thinking of getting into smokeless. what are my options?

what are the options out there to get into smokless muzzleloading? savages on gunbroker were going for higher prices than i thought! what othee options are out there? i dont want to do a major build/custom or spend a huge pile of money, but i would consider a pre made conversion that was assemble and go if sich a thing exists.

Arrowhead sporting goods

for a cheap entry level to SML..get a APex in 45\70 and have it converted to a SML with lukes plug...that is the cheapest way and its a great shooter...go to dougs message board which is a smokeless forum and look up Apex builds...its a nice light weight carry rifle for hunting also...

if you decide to go that way get ahold of Carlos at Ed's gun shop and see if he has any...and then if you go that way Like at Arrowhead sporting goods can do the conversion by adding his breech plug to it...it is the cheapest way to have a good SML that shoots great....

Ed's phone number ask for Carlos...1 910 692 7936 sat Al sent you..best price u will find unless used if you can find one used

Al

@Al53:

The sites you mentioned I am not knowledged of. Where are they located and how can I reach them?

I am also looking for a smokeless ML and the prices are so high. I am not cheap...But ouch! Has anyone heard of Smokeless Muzzleloading Inc., P.O. Box 712, Hartford City IN 47348? Their website is:

posting.php?mode=reply&f=14&t=27746

I would like something without having to mortgage my house.

@Al53:

Typo...http://www.smokelessmuzzleloading.com/index.html

Don
Try this one
www.smokelessmz.com

Don

you can convert most break actions with a 45-70 rifle barrel to smokeless capable. they are usually cheapest and lightest. or an older remington muzzleloader with a new barrel, and some upgrades.
Arrowhead sporting goods: http://www.smokelessmz.com/index.html

donparadowski said:

@Al53:

Typo...http://www.smokelessmuzzleloading.com/index.html

Click to expand...

SMI has gotten some really bad reviews in the last year or so. Poor CS, long wait times and lack of communication mostly.

Several others are doing similar conversions as SMI but with a larger selection of breach plug styles. Brux prefit 45cal Encore barrels are also now available from two vendors, Hankins Rifle and Smokelessmz. They are not cheap but IMO worth the cost if using the Encore platform.

CVA Apex and CVA Scout V2 conversions are going to be very hard to beat on cost. The Scout V2 is even offered with a removable muzzle brake.

i was not suggesting http://www.smokelessmuzzleloading.com/index.html..i was just using SML short for smokeless muzzle loader..lol...Luke at Arrowhead i think can do the conversion to a 45/70 CF barrel to fit his plug...that would be my first choice... http://www.smokelessmz.com/index.html

cheapest way id to get a CVA Apex 45/70 and just have the barrel converted to smokeless muzzleloader...


Also the site smokelessmuzzleloading,com has had some bad reviews..long waits..no communications..and also some poor work...

if you go to this forum http://dougsmessageboards.proboards.com/ it is dedicated to smokeless rifles...lots of info on what you want...

Actually the cheapest is the new CVA Scout V2 which should be out very very soon. The new 45/70 model comes with a removable muzzle brake and over $200 less (MSRP) than a Apex.



SKU: CR4806S
Price: $413.60
CR4806S Scout .45-70 Centerfire Stainless Steel/Black - 25” barrel with DEAD-ON Mount
1:20” Twist
5.8 lbs. Total Weight (not sure how accurate this is. Weight might be different according to caliber)

GM54-120 said:

Actually the cheapest is the new CVA Scout V2 which should be out very very soon. The new 45/70 model comes with a removable muzzle brake and over $200 less (MSRP) than a Apex.

SKU: CR4806S
Price: $413.60
CR4806S Scout .45-70 Centerfire Stainless Steel/Black - 25” barrel with DEAD-ON Mount
1:20” Twist
5.8 lbs. Total Weight (not sure how accurate this is. Weight might be different according to caliber)

Click to expand...

I still have my CVA APEX but sold the 45-70 SML Barrel, Luke does a great job with the conversion, the only downfall with the APEX is the forearm. The forearm is very flimsy so I BEDDED the whole forearm ( Filled all the voids in the forearm ) the .45, .50, 22-250 & 7mm-08 all shoot great now. Each barrel has it's own forearm also.
:yeah:

Im really tempted to get a Scout V2. Ive seen last years model sell for around $250 of GunBroker without the muzzle brake. Part #s are the same so if you want one with a brake you better double check that it has one.

I THINK Carlos was hinting he will be selling the new model in the $350 range but im not sure.

seems to me the difference between the Apex and Scout ..the Scout does not say it is a Bergerra barrel where as the Apex clearly states it is a Bergerra barrel....plus you can not change barrels on the Scout...So i think the Apex would be a better choice fpr me any ways as I can add barrels later on....and it is Accuracy Guaranteed....

Al

Barrels are the same blanks and made in the same factory on the same equipment. The so called "extra 5 step honing" process on the Bergara labeled ML barrels has not impressed me at all. My 45 Accura was smooth but land to land varied from end to end enough that it made sabotless loads a pain.

BTW the old Optima Elite CF barrels were labeled Bergara on them.

Is this legal for muzzlloader seasons?

mallardsx2 said:

Is this legal for muzzlloader seasons?

Click to expand...

It is in many states as long as it loads from the muzzle.

I use smokeless muzzleloader with Blackhorn powder regularly. Im in one of those small pocket overbearing anti ruled states. I cant hunt with smokeless here

Al-53 said:

for a cheap entry level to SML..get a APex in 45\70 and have it converted to a SML with lukes plug...that is the cheapest way and its a great shooter...go to dougs message board which is a smokeless forum and look up Apex builds...its a nice light weight carry rifle for hunting also...

if you decide to go that way get ahold of Carlos at Ed's gun shop and see if he has any...and then if you go that way Like at Arrowhead sporting goods can do the conversion by adding his breech plug to it...it is the cheapest way to have a good SML that shoots great....

Ed's phone number ask for Carlos...1 910 692 7936 sat Al sent you..best price u will find unless used if you can find one used

Al

Click to expand...

Al,
I am looking into this and also doing the same to an old British Enfield 308 (comes with a ramrod). In the meantime I picked up a TC Strike. I am going to have a Zeiss Conquest 3-9x40 scope mounted on it with a Weaver 163 base and Weaver 49220 pivot rings. This should tide me over until I can get into the smokeless world. I plan to use three 50 GR Pyrodex Pellets and 300 Gr bullet Shock Wave in the T/C Super Glide Sabot. I really could use some advise on my choice of propellant and bullet. This deer season there is a very reasonable chance that I will need to take out a deer in the 150 to 250 yard range.

Back to the APex in 45\70...Where can I get proper propellant and bullets for that weapon? All the pix I could see were not that good. The weapon looks like a breech loader. Yes? No? What would that conversion cost?

I would recommend blackhorn powder 110 grain by volume and Barnes290 Tez bullet and sabots
209 magnum primers.

Smokeless build
Arrowhead Sporting Goods and also Hankins Custom Rifle. Both are a wealth of knowledge .

bestill said:

I would recommend blackhorn powder 110 grain by volume and Barnes290 Tez bullet and sabots
209 magnum primers.

Smokeless build
Arrowhead Sporting Goods and also Hankins Custom Rifle. Both are a wealth of knowledge .

Click to expand...

Is not Blackhorn 209 NOT a smokeless powder?