White breech plug with replacement nipple

sabotloader said:

I used Tresco's for a long time but I would always drill the flash hole to .031. I do not shoot real BP and it needed to work with T7-2f. I found that the .028 could be a problem with T7-2f and really cold weather.

Click to expand...

the man just said he was able to shoot all three!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

toytruck said:

The Remington#11caps are a tad bigger than RWS caps. They go all the way on a white nipple/BP an fire on first strike.
My oldest son decided to ML hunt this year for first time. I had every thing set up, I thought. We hunted together the first day and had a problem getting the S91 .504 to fire when a doe was broadside. We tried the shot again an it fired. He killed two deer that evening after forcing the cap on the nipple.
I had left RWS caps in that cap loader an replaced them that evening with Remington caps. No more problems an two more dead deer by end of early ML season. He is hooked now on White!!

Click to expand...

Awesome !!! Very happy the 2 of you had a good time and got deer too !!!
Ive been useing cci #11 mags . They got a great blast but sure dont fit my nipple well . Im gonna pick some remimgtons up and try those . Our mz season opened today in Michigan (Dec 6---22 in zone 3 , the southern lower part) where i like to hunt that 2nd rut at . G--pa bullwinkle gets himself in trouble chaseing young 1 1/2 yr old does !!! Its the best !!! Nothing worse than haveing a gun that wont go boom then !!! Thanks again toytruck !!!!!!! I sure hope that 400gr bullet finds him runnin wild after the girls !!!

It is true I shot all three of the major powders that we shoot, but I did not shoot them in extreme cold weather. I hope that doesn’t make a difference with your 777-2F?

edmehlig said:

It is true I shot all three of the major powders that we shoot, but I did not shoot them in extreme cold weather. I hope that doesn’t make a difference with your 777-2F?

Click to expand...

If it doesnt fire Ed the cure is just .003 thou away !!! Really easy with letter/precision drills for carburetors .(motorcycles) Or get some T7 3f .

edmehlig said:

It is true I shot all three of the major powders that we shoot, but I did not shoot them in extreme cold weather. I hope that doesn’t make a difference with your 777-2F?

Click to expand...

try Musket nipple

45-70 said:

try Musket nipple

Click to expand...

Yep better yet . Excuse my brain warp please.......

Sideshow said:

Yep better yet . Excuse my brain warp please.......

Click to expand...

I would suggest you not go to a Musket nipple - the flash hole is the same size in most and the slits in the cap or even the fit of the musket cap on the nipple will not allow it to be water tight. With a #11 cap and the correct sized nipple post you can have a water tight breech.





Another thought is that Musket caps are hotter than #11caps. That is TRUE if you are shooting #11's. But, #11 MAG and RWS Dynamit Noblel 1075+ cap ARE hotter than the standard American Musket cap. That can not be said about the RWS Dynamit Nobel Musket cap.

Most American Musket caps have returned to Re-enactment type caps - such as these

https://outdoors.natchezss.com/bestsellers/Musket-Caps

And actually Lehigh offers a new #11 nipple that is built from S7 Impact resistant Tool Steel which is almost indestructible! Check out the 'hardening numbers' on this.

https://sskfirearms.lehighdefense.com/all-products?product_id=278

45-70 said:

the man just said he was able to shoot all three!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Click to expand...

Might re-read Ed's post he said T7-3f which is easier to ignite than T7-2f

As I’ve said many times, the ONLY Benefit i see to Musket Caps is their “Ease of Handling” in my hands on experience with them, they are NOT ANY Hotter than the RWS 1075 PLUS No. 11s, and CCi Magnum No. 11s, In fact my Musket Caps sound Weaker to me, Quite noticeably, and mine are NOT the Cheap Re-enactor Caps

These are my Musket Caps, I have 2 Cans of these. I would take my RWS 1075 Plus No. 11s, or CCi Magnum No. 11s over these RWS 1081 Musket Caps ANY OLE Day!!

toytruck said:

Should fit all of White rifles they take the same plug. Shotguns are different due to larger size bore.

Click to expand...

I have two different plugs in my Whites. One is 5/16 across the flats, the other 3/8 and the portion the nipple fits on us much longer on one of them, don’t recall which ones are which. I have two .504 Whitetails, 2 .504 Super 91’s and one .451 Super 91

The initial plug that White sold had a wide bowl as at the time everyone used loose powder. The newer version had thicker walls. This version was created to accommodate those who wanted to shoot Pellets as well as loose powder. The narrow hole kept the pellets aligned and all of the powder directly under the bullet. Other than that the outer dimensions are the same.

Here a picture of what I was trying to describe. These were a couple of the breech plugs I donated to the cause.

sdporter said:

I have two different plugs in my Whites. One is 5/16 across the flats, the other 3/8 and the portion the nipple fits on us much longer on one of them, don’t recall which ones are which. I have two .504 Whitetails, 2 .504 Super 91’s and one .451 Super 91

Click to expand...

Oops make that three different ones. These are both 3/8” across the flats. One of my others is 5/16”. The one on the right came from my .451 S91 serial # 1130 ish (laminate stock) the one on the left from my .504 S91 serial # 640 ish (synthetic stock)

sdporter said:

Oops make that three different ones. These are both 3/8” across the flats. One of my others is 5/16”. The one on the right came from my .451 S91 serial # 1130 ish (laminate stock) the one on the left from my .504 S91 serial # 640 ish (synthetic stock)

Click to expand...

Boy thatll get a guy confused if your not payin enough attention and assembly line cleaning !!!!! Big differences !!!

Have you tried screwing them into one another to see if they fit. I see your Super91’s is of Doc’s first design.

edmehlig said:

Have you tried screwing them into one another to see if they fit. I see your Super91’s is of Doc’s first design.

Click to expand...

Ed, Do you see any Variances in your White Breech Plugs like sdporter Above?

The only thing I can tell from the picture is the height of the Hex nut and the nipple. I’m betting the one on the left with the taller nipple if from the first design of the Super 91. I’m sure the one on the right will work just fine in any of his White ML’s.

I gave Jeff 5 breechplugs that came from Whitetails, 3 other M97’s and 1 M98 that were built at different times to come up with the final prototype. They all looked the same and all were interchangeable in all of my White ML’s. I can only assume the one that looks different came from Doc’s original design of the Super91. Only Doc could possibly answer that question.

The threads are both 5/8x18. I haven’t crossed them from rifle to rifle. I gotta find the one that has the 5/16 head now. I think it’s on my other .504 S91 that I believe also has a serial # in the 600’s. It’s the twin to the one in the picture with the synthetic.

Okay so I found the rifle, too lazy to pull the plug out to show the comparison, it looks identical to the plug on the left in the previous pictures with the exception that the hex is 5/16”.
I would feel more comfortable with the mods to those two plugs than to the one on the right. An extra turn and a half on the threads in the breech would make ME feel better.
I’m sure it’s plenty strong enough. That’s just the “the worst is gonna happen” part of my psyche kicking in.
BTW the serial # on that gun is either less than 350 or 550 I can’t quite make out the stamp on the first number. The barrel is etched “White Armstech” I think it’s the only one I have that says that. I believe all the others say “White Muzzleloading Systems.”