Cartridge loading question

[Harleysboss]

I was attempting to load some 45-70 for my Shiloh Sharps. I have two different types of brass, Remington and Starline. Both batches have been fired once in my rifle. I have no other 45-70's. None of the fired brass was resized. I prepped everything and began my loading procedures. I made one round with the Remington brass and checked chamber fit. No problem, chamber as expected. I made the exact same round using the Starline brass and no go. It got tight near the base, approximately 1/4 " from the base I was getting a rub mark in the case. I tried all of the Starline brass that I had previously fired in my rifle and same out come, tightness near the base?? These were previously loaded with 65 grains Swiss FFG BP and a 450 grain bullet. I wouldn't think that I would have to full length size each time I fire them? What am I overlooking?

 

[45-70]

I was attempting to load some 45-70 for my Shiloh Sharps. I have two different types of brass, Remington and Starline. Both batches have been fired once in my rifle. I have no other 45-70's. None of the fired brass was resized. I prepped everything and began my loading procedures. I made one round with the Remington brass and checked chamber fit. No problem, chamber as expected. I made the exact same round using the Starline brass and no go. It got tight near the base, approximately 1/4 " from the base I was getting a rub mark in the case. I tried all of the Starline brass that I had previously fired in my rifle and same out come, tightness near the base?? These were previously loaded with 65 grains Swiss FFG BP and a 450 grain bullet. I wouldn't think that I would have to full length size each time I fire them? What am I overlooking?

you bulged the case some how when compressing powder , or
what did you use to compress

 

[45-70]

Is the rifle knew or you buy it used, try and see if empty case will fit

 

[Harleysboss]

This is a brand new Shiloh Business rifle. The cases that wouldn't fit were the once fired (out of this rifle) starline brass from my test fire loads. I wouldn't think that I bulged all 10 cases with a 65 grain charge. Compression was the same with the Remington cases. I just double checked, compression was .020". I use a 45 cal compression die.

 

[45-70]

Is the rifle knew or you buy it used

This is a brand new Shiloh Business rifle. The cases that wouldn't fit were the once fired (out of this rifle) starline brass from my test fire loads. I wouldn't think that I bulged all 10 cases with a 65 grain charge. Compression was the same with the Remington cases. I just double checked, compression was .020". I use a 45 cal compression die.

Did you try an empty case to see if it fit?

 

[45-70]

This is a brand new Shiloh Business rifle. The cases that wouldn't fit were the once fired (out of this rifle) starline brass from my test fire loads. I wouldn't think that I bulged all 10 cases with a 65 grain charge. Compression was the same with the Remington cases. I just double checked, compression was .020". I use a 45 cal compression die.

I never ask if you fired the cases and they bbbbbulged, i ask about using empty case to see if it fit

 

[edmehlig]

Maybe the walls to the Starling cases are thinner?

 

[45-70]

take one of your loaded cartridges and see if bullet will go in the muzzle end up to first driving band and stop. If it doesn't go to the first band bullet nose is to big. Just suggestion but do what you want

 

[Harleysboss]

No I never thought to try and load a empty into the chamber prior to loading, didn't figure I had to. I just checked your bullet into the bore suggestion, it stops at the front drive band. I know that you were not suggesting that the case bulged upon firing. I figured that the case would be fire formed to the chamber. I did something wrong in my loading procedure. I will have to back up and start from the beginning. I'm very new at this and it takes time to get all the little bugs worked out.

 

[MSalyards]

While some folks do not resize, a lot of the big shooters do. I'm not a big shooter but I was taught to by a couple of them. After I clean the cases already deprimed, I size and make sure they are trimmed to length. Then I anneal , prime and drop the charge through a drop tube. I add my wad stack seat my bullet and taper crimp. I tried the no size on my Nosler brass for my 45/110 and had the same problem also. Now I size everything.

Mike

 

[X-ring]

How on earth can you bulge brass to a size bigger than the chamber it came out of??? Impossible.

X

 

[45-70]

How on earth can you bulge brass to a size bigger than the chamber it came out of??? Impossible.

X
[/QUO Not shooting you can in reloading it

 

[alternate]

Next time you shoot, index the brass with a magic marker. After firing see if the brass will go in the same way it came out then rotate it 180 degrees and try again. Your chamber may have a slight asymmetry that the starline brass will follow and the remington brass will not. Maybe because one alloy is stiffer than the other or one has more spring back than the other. As far as bulging the base of the case when reloading I say no way. Cases are progressively thicker as you approach the case head so that would be the last place a bulge would form.

 

[eekjellander]

I was attempting to load some 45-70 for my Shiloh Sharps. I have two different types of brass, Remington and Starline. Both batches have been fired once in my rifle. I have no other 45-70's. None of the fired brass was resized. I prepped everything and began my loading procedures. I made one round with the Remington brass and checked chamber fit. No problem, chamber as expected. I made the exact same round using the Starline brass and no go. It got tight near the base, approximately 1/4 " from the base I was getting a rub mark in the case. I tried all of the Starline brass that I had previously fired in my rifle and same out come, tightness near the base?? These were previously loaded with 65 grains Swiss FFG BP and a 450 grain bullet. I wouldn't think that I would have to full length size each time I fire them? What am I overlooking?

Nothing with starline , all I used in my Sharps and all mine (rotated)went thru 50-60 shots every Friday with no more than cleaning using OE 1 1/2 and 2F no sizing just indexing between 10+2 :00 when loading . You might call Shiloh and ask 1st/Ed

 

[MSalyards]

How on earth can you bulge brass to a size bigger than the chamber it came out of??? Impossible.

X

Over compressing will do it!

 

[45-70]

If something was wrong with chamber both types brass would be bad so lets not start blaming the Rifle. It is very easy to bulge brass by too much compression when using black powder. So if you have to seat deeper for certain bullet which you might have to do in a Shiloh, because they have saami speck chambers, you can bulge the case and it doesn't take much

 

[alternate]

If something was wrong with chamber both types brass would be bad so lets not start blaming the Rifle. It is very easy to bulge brass by too much compression when using black powder. So if you have to seat deeper for certain bullet which you might have to do in a Shiloh, because they have saami speck chambers, you can bulge the case and it doesn't take much

Better read my post again.

 

[Harleysboss]

Ok I believe I have figured out what my issue was....I Think? When I put together the round using the Remington brass I ran it through my taper crimp to take out the slight neck bell. Thinking back on it and laying awake all night and also reading something on the Shiloh forum I believe that when I built the round using the starline brass I skipped the taper crimp, leaving the slight bell in the case mouth. I was in a hurry to learn if the round would chamber before proceeding with finishing the rest of the batch. I will know for sure when I get back from the range. I will update....fingers crossed.

 

[45-70]

Better read my post again.

Never had that problem with a Shiloh , But have done it when reloading all i got to say and have been reloading black powder a long time but have seen it with some other rifles

 

[45-70]

Ok I believe I have figured out what my issue was....I Think? When I put together the round using the Remington brass I ran it through my taper crimp to take out the slight neck bell. Thinking back on it and laying awake all night and also reading something on the Shiloh forum I believe that when I built the round using the starline brass I skipped the taper crimp, leaving the slight bell in the case mouth. I was in a hurry to learn if the round would chamber before proceeding with finishing the rest of the batch. I will know for sure when I get back from the range. I will update....fingers crossed.

that will also do it if bell is to large