54 renegade

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first and third pic are 70 gr ffg second and fourth are 50 gr,all at 50 yds. tC's didnt like 70 as much as 50. so what's the consenses on a sufficient powder charge for deer out to 100 yds. ? glass bedding did the trick, solid and stable now :lewis:
 

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Buffalo arms has powder and caps in stock. Their prices are kinda high but at least they have.
Dixie gun works also has caps in stock, no black powder.
50 grains is kinda light for a 54 cal. IMO, especially out to 100 yards.
Have you tried shooting a patched round ball?
 
Buffalo arms has powder and caps in stock. Their prices are kinda high but at least they have.
Dixie gun works also has caps in stock, no black powder.
50 grains is kinda light for a 54 cal. IMO, especially out to 100 yards.
Have you tried shooting a patched round ball?
thanx I'll try them. I've used round ball years ago. they worked but I'm thinking I like the idea of a heavier bullet. 60 grains is just a starting point . I 've used 90-110 before but that felt like a lot of power-overkill. so I'm curious about what guys experience with loads have been
 
thanx I'll try them. I've used round ball years ago. they worked but I'm thinking I like the idea of a heavier bullet. 60 grains is just a starting point . I 've used 90-110 before but that felt like a lot of power-overkill. so I'm curious about what guys experience with loads have been
I use 80-85 grains of OE 2F under a felt wad and a Lyman Plains (450 gr) ,lubed with Idaho Lewis's modified Nasa lube , works fine for me (deer hate it) . If your looking to try some (PM) me/Ed
 
Maybe you can check out the ancient ones of Maine.
They have a rendezvous coming up in October. A lot of times they have black powder supplies for sale.
 
Plenty of powder and caps here in Indiana if you can stomach the high prices. $10 per hundred for caps is plain robbery.
 
Glad to see your rifle shooting well :lewis: Is that .538 group from a Hornady Great Plains, or a Lyman Plains Home cast bullet? I see you have it written as Lyman, but you say “Great Plains” the Lyman is JUST “Plains” These 2 get mixed up from time to time, The Lyman is a “Plains” Flat Base Bullet that you have to Cast, they are not a Commercially available Bullet, The Hornady is a “Great Plains” Hollow Base bullet that you can buy. The Hornady Great Plains in .54 Cal is hard to come by these days as they stopped Production of the .54s sometime back, you see old stock pop up now and then, You can stil get the Hornady Great Plains in .50 Cal
 
Glad to see your rifle shooting well :lewis: Is that .538 group from a Hornady Great Plains, or a Lyman Plains Home cast bullet? I see you have it written as Lyman, but you say “Great Plains” the Lyman is JUST “Plains” These 2 get mixed up from time to time, The Lyman is a “Plains” Flat Base Bullet that you have to Cast, they are not a Commercially available Bullet, The Hornady is a “Great Plains” Hollow Base bullet that you can buy. The Hornady Great Plains in .54 Cal is hard to come by these days as they stopped Production of the .54s sometime back, you see old stock pop up now and then, You can stil get the Hornady Great Plains in .50 Cal
those are bullets I got from Dan at Bull Shop. I've got more ordered. the T/C bullets shot well also . I just happened across them. question: Dans bullets come pre lubed in all grooves-lotta lube ! should I try to clean out two of the grooves or leave it be ? thanx Mike
 
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those are bullets I got from Dan at Bull Shop. I've got more ordered. the T/C bullets shot well also . I just happened across them. question: Dans bullets come pre lubed in all grooves-lotta lube ! should I try to clean out two of the grooves or leave it be ? thanx Mike

Ok that makes sense now, Bullshop Dan is the only person I know offering the Lyman Plains :lewis:

If you are talking about a TC Maxi Ball? Then DEFINATELY remove the Lube from the Top Groove and Shoot a Group with ONLY the Bottom Groove Lubed. This was the ONLY way i was able to get good, repeatable results with the TC Maxi Ball, They are Lube PIGS, When they Exit the Bore the Excess lube trying to “Shed away” from the Bullet can cause an imbalance and KILL accuracy, Sort of like a Tire out of Balance, out of round Etc.

I SWEAR by Bullshop NASA Lube, and always have, But i prefer it thinned down some, It’s a Bit to thick for my liking the way it comes. A simple test you can do is try a Group of Bullets lubed with Crisco and see if you notice an accuracy improvement, Crisco is thin and kind of a Pain to deal with But this is just a Test to see if you can see an accuracy difference with a Thin Bullet lube.

If you do see an improvement with a Thin Lube, I advise you to follow my “Modified” Bullshop NASA Lube Recipe in the Casting section under “Bullet Lube Recipes”
 
All this talk about loads I had to get the .54 Renegade out. Seeing as how I can’t shoot sabots, I will just shoot round balls (230 grain). I know 1-48“ is not the best ratio for a round ball but there are exceptions. I only took four shots. One to dirty the barrel and three for effect, open sights off of the bench…
 

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People forget that a rate of twist approximately 1:48" was the most commonly used twist from the flintlock era right through the late percussion squirrel rifle era. Regardless of caliber, and regardless of barrel length.

So, any modern day shooter that thinks that a 1:48" rate of twist is a compromise, then they would be correct only in so far as shooting lead conical bullets is concerned; not when it comes to shooting patched balls.

Most conicals in the .45 caliber to .50 caliber range prefer a faster twist than 1:48".

Unless one is looking to shoot heavy for bore powder charges, than a 1:48" twist is more than enough for even a .62 caliber barrel out to 100 yards with 70-80 grains of fffg black powder. Been there, done that, got the T-shirt, so to speak.

Most modern muzzleloading barrel makers, to satisfy the Magnumitis craze that has taken hold of the firearms world since the introduction of the .357 Magnum revolver & cartridge to the present day; rifle anything for patched balls over a .40 caliber with 1:56" twist, or slower. Twists of 1:60", 1:66", and 1:72" are quite common for the .50 caliber, and larger bores.

The only compromise that Thompson/Center made with the original Hawken rifle was in trying to appeal to both patched ball shooters & conical shooters alike. The 0.005" deep grooves are a little too deep (0.001" to 0.0015") for the best conical shooting, and way too shallow (0.005" to 0.011") for the best patched ball shooting.

Just remember that the slower the rate of twist, the more black powder it is generally going to take to find a particular barrel's sweet spot. More powder under the patched ball, regardless of caliber, always means more recoil.

This is why I argued with Don Getz for a good 5 minutes on the phone back in the late 80's when I ordered the swamped octagon, .62 caliber, 1:48" twist, coned muzzle barrel for my last custom build. He wanted to sell me a barrel already in stock, ready to ship, with a much slower rate of twist. But, as I mentioned above in this post, a 1:48" twist is more than sufficient, and has been for over 200 years, to stabilize a big, heavy patched ball out to 100 yards with ease.

If one is shooting a Forsyth rifled barrel in .58 caliber, or larger, than really slow twists such as 1:96", 1:120", & 1:144" make a lot of sense.
 
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Back in my old days, I had a Renegade 54 caliber.
At the time, a patched round ball was the only legal projectile in my home state of Connecticut.
That was a sweet shooting rifle as I recall.
I owned money to a guy and he took the gun as payment. I sure regret that whole deal.
 
Back in my old days, I had a Renegade 54 caliber.
At the time, a patched round ball was the only legal projectile in my home state of Connecticut.
That was a sweet shooting rifle as I recall.
I owned money to a guy and he took the gun as payment. I sure regret that whole deal.
I've had this rifle since my Ct days- 35 years. and after reading your post I realized that all I shot back then was round ball and they were quite accurate. hmmmm
 
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