Minumum load to seal Powerbelts

[PaulF70]

Anyone have any feedback on the minimum charge of Blackhorn 209 to get the Powerbelt base to seal in the bore and give good accuracy?

I tried to make a light load for my recoil-shy son (12). His CVA Wolf is light and kicks hard. I tried 35gr by weight (about 50gr by vol) of 209 under a 245gr Powerbelt. Accuracy was very, very poor - 4" groups at 50Y.

I am pretty sure this is due to inadequate pressure to properly seal the base.

I am going to go up on the loads for the next trip to the range; appreciate any info people might have.

(As far as power goes - even this light load would kill a deer at 50Y. That's not the issue.)

P.S. Please no "don't use Powerbelts" replies. Powerbelts are not the issue here - I use them in my own CVA Accura MX and T/C Encore with hotter loads and they are extremely accurate.

 

[deermanok]

Maybe up the charge 5 or 10 grains.
Muzzleloaders are sometimes finicky.
What works well in one rifle may not necessarily work well in another.

 

[phalanx]

Up to a 275 Platinum one or 295 with the same charge

 

[MrTom]

I think you answered your own question with the "hotter loads" comment about your Accura and Encore. Some bullets simply need to be loaded hotter when using Blackhorn. I'd try some granular T7 ffg. T7 has a different burn rate than T7. I have an older gun that is 209 compatible but does much better in the accuracy department with lighter loads of T7 ffg and somewhat lighter bullets when the grandkids are shooting it.

 

[PaulF70]

Going to a heavier bullet means more recoil. (Recoil is proportional to momentum, not energy.)

Also why would that increase sealing?

Upping powder by 5-10gr is what I'm planning on, just wondering if anybody's gone thru this process before we go back to the range...

 

[phalanx]

I was thinking that maybe the extra weight sitting on the powder would give it a bit more time to burn before heading out the barrel, possibly sealing better and the platninum ones have a different skirt that might seal better. In addition maybe the gun just doesn't like the 245 gr. Good luck to you.

 

[PaulF70]

I was thinking that maybe the extra weight sitting on the powder would give it a bit more time to burn before heading out the barrel, possibly sealing better and the platninum ones have a different skirt that might seal better. In addition maybe the gun just doesn't like the 245 gr. Good luck to you.

Ok, both makes sense. Will try different bullets.

 

[phalanx]

Another thing might be putting a wad between the powder and the PB. Not a normal thing but have heard of folks trying it.

 

[Slingingslugs]

I've used one 60 grn magnum triple7 pellet behind a 245 grn hollow point with good accuracy in my old fiber optic sighted v2 optima

 

[Jbrown69]

Anyone have any feedback on the minimum charge of Blackhorn 209 to get the Powerbelt base to seal in the bore and give good accuracy?

I tried to make a light load for my recoil-shy son (12). His CVA Wolf is light and kicks hard. I tried 35gr by weight (about 50gr by vol) of 209 under a 245gr Powerbelt. Accuracy was very, very poor - 4" groups at 50Y.

I am pretty sure this is due to inadequate pressure to properly seal the base.

I am going to go up on the loads for the next trip to the range; appreciate any info people might have.

(As far as power goes - even this light load would kill a deer at 50Y. That's not the issue.)

P.S. Please no "don't use Powerbelts" replies. Powerbelts are not the issue here - I use them in my own CVA Accura MX and T/C Encore with hotter loads and they are extremely accurate.

My guess is that it doesn't take a lot of pressure to expand that plastic base. Accuracy is another matter. Just inch up on the charge to where you can accept the accuracy. I haven't seen any published minimum charge.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

Ive never used less then 60gr of 777 under a powerbelt and always had great accuracy.

 

[txhunter58]

My guess is that it doesn't take a lot of pressure to expand that plastic base. Accuracy is another matter. Just inch up on the charge to where you can accept the accuracy. I haven't seen any published minimum charge.

Totally agree. 50 gr is plenty to expand the base. Just need to experiment with more powder and maybe another bullet.

 

[BadgerRidge]

I think that the OP has his logic backwards in regards to Blackhorn209. The system needs to be sealed before the Blackhorn209 will burn properly.

All my bottles of Blackhorn209 say to use sabots. My experience has backed that up as well.

 

[Jbrown69]

I think that the OP has his logic backwards in regards to Blackhorn209. The system needs to be sealed before the Blackhorn209 will burn properly.

All my bottles of Blackhorn209 say to use sabots. My experience has backed that up as well.

Best performance is with a good tight seal. Do not want the bullet to move off the charge. That being said one wonders if pressures are not consistent. Cold weather performance?

 

[txhunter58]

I think that the OP has his logic backwards in regards to Blackhorn209. The system needs to be sealed before the Blackhorn209 will burn properly.

All my bottles of Blackhorn209 say to use sabots. My experience has backed that up as well.

Powerbelts should seal well with their rear plastic bell.

I use BH almost exclusively and have never used a sabot. When I use flat based conicals, like no excuses or Bullshop, I use a felt wad or MMP sub base. But Thors, FPBs, and other conicals with a rear bell that expands when it ignites work very well with BH.

But you HAVE to have a bullet that will maintain good pressure on the powder for BH to ignite.

 

[Bphunter1974]

My 70 lb granddaughter shoots 70 grs volume 209 with a mmp black sabot and hornady 250 gr xtp. She's killed 3 deer lights out never moved complete pass throughs. Sorry im no help with powerbelts just sharing a highly accurate deadly load from her cva wolf

 

[brushblind]

Anyone have any feedback on the minimum charge of Blackhorn 209 to get the Powerbelt base to seal in the bore and give good accuracy?

I tried to make a light load for my recoil-shy son (12). His CVA Wolf is light and kicks hard. I tried 35gr by weight (about 50gr by vol) of 209 under a 245gr Powerbelt. Accuracy was very, very poor - 4" groups at 50Y.

I am pretty sure this is due to inadequate pressure to properly seal the base.

I am going to go up on the loads for the next trip to the range; appreciate any info people might have.

(As far as power goes - even this light load would kill a deer at 50Y. That's not the issue.)

P.S. Please no "don't use Powerbelts" replies. Powerbelts are not the issue here - I use them in my own CVA Accura MX and T/C Encore with hotter loads and they are extremely accurate.

We do an annual youth day shoot kids age 8-16 we use CVA wolf's with a patched rb and one 50gr pyrodex pellet and have no problems with too much recoil. I don't have any knowledge of Blackhorn but if your using open sights on the Wolf's, 4" @ 50 yds is good. If you want to reduce recoil with a charge wt. you may also want to use a lighter projectile as well. Don't know if you can get a power belt any lighter but if your teaching your son I wouldn't worry about accuracy too much also you can usually find the PB skirts around 20yds out and check the seal quality, good luck. Another thing I remember is the CVA wolf makes a different breech plug for Blackhorn but I don't know if that would account for your accuracy.

 

[deermanok]

Some people have added some weight to the hollow of the stock. It helps to tame the recoil.