Great article ! Very clear and concise. I am looking at the BACO JIM455546E as a dual diameter using my current hypothesis that the step will help with minimal base obturation and allow me to touch up against the lands to ensure consistent initial resistance to assist in consistent powder ignition. In the article you suggest 1:20 as an alloy to start with, I’m assuming that there is no problem with obturation using an alloy that hard on a bore rider. My research has also indicated that most PPB loaders use thinner rather than thicker paper. I have an industrial supply of .00015 thick paper that’s at least 50 years old however it’s still completely unknown as to it’s effectiveness for the PP application. Any information is appreciated. ThanksLoading PPBs really is easy, once you learn some key stuff and get over a few hurdles. I took me awhile to figuring it all out and I've yet to find good info from books or videos. Maybe this article I wrote a few years back will be of some help to ya ...
http://www.bpgang.com/ppb/ppbcartridges.pdf
Use 16-1 in dual diameter , base diameter seems a little big might have trouble fitting the caseGreat article ! Very clear and concise. I am looking at the BACO JIM455546E as a dual diameter using my current hypothesis that the step will help with minimal base obturation and allow me to touch up against the lands to ensure consistent initial resistance to assist in consistent powder ignition. In the article you suggest 1:20 as an alloy to start with, I’m assuming that there is no problem with obturation using an alloy that hard on a bore rider. My research has also indicated that most PPB loaders use thinner rather than thicker paper. I have an industrial supply of .00015 thick paper that’s at least 50 years old however it’s still completely unknown as to it’s effectiveness for the PP application. Any information is appreciated. Thanks
I used 9 LB onion skin in the 45/70 C Sharps 1874 to wrap BACO 443/530 gr /Eliptical , I sold it and swapped to a TC Renegade which uses the same set up thanks to Bob Hoyt . My CVA Paramount 45 uses the same (except) it gets wrapped with a 13.5 LB 453.5 bore . Point is your probably gonna need store bought not what you have a (lot of) /EdGreat article ! Very clear and concise. I am looking at the BACO JIM455546E as a dual diameter using my current hypothesis that the step will help with minimal base obturation and allow me to touch up against the lands to ensure consistent initial resistance to assist in consistent powder ignition. In the article you suggest 1:20 as an alloy to start with, I’m assuming that there is no problem with obturation using an alloy that hard on a bore rider. My research has also indicated that most PPB loaders use thinner rather than thicker paper. I have an industrial supply of .00015 thick paper that’s at least 50 years old however it’s still completely unknown as to it’s effectiveness for the PP application. Any information is appreciated. Thanks
I’ve got that one plus “The Paper Jacket” by Paul Matthews. I did find the Wright book to be better overall. Reading a book is a big help however to actually do it and get positive results is the biggest confidence builder.Very nice Rob. I have most all of the books on paper patching that are out there. Randolph Wright did the only one that I learned much from. https://www.amazon.com/Loading-Shooting-Patched-Bullets-Beginners/dp/B07FRSKMFT
Great article ! Very clear and concise. I am looking at the BACO JIM455546E as a dual diameter using my current hypothesis that the step will help with minimal base obturation and allow me to touch up against the lands to ensure consistent initial resistance to assist in consistent powder ignition. In the article you suggest 1:20 as an alloy to start with, I’m assuming that there is no problem with obturation using an alloy that hard on a bore rider. My research has also indicated that most PPB loaders use thinner rather than thicker paper. I have an industrial supply of .00015 thick paper that’s at least 50 years old however it’s still completely unknown as to it’s effectiveness for the PP application. Any information is appreciated. Thanks
Thanks for all the great information.The bugaboo for PPB cartridges is finding the "right" slick, with the "right" diameter, and the "right" thickness patch paper. When it comes to a slick's cast diameter, a single thousandth of an inch can matter. I'm currently using a JIM444530E .444" diameter slick that when patched with 7# Seth Cole paper will yield a PPB of about .449" total diameter. This allows enuf "wiggle" room to get into the rifling, even after fouling control (using bore gophers). All of the exposed PPB gets into the rifling because my Sharps rifle has been chrome moly relined and rechambered with a custom PPB reamer ... I can't load greaser cartridges in this rifle, and all new brass must be reformed before loading (I use a Lyman sizing die with about 3/8" cut off the bottom so that the brass will get sized at the mouth smaller than normal for .45-70 brass). All of this sounds like a lot of head hurting trouble, but if taken one step at a time, it's really no big deal.
Most folks will have guns with greaser chambers, so there will be some fair amount of leade or freebore. Getting the PPB as far into the rifling is important. This means building a PPB cartridge with a PPB that seats in no more than 1/10". You will Need a proper slick, one that is long (and therefore heavy) and that means having fast rifling of 1:18 down to 1:16 ... I had Lee Shaver make mine 1:17 and if the aiming and trigger finger is "on" for that shooting session it will one hole at 200 yards (um, nope, I've never been able to do that but I keep trying!).
SO, if I had a .45-70 and I wanted to experiment (or even just "mess around") with PPBs I'd contact Tom @ Accurate moulds and get him to make an aluminum mould for 500+ grain slick. A dropped diameter of .443" should work for bbls with .450" bores. This mould would be 1/2 the cost (or less) than a BACO JIM mould, and would be quite accurate (I still have some Accurate moulds and use them). Have "someone" send ya some patch paper to try out, or buy some Seth Cole or Fidelity. Cast at 1:20 and some at 1:16 (I buy pure lead and pure tin and smelt an alloy as need be). Have "someone" send ya some .060" LDPE .460" wads to try out or buy some from BACO. Make a powder drop tube - use an arrow shaft or brass or aluminum tubing along with a small aluminum or brass or paper funnel. Use a 7/16" piece of dowel to compress the powder down between .100" and .125" past the case mouth. Learn how to cut that patch paper to a proper width and length - it ain't that hard, promise. Cast and wrap up some slicks. Prime and charge some brass with whatever real black powder ya have on hand. Drop fill the brass. Push in the wad. Use that dowel to push the wad down past the case mouth. Twist in yer PPB. Ya done built yerself a PPB cartridge, build some more. Go and bang it off at 50, 100, 200 yards. Take notes. Have fun!
PS - I'm that "someone".
EVERYTHING about BPCR is incredibly subjective, just like anything to do with all firearms and lotsa other stuff in life. It's all about what yer needs are with a BPCR rifle. I ran greaser chambers for many years, they worked just fine, and I won matches with them. I had an opportunity to use a custom reamer and I feel it's added to my score, makes for a better/easier cartridge build, the tighter chamber is better on the brass, and no freebore leade to be concerned about the slick having to obturate into.
If yer gonna run both PPBs and greasers, and you gun hunt, then a greaser chamber makes sense. I have no need for greasers and target shooting - greasers mean OAL and leading issues, none of which are of PPB concern. BPCR means long range targets for me, so grease cookies are detrimental since I'll bore gopher wipe 'tween shots.
Kenny may see no need for a PPB chamber, but there are other top shooters who do, like Brent Danielson. Like, who really cares? This isn't a "my way is better than yers" deal. Do what you think is best, have fun, shoot great scores, win matches.
Dave Gullo is a world class rifle match shooter because he's Dave Gullo - that man could win matches with anyone's gun, including using PPBs if he was force to use 'em.
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