Help me get started with super 91 in .451

[fishhawk2700]

Been shooting White rifles for more than twenty years. Have one in every caliber they made. Whitetails and Super 91s. Love 'em. Been shooting my own bullets thru them (No Excuses Muzzleloader Bullets) with great results. Just introduced sabots that are very similar to the Shooting Stars of yester-year with Harverster Crush Rib sabots. Only available in 50 caliber for now, but would be interested to hear if there is any interest in us making a sabot available for the 45 caliber? Historically, I have not been a fan of sabots where we tend to get some pretty long shots here in the West (Utah) but these sabots are the real deal. Very accurate and deadly down-range. Decisions.....decisions......

muzzleloading-bullets.com

SABOTS? :shock: oke:

 

[edmehlig]

Dave like you I primarily shoot lead conicals. If it wasn’t for your NoExcuses bullets I would have sold my White’s a long time ago! They are so much more accurate than the one White sold. At least for me anyway.

I tried White’s Power Stars but could not get them to shoot accurately. To be honest I did not spend a lot of time to develop a load that worked. I went with Doc’s recommendations .

I’d be interested In them for their flatter trajectory. Love to hear what load you would recommend.

 

[GM54-120]

Been shooting White rifles for more than twenty years. Have one in every caliber they made. Whitetails and Super 91s. Love 'em. Been shooting my own bullets thru them (No Excuses Muzzleloader Bullets) with great results. Just introduced sabots that are very similar to the Shooting Stars of yester-year with Harverster Crush Rib sabots. Only available in 50 caliber for now, but would be interested to hear if there is any interest in us making a sabot available for the 45 caliber? Historically, I have not been a fan of sabots where we tend to get some pretty long shots here in the West (Utah) but these sabots are the real deal. Very accurate and deadly down-range. Decisions.....decisions......

muzzleloading-bullets.com

The problem with this is available sabots. They are just too short for lead 40s like Doc sold. MMP might still have the White 45x40 mold. Call Del and ask him but cutting a new sabot "mold" is probably way way more than you would care to spend. He did make a experimental 45x40 sabot based loosely on that mold too. I think i still have a few of those sabots.

This bullet looks great with very minor changes. Increase the metaplat slightly and remove about 80% of the bevel on the base. That might get you a few more grains without increasing the length. Plus this weight is calculated using WW lead so.....
http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_det ... 265S-D.png

 

[bulletbusiness]

I have been shooting a lot of the sabots thru my new Accura. 90 -100 grains (by volume) of either Triple 7 or BH209. BH cleans up much easier and less often needed than the triple 7. Cloverleafs at 100 yards. Have had several reports from White owners of similar success with Pyrodex P and White Hots. Both around 100 grains by volume.

 

[GM54-120]

This is what a 40cal 250gr bullet looks like in a Harvester 45x40 sabot next to a 200gr SST. The Fury bullet is just under 1" long. Sure you can get a all lead version to be a bit shorter but its still gunna be long in the harvester sabot. These do shoot pretty good though in a 45 1-20 twist. PRs Dead Centers and QTs did also for many people.

Far right is the PR QT 40cal 250gr

I would love to see something heavier like 300gr but im just a bit skeptical that any existing sabot is going to be very good at it.

 

[451 whitworth]

well the auction is over and I won.
I'm a little surprised lymann is getting praise. I've only got old ones but I've read some complaints about the current production moulds.

Good for you! I have been using the Lyman 457121 mold for decades now. I originally got it when I bought my PH Whitworth repro rifle. That bullet has shot great in every .45 cal ML'er I own (White 98, PH & Euro arms Whitworth and Volunteer, Navy Arms Creedmoor, home made Rigby target rifle) unlike the Lyman 451114. I have a number of different .45 molds (Lyman, LBT, Accurate) but that Lyman is just so good in anything. My mold has been modified to cast either a hollow point or flat nose. The HP version weighs in at 475gr and is an absolute hammer on whitetail. I size down in a .454" die base first then either go down again to .452" or .451" final size. When loading a clean barrel for hunting I use the .452" bullet and for follow up shots in the field, the .451" over the fouling.

 

[bulletbusiness]

Well, we finally decided to "pull the trigger" on the 40 (.400) caliber lead hollow point sabots. They are available in 175, 200, 225 and 250 in the 45 caliber Harvester Crush Rib Sabot and 200, 225, 250, 275 and 300 in the 50 Caliber Harvester Crush Rib sabots. We're expecting good reports back from our new line. Thx for all of your help in coaxing us along!

 

[michiganmuzzy]

View attachment 3738 View attachment 3739 Well, we finally decided to "pull the trigger" on the 40 (.400) caliber lead hollow point sabots. They are available in 175, 200, 225 and 250 in the 45 caliber Harvester Crush Rib Sabot and 200, 225, 250, 275 and 300 in the 50 Caliber Harvester Crush Rib sabots. We're expecting good reports back from our new line. Thx for all of your help in coaxing us along!

I'll be ordering some of those 45/250s as soon as they are available

 

[BB]

Those look real NICE! I just went look and the white Power stars I have for .504 weigh 320 grs. and the ones for .451 weigh 300 grs. I shoot the .451 in my Thunderbolts with BH 209 and they shoot great.

Can't wait to hear how they do.

 

[bulletbusiness]

Here's a couple of other photos of the 45 and 50 caliber .400 saboted bullets. They are currently available in either a hollow-point or flat nose metplate.

 

[bulletbusiness]

We're also having longer sabots manufactured in the 45 caliber to accommodate longer bullets. Should be available in a couple months.

 

[dbowling]

Good to see you expanding the line up, will be ordering some of the .40/.45

 

[bulletbusiness]

Probably should have mentioned that these bullets are available thru No Excuses l.l.c. Website is: muzzleloading-bullets.com

 

[GM54-120]

We're also having longer sabots manufactured in the 45 caliber to accommodate longer bullets. Should be available in a couple months.

If those can handle SML pressure then you will have a huge hit with some shooters. The main thing holding back sabots in fast twist 45s is bullet weight limitations of current sabots. 275gr and 300gr just dont fit well.

Here is a Fury 300gr in a Harvester. Just for reference. It probably would not shoot in any sabot without some changes to it.

Same bullet next to a SST

 

[zymguy]

what powders and how much are you guys using?

 

[toytruck]

In my .451 S91 I use triple 7, 3Fg. 80gr. In the .540 S91, triple 7 2Fg. 90gr.

 

[zymguy]

In my .451 S91 I use triple 7, 3Fg. 80gr. In the .540 S91, triple 7 2Fg. 90gr.

With all bullets ?

 

[toytruck]

No, conicals . 480gr.Bullshop in .451,
490gr. Trashcans by Batchief in .504

 

[fishhawk2700]

S91 .504 Bullshop 460 gr .5045 .060 veggie wad 80gr3f Swiss.
S91 .451 Eds 465gr .060 veggie wad 70gr 3f Swiss.
SS .410 No Excuses 460gr .410 knurled .060 veggie wad 65gr 3f Swiss.

 

[jlynch75]

Don't have a 91 but my Whitetail .451 likes 425 grain bullets on top of 60 grains of 777.