea isn't always possible. Wind direction,lay of the land,getting in and out with out being detected can be problematic. I would rather stay put as opposed to ruining a good settup. If you choose the Parker 300 ballistic extreme you could practice with the Scorpion PT Gold. In my Redemption poi and group size is about the same.

1874sharpsshooter · May 13, 2017

rangerod said:
LarryBud said:

I think a better option would be to move your tree stand to the middle of the 260 yard field. Then, you have a < 130 yard shot either way!

While 200 yards and up can and has been done. It's the real hard core shooters that can do it consistently. Just my my thoughts.

Click to expand...

This being a good idea isn't always possible. Wind direction,lay of the land,getting in and out with out being detected can be problematic. I would rather stay put as opposed to ruining a good settup. If you choose the Parker 300 ballistic extreme you could practice with the Scorpion PT Gold. In my Redemption poi and group size is about the same.

260 gr Pt gold will take a deer at 300 , I can testify to that .

donparadowski · May 14, 2017

LarryBud said:
I think a better option would be to move your tree stand to the middle of the 260 yard field. Then, you have a < 130 yard shot either way!

While 200 yards and up can and has been done. It's the real hard core shooters that can do it consistently. Just my my thoughts.

Believe me I looked had into this idea. I would have to move a tree first. There is just not suitable tree in the middle...none. I hunt on State land and building one from scratch is prohibited. We are allowed to take advantage of any natural projection(s) trees included.

That is why I am going through all this fuss. If I could put a stand in the middle, I'd have it made. I wonder if I could use an orange colored Ghillie Suit(must have some sort of orange colored outer garment as required coloring by state law)?

donparadowski · May 14, 2017

ENCORE50A said:
donparadowski said:

...............Where I hunt, I am in a tree stand on the corner of a 260-yard-long ploughed field full of both beets and corn. The deer like coming out the other end and if I have to shoot to the far corner I would be shooting the 300 yards. Only occasionally does a deer come out of cover on my end of the field. I have gotten quite good “talking deer” to get them to come close.
I shoot at the 200-yard range at the Detroit Sportsmen's Congress. I have lots to time to practice, practice, practice, and I do.......

Click to expand...

Regardless of your rifle and load, you're at a disadvantage. Reason is, you're unable to practice beyond 200yds. Even if you have an accurate tight grouping 200yd rifle, taking hunting shots beyond your practice distance shouldn't be attempted. I know its very hard in MI to find a range that extends beyond 200yds. Those limited few that you can find, will be distant from you and most require a membership.

Giving an approximation as example only, if you send a 290 or 300gr bullet at 2,100fps and zeroed at 100yds, you'll have approximately 8 to 10" drop at 200yds, but beyond that the bullet will drop very quickly. At 300yds your bullet would be dropping approximately 35-40". Note: these are all approximate numbers.
This is why its IMPERATIVE to practice at the ranges you may plan on shooting while hunting. Once you settle on a bullet/charge that is accurate, you have to find a range that will allow you to practice at more distance range. As previously recommended, move your blind closer. Shooting to 200yds for highly practiced shooters isn't uncommon. However once you attempt to shoot 300yds, many things come into play and wind being a HUGE determining factor.

There is a public range, but quite west of you called the Shooter's Coral, which has a 300yd range. I'm fortunate that in Alpena they have a public 600yd range. I'd suggest you first get an accurate load for 200yds on your home range, then without question if you plan on taking hunting shots beyond that, find a range and practice, practice, practice at 300. If you ever vacation on the northeast side, send me a PM.

I will settle for an accurate load and pattern at 200 yards. Keep in mind the 260 is my max shot. Deer do come in my view at shorter ranges and I have gotten quite good at speaking deer in both sexes. I have called a buck in from the full 260 to almost shot gun range only to have him spooked by another hunger checking out all the noise I was making. So, accurate at 200 yards, I can do it, all I need is for my weapon to be capable of following my instructions. That is my master plan, to bring my weapon up to speed. At least I am getting a lot of range time in the search.

donparadowski · May 14, 2017

rangerod said:
LarryBud said:

I think a better option would be to move your tree stand to the middle of the 260 yard field. Then, you have a < 130 yard shot either way!

While 200 yards and up can and has been done. It's the real hard core shooters that can do it consistently. Just my my thoughts.

Click to expand...

This being a good idea isn't always possible. Wind direction,lay of the land,getting in and out with out being detected can be problematic. I would rather stay put as opposed to ruining a good settup. If you choose the Parker 300 ballistic extreme you could practice with the Scorpion PT Gold. In my Redemption poi and group size is about the same.

Does anyone have some ACCURATE info on how the Parker 250 & 300 ballistic extreme mushroom when they hit the deer?

DROPPING A WHITE TAIL AT 200 - 300 YARDS

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