CVA mountain rifle & bobcat

[Enrgizerbunny]

Hey guys. I'm new to muzzle loading. I picked up a lot of guns and I have two muzzys that are in immediate shooting shape. One is a CVA mountain rifle(far as I can tell), and the other is a CVA bobcat. They're both percussion cap 50 cal for black powder only.

I've shot a smokeless inline gun before but that's about the extent of my experience. I've done reloading before so I do understand what goes into a load.

I attached a picture of what I believe is the mountain rifle.

What kind of equipment will I need to shoot these, and where can I find load recipes and whatnot? Opinions on my identification of what I think is the mountain rifle?

 

[bamawoodsman]

Welcome! Nice looking loader. I have a t c new Englander I haven’t shot it in a while but it’s a tackdriver. I shoot 88 grains by weight fffg goex black powder with a 44/240 Hornady xtp saboted bullet. It will shoot under an inch at 100 yards. I just mostly just look at it now. I have inlines and they are a lot easier to clean. But side locks are fun to shoot. Took quite a few deer and coyote with that gun.

 

[fourbore]

You already shot an inline so you need all the same equipment. A the minimum:
- bullet starter
- volume powder measure
- FF black powder
- percussion caps
- projectiles
- cleaning equipment, soap&warm water (I like CLP after)
- lube

I highly recommend a range rod. That is a sturdy steel sectional rod. Assorted jags for loading, cleaning and patch removal. Patches for cleaning and shooting. If you plan to hunt some tubes with measured (or weighed on scale) charges.

I have not used sabots in a sidelock. But you can. I think that is a little pricey and not as old fashioned gratifying, Swaged round balls maybe a reasonable fun load to shoot. I would start with round balls and prelubed patches. The round balls might work best at lighter loads. I have been casting Lee REAL bullet mold in pure lead. That works well. You can buy cast bullets. No patch is used. The Lyman Great Planes mold is highly recommended on this forum. If casting that might call for another post. Or buy a furnace and read the instruction that come with it.

Edit: You will want to determine the rate of twist when deciding where to begin with bullets or balls. The balls can be pushed harder with a slow twist but more important the heavy bullets NEED enough (faster) twist to stabilize. Too much for one post.

Now that I think about it, the Thompson Center owners manual, available on line, will have all you need to get started.

I never shot a 1" group at 100 yards with any gun using simple open sights. So; dont be disappointed. My first shots with a new gun are 25 yard sanity shots. Then out to 50 where I like to be a few inches high. I generally do all my shooting at 50 and then fire a few at 100 to see where I hit and verify nothing went weird on me. Some people wipe down between shots as do some inline shooters.

De grease the barrel before your first shot and fire a couple caps. Per the manual. Maybe check out youtube for some how-to.

They key for a hunter is to get off the bench and practice some field position shooting.

The cleaning takes a lot longer than an inline, but the inline breech plug is a big hassle and you got none of that to deal with. I have a nipple wrench and remove my nipple before and after every range session or day out hunting. You know, you remove the barrel for cleaning, right?

 

[fourbore]

I might add, welcome to the forum and I really like that CVA you have pictured. I would be very happy to own one of those.

 

[Idaholewis]

I disagree with both bamawoodsman, and fourbore on Cleaning a Sidelock. Using Real Blackpowder The Sidelock Rifles are MUCH easier to clean than an inline, There is WAY More going on with an inline, I could easily clean 2 or 3 Sidelock Muzzleloaders to 1 Inline Rifle, I have Owned a Few Knight Rifles, and a White S91, After a Session of Shooting Real Blackpowder (Which is All i shoot) My inline Rifles were just Shy of a Nightmare, and 1 of the Reasons i dont own a Single inline Rifle Anymore.

For your Sidelock Rifle, I advise you to read these
https://www.modernmuzzleloader.com/threads/cleaning-a-sidelock.35688/
https://www.modernmuzzleloader.com/threads/sidelock-patented-breech-fire-channel.32477/

 

[bamawoodsman]

my gun was easy to clean until I added a scope to the barrel That prevented me from dunking the barrel in hot soapy water. Idaho Lewis is right About an unscoped sidelock being easy to clean up

 

[fourbore]

I never had to clean 777, but BH209 in a CVA Optima is a simple wet patch with Hoppes No9 and two patch. Maybe do it twice. Then a patch with CLP. The new break open actions and easy uncsrew plugs maybe easier to maintain. The pain is cleaning out the (inline)breech plug. With the right tricks and gadgets even this is easy enough. The nice thing about black powder is how easily hot soap and water cleans up the fouling. Yes, gone in seconds. But; there is still the chore to be sure all the water is dried out or displaced with oil. And a few minuted around he nipple are and nipple itself. It is natural to be a lot more diligent with blue steel and wood than stainless and plastic.

How many angels fit on the head of pin does not help a newbie? We might mention sucking water into the nipple hole with the plunger action of the patch and jag. I missed that, links to cleaning. Good. Good.

I bet these early CVA are 1:48 since they were basically making a copy of the TC. That means ball or bullets are both an option. Balls 0.490.

 

[fourbore]

my gun was easy to clean until I added a scope to the barrel That prevented me from dunking the barrel in hot soapy water. Idaho Lewis is right About an unscoped sidelock being easy to clean up

You could try quick detach rings.

And, BTW, no said a side lock was hard to clean. I said takes me longer.

 

[Idaholewis]

The Twist Rate for your CVA Mountain Rifle is 1:66, Which is a Slow Roundball Twist, I have one of these in .45 Cal that I bought New in the Box, I Really like mine

 

[Idaholewis]

You could try quick detach rings.

And, BTW, no said a side lock was hard to clean. I said takes me longer.

Cleaning a Muzzleloader is something we all do a little Differently, What’s easy/Difficult for some, might not be for others? The important part is getting them Clean, and BONE Dry, Then a Good Quality Gun oil to protect them

 

[Enrgizerbunny]

The mountain rifle is 1:66, the bobcat is 1:48 twist rate.

 

[Enrgizerbunny]

Here's some pictures of the mountain rifle and the bobcat.

 

[bamawoodsman]

Pretty wood in them. Nice guns.

 

[Buttonbuck]

When you can find a copy of Dutch Schoultz book on muzzleloading accuracy good read.

 

[Buttonbuck]

https://blackpowderrifleaccuracy.com/

 

[Enrgizerbunny]

I finally got a bullet/ball starter, projectiles (bullets for the bobcat for now), cleaning patches, powder, everything but a powder measure.

Cleaned the bobcat and lubed it with bore butter and thankfully it looks like the spot of rust on the muzzle doesn't continue into the barrel. Patches didn't come out rust colored. Cleaned with dawn and hot water, then rinsed once with sink hot water and a second time with scalding water before running dry patches and letting it set. Once everything was dry ran a lubed patch down the bore. I plan to hunt with the bobcat because it's shorter and has a synthetic stock.

 

[deermanok]

Your Bobcat looks very similar to my Traditions deerhunter rifle.
Mine also has a 1/48 twist barrel.
My gun never liked any sabots. Very hard to load.
I had the deerhunter up at the range last week. It surprised me that it shot so well with a patched round ball. .490 ball, .18 pillow ticking patch and 60 grains of Old Ensyford 3f powder.
TC maxi hunters in 275 grain with 90 grains of Goex 2f is a good load for my gun also.

 

[Enrgizerbunny]

Your Bobcat looks very similar to my Traditions deerhunter rifle.
Mine also has a 1/48 twist barrel.
My gun never liked any sabots. Very hard to load.
I had the deerhunter up at the range last week. It surprised me that it shot so well with a patched round ball. .490 ball, .18 pillow ticking patch and 60 grains of Old Ensyford 3f powder.
TC maxi hunters in 275 grain with 90 grains of Goex 2f is a good load for my gun also.

I bought 295gr powerbelts and Pyrodex RS. See pictures

 

[deermanok]

Oh ok, nice. I bought a pack of the same bullets at Walmart a while back. Left overs from deer season. I paid about 8 bucks for them. You know, they loaded easy and shot really well out of my deerhunter rifle. I think I was using 80 or 90 grains of Goex 3f.

 

[Enrgizerbunny]

Oh ok, nice. I bought a pack of the same bullets at Walmart a while back. Left overs from deer season. I paid about 8 bucks for them. You know, they loaded easy and shot really well out of my deerhunter rifle. I think I was using 80 or 90 grains of Goex 3f.

Does a bullet like that require a patch or anything like that?