777 pellets vs. loose.

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I got out with the Optima V2 and shot about a dozen shots today. The most I have shot at once since purchasing it.

I do remember the breech plug needing cleaned every 2 or 3 shots when I first got the gun and using pellets.

Still burning through those pellets fought my way through cleaning the breech plug every other shot today, real pain.

Yes, I am using the 777 primers by Winchester.

My question is does the loose seem as bad at fouling breech plug and bore?

Federal B.O.R Lok bullets if that matters.

Maybe not sealing as tight causing more fouling in bore??

Currently soaking the 2" section where the pellets sit and then the barrel should be squeaky clean once again.

I do have 2 bottles of the 10 Oz BH209 and if I spend more time at the range having to clean w T7 than shooting I may bite the bullet and switch over to the BH.

At this point T7 in my Optima us just as hard or harder to clean than my Hawken .54 with black. Simple swab every 2 or 3 shots with black in the Hawken and 10 minutes with hot water and we are good to go.

Fire away w thoughts and suggestions.
 
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I just shot 4 shots from my Optima pistol. 240 Traditions HPs in black sabots on 2- 50/50 pellets. 50 yards, 3 shots were brand new and one shot was on three year old pellets that were just in a plastic box with a small desiccant packet. I had 1 flyer with new pellets but the old pellets grouped right with the other 2 shots in -2” group. Not a conclusive test but it did ok imho. I may get to try them against 80grV of bh209 if i dont freeze today.
 

RobRed

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What is making you clean the breach plug rather than just swabbing the barrel? Are you having misfires?

When shooting 777 I don’t pull the breach plug until final cleaning and I can get through 15 shots just by swabbing with water/alcohol mix between shots, the technique is one damp patch with short strokes to break up the crud ring followed by two dry patches then shoot.

I don’t use the triple 7 primers though.
 
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You are swabbing every shot?

My breech plug flash hole will be plugged after 3 shots for sure, been down that road with a misfire on 3rd or 4th shot, don't recall. Easier to remove and punch clear with a torch cleaner every other shot.

My "crud ring" is about 26" long, full bore fouled.

Let's just say I am less than impressed so far.

I can try a regular 209 primer but from my "reading" on the net the 777 fouls worse with a hotter primer.

Makes me wonder if a tighter fitting bullet/sabot would help with the fouling??
 
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Last week I did a fair amount of testing with a new Optima. While searching for the best combination of bullet and propellent I ran a wet patch down the barrel with TC 17 solvent after each shot, followed up with a dry patch. I sprayed some TC 17 bore cleaner in the breech plug every two shots. The TC 17 washed the fouling away right now. No having to let it sit. I used a toothbrush to clean the smaller end but it only took a couple of swipes. Considering the breech plug was pulled after each shot, it was easy to clean the rifle and the breech plug. I did, however, run a wire down the ignition hole in the breech plug every other time after spraying it down with TC 17. It only took a couple minutes to clean it.

In terms of different propellent......I shot with Hodgen 777 loose and pellets. I didn't notice any appreciable difference in fouling between the two.
 
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Last week I did a fair amount of testing with a new Optima. While searching for the best combination of bullet and propellent I ran a wet patch down the barrel with TC 17 solvent after each shot, followed up with a dry patch. I sprayed some TC 17 bore cleaner in the breech plug every two shots. The TC 17 washed the fouling away right now. No having to let it sit. I used a toothbrush to clean the smaller end but it only took a couple of swipes. Considering the breech plug was pulled after each shot, it was easy to clean the rifle and the breech plug. I did, however, run a wire down the ignition hole in the breech plug every other time after spraying it down with TC 17. It only took a couple minutes to clean it.

In terms of different propellent......I shot with Hodgen 777 loose and pellets. I didn't notice any appreciable difference in fouling between the two.
That is what I am trying to eliminate, I see no reason that I should have to pull the plug and clear the flash hole every 2 shots. That fouling is super hard after just 2 shots. Only reason I swab the bore every other shot is because I am already spending time jacking with the nearly plugged flash hole.

1 more minute won't kill me.

I just see 5 minutes to the shot a bit extreme.

My Hawken and real black is far easier to deal.with at the current time.
 
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What is making you clean the breach plug rather than just swabbing the barrel? Are you having misfires?

When shooting 777 I don’t pull the breach plug until final cleaning and I can get through 15 shots just by swabbing with water/alcohol mix between shots, the technique is one damp patch with short strokes to break up the crud ring followed by two dry patches then shoot.

I don’t use the triple 7 primers though.
That was not going to happen with the Optima I have been testing with 777. The breech plug ignition hole was, for the most part, plugged after the third shot. Thus I cleaned it every two shots.
 
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Wish I had taken pics of the front of breech plug after the 12 or so shots.

Looked like years of scale build up on a faucet.

My next range trip may find me using a regular 209 to see if a little hotter flame helps with the pellet burn.
 
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That is what I am trying to eliminate, I see no reason that I should have to pull the plug and clear the flash hole every 2 shots. That fouling is super hard after just 2 shots. Only reason I swab the bore every other shot is because I am already spending time jacking with the nearly plugged flash hole.

1more minute won't kill me.

I just see 5 minutes to the shot a bit extreme.

My Hawken and real black is far easier to deal.with at the current time.
I understand. Really I do. I was at a range where there was other shooters. It was time consuming to find the right recipe considering I often had to wait to check my target. Combine that with the cleaning after each shot and it was a very time consuming process.

This has been my first real time spent on an inline. I'm one of those sidelock fellas from way back. However, the more I shot and cleaned that rifle, the faster I got at it and the more I began to like it. I still prefer my trusty old smoke pole with black powder.
 
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Wish I had taken pics of the front of breech plug after the 12 or so shots.

Looked like years of scale build up on a faucet.

My next range trip may find me using a regular 209 to see if a little hotter flame helps with the pellet burn.

I can imagine how nasty the breech plug must have looked if it was not cleaned after every other shot.

Since the breech plug has to be pulled to clean the rifle, I suggest you try some of the TC 17 solvent on the breech plug. Its actually pretty fast to clean. No build up that way.

Just need to snap a primer before loading it.
 
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Since the breech plug has to be pulled to clean the rifle, I suggest you try some of the TC 17 solvent on the breech plug. Its actually pretty fast to clean. No build up that way.

Just need to snap a primer before loading it.
I did notice that. No getting a patch back up after you push it to the bottom. Had to pull the breech plug and push it back out.

I can load, shoot, swab and dry my Hawken much faster.

Easier clean up at this point for sure.

If this is how it is with 777 and an inline I am going back to a sidekick for sure.

So far its been kind of a joke in my opinion.

I can shoot 20+ shots from my Hawken with real black, get home, pull 1 barrel wedge, clean the bore, have barrel dried and back in the stock in 20 minutes. So far this 1 session has cost me 45 minutes and I am not done, had to get to work tonight.

May try the #13 as it used to work well for me. Should still have a bottle of it at the house.
 
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one of the advertised benefits of the bore loc is supposed to be the base cutting the crud ring out when fully seated on the powder/pellet .
but things don't always work exactly as advertised .

1671408700853.png

i don't think the BP shouldn't be getting clogged that fast even with 777
do you have/use a breech plug pick to clean the BP hole with ?
1671409837077.png
 
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I did notice that. No getting a patch back up after you push it to the bottom. Had to pull the breech plug and push it back out.

I can load, shoot, swab and dry my Hawken much faster.

Easier clean up at this point for sure.

If this is how it is with 777 and an inline I am going back to a sidekick for sure.

So far its been kind of a joke in my opinion.

I can shoot 20+ shots from my Hawken with real black, get home, pull 1 barrel wedge, clean the bore, have barrel dried and back in the stock in 20 minutes. So far this 1 session has cost me 45 minutes and I am not done, had to get to work tonight.

May try the #13 as it used to work well for me. Should still have a bottle of it at the house.

Well to be fair here, I know not how many shots can be done with the Optima before having to clean the barrel and still get a sabot down it. I was after the best load I could come up with for my son. Therefore I swabbed after every shot. I most likely would have done the same with my sidelocks minus the breech plug cleaning after every other shot.

I like #13 bore cleaner for black powder fouling. Been using the stuff for many years. However, I have not tried the TC 17 on black powder yet. All I know is its amazing on 777 fouling. The bottle I have was my dads before he passed so it is new to me.
 
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one of the advertised benefits of the bore loc is supposed to be the base cutting the crud ring out when fully seated on the powder/pellet .
but things don't always work exactly as advertised .

View attachment 28991

do you have/use a breech plug pick ?
You can hear it scraping when you seat a bullet. It doesn't get rid of all fouling but definitely gets rid of some. Probably eliminates the need to swab every other shot but with breech plug out anyway I just push a damp patch through followed by a dry patch.


No on the pick, I use a torch tip cleaner, same principle.
 
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I may give it a whirl. Just never had to swab between every shot, even with black.
With the BP Xpress I had, I was shooting over 5 ...... CASES ...... of T7 in the summer. Butch's will clean both BP and T7 like nobody's business.
I could shoot my BP Xpress 18 or 20 times with 180grs of T7, but swab with a slightly damp patch both sides, and NEVER a failure with T7.
I could clean the rifle SPOTLESS with just 5 patches. No way in help I can do 5 with BH209.
 
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wow , 180 grains !!! no way my arthritic shoulders could handle that .
i thought BH was supposed to be soooooo much cleaner to shoot and clean up compared to 777 powder .
 
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