.451bullet size help

[Browndogz]

I am hoping I can assist with a challenge I am having. I have a .451 an "early" whitetail (sub 1400 SN) that I picked up hoping my son would enjoy BP. But I am having a heck of a time getting bullets to slip fit. I bought bullets from Ed Mehlig and they are too tight, (they are beautiful bullets). Ed said his grandson also has an early gun that is tight so he downsized some bullets and sent them my way, they are also tight. I then bought some 460gr from Steve as the individual I bought the gun from said that is what he used to shoot and they are tight but not as tight.

Ed asked if I could send him a pic and then a bullet that he kindly measured and replied " measured your bullet and I’m kinda confused. The bands measured from 447.5 - 451. The bullet did not look like it was damaged in shipping in any way. I’m almost inclined to say you may need to order a .449 or .450 sizing die in order for the bullets To fit properly"

I guess I am confused as this sounds like a unique situation, my bullets 460gr are heavily engraved and when loading Ed's I fear breaking the ram rod. I now have 350 .451 bullets that I can't use. Before I buy a sizing die and everything to size I thought I would ask the forum for guidance.

I guess I could store the bullets next to my NIB .45 GM LRH for my Renegade.

Any thoughts? I guess at least I have time before next season to figure this out.

 

[Idaholewis]

You have an exceptionally tight bore, if i were in this situation i would get a .446, Try that, If to loose, Slowly open the Die until you get Desired fit, VERY VERY Simple procedure!! :yeah:

This is a Video i done that describes what you need to do, This is for Paper Patch, but the Same applies to a Grease Groove

[youtube]XfO7br0cbEc[/youtube]

 

[toytruck]

Those .451 bullets of Ed's should work very well in your .45 GM LRH Renegade barrel from what I have read an have seen some impressive targets. I also have the same Renegade barrel, but haven't shot it yet. Probably will just be a range gun as its heavy to carry around an I prefer a scoped barrel.

If you decide to let them go let me know, if the price is right! :yeah:

 

[Idaholewis]

Again, This is EXTREMELY Simple to do. I have done at least 2 of these for Forum member Harleysboss, and 8-10 of them for myself. Here is what you need https://leeprecision.com/custom-lube-and-size-kit/

Lee Custom Push Through Sizer’s are 38 bucks, I cannot imagine your Bore being under .448-449? I think a .447 would be a Safe bet, You are better off to get your Sizer just slightly under your Bore Diameter (Bullets will fit to loose) So you can Open the Die Slowly and get a Custom Bullet fit to your Bore. There is a very small portion inside the Sizing die that actually sizes the Bullet, (Sizing Ring) i would say 1/4” or so is all, The rest of the inside is open, The procedure to open the die just takes a Few minutes, it took me longer to type this than to do the Job. If you are on the Castboolits forum look up Member “Buckshot” (Rick Tunnel) He makes Custom Push Through Bullet Sizers, he even sends a Sized and measured Slug with his Die. Same price as Lee I believe? I have bought a few Sizers from Rick, Good Honest Guy

 

[edmehlig]

Did you order the sample pack from NoExcuses? He may be able to send you some sized smaller?

 

[Idaholewis]

I have a .449, PM me your address and i can send you a bullet to test fit.

Ed’s Bullets measure SPOT on .452 for me, i have a few of these Left so i just measured another to confirm. Hey Ed, do you have a .451, and a .452 Sizer? It is EXTREMELY rare to get a Lee sizer that is Spot on, I have seen a 452 actually be a .453 etc. etc. On the other hand if you order a Push Thru Sizer from “Buckshot” (Rick Tunnel) on Castboolits it will be EXACTLY what you want it to be. I prefer to get a Die just under Bore by .001-.002 And slowly open it, I prefer to Customize bullet Fit per Gun.

 

[edmehlig]

Lew, I do have a 451 sizing die and I sent him a few to try but they still were too big for his rifle and were badly engraved with the lands and grove marks? I think Dave and NoEXcuses offered to send him a sample pack, but if my memory doesn't fail me I think the smallest sizing die Dave had was a .450 die? But needs to be confirmed.

 

[GM54-120]

Any idea how much BuckShot wants for a .450 sizer?

NOE sells a sizer with bushing you can swap for multiple sizes in .001 increments. They are about $40 plus $10 per bushing and $8 per push rod
http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=104

 

[Idaholewis]

Any idea how much BuckShot wants for a .450 sizer?

NOE sells a sizer with bushing you can swap for multiple sizes in .001 increments. They are about $40 plus $10 per bushing and $8 per push rod
http://noebulletmolds.com/NV/index.php?cPath=104

Buckshot was close to a Lee Custom, seems like i paid 40-45 Total including Shipping (Lee is 38 bucks for a Custom) Lee’s Shipping cost is ridiculous! USPS Priority MailTM - Please allow up to 7 business days for delivery. ($12.45) So with Shipping a Lee Custom Push Thru Sizer is 50.45, which is RIDICULOUS imo! And the chances that you will get a Perfect True diameter from Lee isn’t that Great in my experience. I ordered a .448 and a .498 From Buckshot and they were DEAD ON, With Proof Slugs

I looked VERY SERIOUSLY in to the NOE Setup Long ago, and i would have went that Route, but back then they didn’t have much of a Body Bushing Size Selection (Not sure they do now?) They had mostly Nose Bushing sizes (To full size Conicals like we do, you need Body Bushings) I spoke with NOE and he Told me they would start working on more Body Bushings. I have little patience on waiting, therefore i ended up with a BUNCH of Lee Sizers, Most of them i have polished out Myself. I learned to order Customs undersized by .001-.002 So i could open them myself if Lee was Off? 9 out of 10 were off, Pretty Sad that a Guy needs to try and out think a Co. :lol:

 

[GM54-120]

Yeah, i need a .450 and it absolutely cant be a .4505. I need one for jacketed resizing and a .4505 Parker will not go down either of my 45s without a hammer. A .4495 bullet goes down with 1 finger on the rod so im stuck with under sizing and knurling up atm.

Lead is no problem at .451 or .452 with a .450 land to land. I can load either without a short starter and they seem to stay put on the powder.

 

[Idaholewis]

Yeah, i need a .450 and it absolutely cant be a .4505. I need one for jacketed resizing and a .4505 Parker will not go down either of my 45s without a hammer. A .4495 bullet goes down with 1 finger on the rod so im stuck with under sizing and knurling up atm.

Lead is no problem at .451 or .452 with a .450 land to land. I can load either without a short starter and they seem to stay put on the powder.

I hear ya! Lot of folks don’t realize just how critical .001 can be when Loading, it makes a HUGE difference

 

[Browndogz]

Thanks for the replies, I ended up having to fly to Portland this morning and picked up a truck/car as mine got totaled when a tree crushed my beloved Land Cruiser . I now have a replacement but am flying to AZ in the early am and need to pack for the trip. I really am looking forward to reading these posts.

 

[edmehlig]

Browndogz, what are you looking for exactly as far as tightness. Are you looking for a slip fit where the bullet will go down the bore with the tip of your finger, with some slight resistance, or a little more resistance? I personally would not recommend a true slip fit for hunting as I've had the bullet almost fall out of my bbl one time while hunting. Found it halfway sticking out of my bore. (No I did not fowl my bore in my early days shooting a White. I don't fowl my bores today. Instead, I fire 2-3 caps to ensure the breach plug is clear and any trace of oil is burnt out. Then I load a bullet that goes down with a slight resistance all the way down my bore.

 

[edmehlig]

Browndogz, what are you looking for exactly as far as tightness. Are you looking for a slip fit where the bullet will go down the bore with the tip of your finger, with some slight resistance, or a little more resistance? I personally would not recommend a true slip fit for hunting as I've had the bullet almost fall out of my bbl one time while hunting. Found it halfway sticking out of my bore. (No I did not fowl my bore in my early days shooting a White. I don't fowl my bores today. Instead, I fire 2-3 caps to ensure the breach plug is clear and any trace of oil is burnt out. Then I load a bullet that goes down with a slight resistance all the way down my bore.

 

[Idaholewis]

Something i, and others don’t really think about, is not everyone has a Reloading press, Them Guy’s need to buy bullets the correct size (Makes it nice when outfits like “No Excuses” offers a Sizing pack)

By trying bore fit with 1 of my .449s it will give you a darn good idea of what size you need? Since Ed’s soft lead .451 is to tight but you were able to get it down, i am thinking .449 should be the ticket in your bore? .001 can make a BIG difference in Loading, especially in my Case where i use, and Swear by 1-40 Alloy. Soft lead such as Ed uses shouldn’t be that difficult/Critical Loading, Soft lead gives up fairly easy going down a Bore

I just ran the bullet in the Photo post above through my .449, I can send this to you if you like? Since this is the Same Soft lead bullet like what you already have this will be the right way to check fit, Instead of sending you 1 of my 1-40 Alloy Bullets sized to .449 Which will load Harder

 

[reelamin]

Sorry I'm late on this. Found it while searching another topic, and while I'm at it what sizing lube are you using. I'm using Imperial Wax...just wondering if there is something better. I am new to this sizing/full bore thing too. Needless to say I have a NOE kit and it ended up being not what I needed. Typical hoping to save a buck, and .001 is too much adjustment for my rifle also. My suggestion...DONT MESS AROUND AND JUST GET A ADJUSTABLE SIZING DIE ASAP!! Yes, they are not cheap but they are what you need.

 

[Browndogz]

Thanks for the replies I got back in town, thank you for the replies.

Lewis, I agree this should be pretty easy, my challenge is just time. I travel a significant amount for work, then add some personal travel and time becomes precious. The Achillies this year didn't help time for my outdoor activities. Thanks for the offer I'll PM you.

Ed, no I didn't order the test pack, I expect I will end up sizing for the White, I will also have some bullets for the GM LRH.

Reel thanks for the suggesting it I will check out the adjustable dies.

I am hoping this year I will have the time to spend time shooting but I think that is overly optimistic. I am on pace for another 75-100K flight miles and 50-75 hotel nights

 

[Browndogz]

To the question from ed about how tight. Much of my hunting is via mountain bike I have a gun rack on the handle bars but the gun is constantly being jostled. So something tighter than the true slip fit as you experienced my greatest concern. Jump of the bike do to spotting an animal and the bullet has migrated off the powder. Sure it's easy to think just check it with the ram rod. I know myself well enough, that is too easily forgotten.

Additionally, in western washington it can get wet and I tape the muzzle during the late season and couldn't easily check. After I get close on size I can fine tune for the snug fit and test on bike looking for coyotes etc.

 

[edmehlig]

From what you stated I would contact Dave from NoExcuses and have him size some at 450 diameter. If he can size some also at 449 then you would know for sure.