Fast Twist .36 Cal Build

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Idaholewis

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I spoke with a Man yesterday about building me a 1” Fast Twist .36 Cal, 32” Long Barrel, He agreed to Build it for me :yeah: This has been something i have wanted to do for at least 2 years now, kind of a Dream Barrel you might say :D This will be a HEAVY Bench rest Gun only, .36 Cal is not legal to hunt Big here, not even Deer. At this point I don’t plan on having an under rib or thimbles installed since i will be bench shooting this Rifle, When Target shooting i ALWAYS use a Range Rod for Swabbing between shots and loading. All i plan to have done is the Breech plug installed, wedge key Lug installed for a TC Hawken/Renegade Stock, and a Front Dovetail Cut for a 17 Series .850 tall Lee Shaver’s Globe which i already Have, I will probably go with Lee’s Mid Range Soule Tang Peep and Hadley eye cup on this setup. I am thinking 1:18 Twist?

This is along the lines of Bullets i plan to Shoot in this Rifle, At least 1 Paper Patch bullet, and a Grease Groove
E5ZF3s0m.png
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not to try and change anything but what weight is the bullet? .38 are 14 twist. in Black powder cartridge. I like the idea
 
45cal said:
not to try and change anything but what weight is the bullet? .38 are 14 twist. in Black powder cartridge. I like the idea

Bob, i am WIDE open to Twist and Value your opinion here! The Bullets will be in the 300-325 Grain Range, and measure in the 1.3” inch long range, i might even go up to 1.4, 1.5 inch long and Closer to 350 Grains . The Builder mentioned 1:16, You think a 1:14 would be better?
 
This going to be a neat build, shooting a bullet like that there would be no reason they shouldn't be legal for deer sized game.



Idaholewis said:
45cal said:
not to try and change anything but what weight is the bullet? .38 are 14 twist. in Black powder cartridge. I like the idea

Bob, i am WIDE open to Twist and Value your opinion here! The Bullets will be in the 300-325 Grain Range, and measure in the 1.3” inch long range, i might even go up to 1.4, 1.5 inch long and Closer to 350 Grains . The Builder mentioned 1:16, You think a 1:14 would be better?
 
I have all the parts for mine, but had to move my mother in after she wrecked her car and needed extensive medical and rehab, now almost a year later. I should get the ball rolling again. I have an omega action and a 14 twist 9.3 cal Krieger for this one. (its a perfect .358/.366) I have some big lead and the barrel is a great slip fit for .35 cal bullets. Ive already built one .36 light duty 14 twist on an Allen inline action, and it shoots very well, but was really just a prototype test thing on the cheap. Ive tried big lead (I think mine is just over 270) and sabots (MMP makes a .36 to .311/312) with several pistol bullets of about 80-110 grn. I was typically pleasantly surprised by most everything.
 
Ask yourself what did Doc White do?
http://whitemuzzleloading.com/designing-for-accuracy/

We agreed on a smaller more accurate caliber and chose .367 as the best, with shallow .035″ grooves and 1-15 twist.

The team designed a long, high BC 305 grain bullet in pure lead, cast .002 oversize then sized and lubed down to .001 oversize. This means that the .368 bullet fits the .367 bore quite tightly, at least at the muzzle.

They admitted to liking Swiss black powder best as it is extremely consistent and very potent. Charges in the 35-55 grain range seem to work very well with the 305 grain bullet, with little difference in accuracy through the charge range. Almost any load in that range will shoot into an inch at a hundred yards.

They also protect the base of the bullet with a poly wad. Fiber wads, with and without grease were tried, but the poly wad, .125 thick, was found to be the best.

WHITE RIFLES TEAM WINS THE 2006 MANUFACTURER’S MATCH
The White team established a new record for the match, shooting 1132- 14X, eclipsing the old record of 1101-8X set in 2005 by the Knight team. David Jones also shot a new individual record for the match, shooting a 291-3X. He missed 9 points out of 300. WOW! It is hard for me to express how proud I am of this team of shooters.
Match06TeamOne.jpg


Class dismissed. :D
 
1874sharpsshooter said:
I would go with 1:14 or 1:16 over the 1:18 myself.


Most Definitely!! After GM54s post, i will go 1:15 Twist :yeah:

I would love to have 1 of them Old White Rifles above!!

.36 Cal has Fascinated me for a LONG Time now, It started with these TC Senecas. But these are 1:48 Twist, Which is not a Twist that Excites me, i feel they are better suited to Roundball, But i have Shot, and Seen first hand 1:48 Twist Bullet Groups that we’re Impressive! It’s no Secret I am a dedicated Bullet Shooter :yeah: Therefore i seek a Bullet Twist. Patched Roundball does ABSOLUTELY Nothing for me, In fact i cannot think of a more Boring projectile than Patched Roundball? Tennis, or Golf anyone? LOL, Throw a Football or Go Home :lol:
 
This project will get underway very soon, i am gonna drive a TC Barrel down to the Guy so he can Copy it (Wedge lug, Breech plug) We both have a Cow Elk season that starts soon, i think it ends the 8th of Dec? This Barrel will get going just after that :yeah:
 
38-55s run anywhere from 1-12 to 1-18 but the 1-18 probably aint gunna handle anything much over a 260gr conical. Many of the custom 40s guys are building these days are now 1-13 to 1-15 especially if they want to shoot a 300gr. Seems like a safe bet too since a 405 Win is usually right in that twist range and commonly shoots a 300gr bullet. A few are 1-16s but they are not usually shooting lead and shooting them much faster.

1-14 or 1-15 seems like a safe bet but its only a guess.

JBM says Stability: 1.782 for a 1.3" long .36 bullet at 1300 fps and 1.5+ for a 1-16. Both those estimates are solid in the green so you dont even need 1300fps.
http://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmstab-5.1.cgi

I cant use anything under a 40cal except for recreation so ive not really looked into it. I would love a 40cal though that can shoot conicals or a 300gr sabotless with BH209.
 
Good info GM54! I will go 1:14 or 1:15 Twist with it. Now to get it Done so i can learn it’s needs? That is a LARGE part of the Fun of this Stuff to me. It is probably a good thing I don’t own a Barrel shop, and a Mold Making Setup, I would go Broke on my own Projects :lol:

I actually thought about a .40 Cal, Even .38 Crossed my Mind. I could Deer hunt with a .40 Cal Here, But i have that Base EXTREMELY well covered with my .45 Cals. My main goal here is a HEAVYWEIGHT, Light Recoiling Bench Rifle for Fun, This .36 Cal with 300-325 Grain Bullets should fill that Bill well. This has been in my Thoughts for a Long time now, it’s about to become a reality :yeah:
 
I met with the Builder Today (Great Guy!) Dropped off the Donor Barrel. Very impressed with what i seen! This Guy has some AWESOME Machinery, He figured to get Started on this After the Holidays. This one has me Excited :yeah: I am going 32” Long, 1:14 Twist :yeah:
 
I swapped gears a little bit here, I had Tom @ Accurate Molds Change 1 around for me. I also decided to go 1:15 Twist on the Barrel. According to the JBM Twist Calculator for a .361 Bore and 1:15 Twist at the Low end of what i feel Velocity will be, 1200 FPS that puts me at a Stability of 1.556 (Military standard is 1.5) If i ramp up the Velocity to say 1500 FPS that puts me at a Stability of 1.676, I feel this is a fairly safe bet

This is the Parent Mold i went off of
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I wanted to lengthen the bullet to 1.375, do away with the Bevel Base and make it Flat, And ad 1 more Lube Groove. Tom drew it up and Emailed it to me. It’s ordered :yeah:
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Lewis, you have me drooling! Sounds like a great project. You should do a video of the build in his shop. That’ll be sweet.
 
Magnum said:
Lewis, you have me drooling! Sounds like a great project. You should do a video of the build in his shop. That’ll be sweet.

I am excited about this one :yeah: I have day dreamed about a Fast Twist .361 For a Long time now. His Rifling machine is an Old Pratt & Whitney (Cut Rifling) He has some really cool Machinery! The Lathe Setup that he Does the Barrel flats on is a BEHEMOTH of a Machine! I will at least take some Pics when i Run Back Down and get the Barrel. He figured to Start on it after the Holidays, he said it wouldn’t take him long to get it done once he gets started on it. I am gonna try my hand at Blueing it myself. Since I cannot Hunt with it, I don’t want an under Rib, thimbles, or Rear Sight. Just a Shaver’s 17 Series .850” Front Globe Sight. It will be Plain Looking, She’s gonna be a HEAVY designated Bench/Target Gun. I can always do an under rib and thimbles down the rd if I decide to. This is gonna be like a Gibbs Rifle, i already Have a nice .36 Cal Range Rod

This is what his Old Rifling Machine looks like, I looked at several barrels he has done and they looked Really GOOD! Very nice Cut Rifling
QO4LKmb.jpg
 
That’s a nice machine there. Maybe a three piece take down rod in a scabbard for hunting? I’ve seen them before. The 1-14” rifling sure is a fast twist but I think with that bullet it’s a match made in heaven. What powder? I can’t wait to be updated. I’m looking for a new build for this coming year and really wanted to put together a flintlock in .50 ( something I don’t have), you know the sicknesses! Well good luck with that build and I’ll be patiently watching Lewis.
Merry Christmas, Chris
 
Good for you, Lewis! There’s not many things more exciting than a new gun! What method of blueing are you going to do? I have always admired the slow rust blue of the old Winchester guns.
 

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