QLA -- Ballistic Bridge Sub Base

[ronlaughlin]

The ballistic bridge sub base seemed to work kinda good in a rifle with the QLA last week. This led to trying it again yesterday morning. The rifle used was an Omega Dream Season with a 1X scope mounted; utilizing Bestill' breech plug. The Rifle has a QLA which has been detrimental for shooting conical, or smooth sized bullets. The first shot utilized a 54 caliber wool wad, and it hit a way low, and off to the right. Range is 77 yard. Just one shot is all the wool wad got.

The next three shots used 95g Blackhorn, ballistic bridge sub base, 50 cal 275g Fury Star Tip Mz smooth sized, Federal 209A primer.

This morning an Omega X7 with a 4X scope; utilizing Bestill' breech plug was brought. This rifle has that dang old QLA too. Was able to stretch the target out to 88 yard, before the terrain stopped further location. This morning, the load in the X7 was 95g Blackhorn powder, the ballistic bridge sub base, 50 cal 275g Fury Star Tip Mz smooth sized, 209A primer. First three shots at bottom target. The scope was adjusted, and then the last three shots taken at the top target.

So far, the ballistic bridge sub base seems to cure the QLA ills.

 

[GM54-120]

Ive often wondered if the half inch thick cushion wads for ML shotguns would work also.

 

[ronlaughlin]

Was able to extend the range both yesterday, and today. The load in the X7 was 95g Blackhorn powder, the ballistic bridge sub base, 50 cal 275g Fury Star Tip Mz smooth sized, 209A primer.

Yesterday, the target was out 200 yard; wind was not too bad, but it was inconsistent. Elevation dial was turned up 6 moa from the 100 yard zero. Six shots taken at the bottom target.

This morning there was almost no breeze. Target was out 190 yard. After seeing the target from yesterday, the elevation dial was turned up another ½ moa, for a total of 6½ moa above 100 yard zero. Four shots taken at the top target. First shot from a cold clean barrel; is the lowest shot.

It sure seems like one could take one of these short light 50 caliber rifles with QLA, hunting, and shoot 50 caliber bullets successfully.

 

[Hatchet Jack]

Looks like you got some pretty good results. I have some of those sub bases I will try with my Omegas and big lead conicals in the near future. Someone told me those MMP sub bases cause a lot of plastic fouling. Did you find that to be true?

 

[ronlaughlin]

..........Someone told me those MMP sub bases cause a lot of plastic fouling. Did you find that to be true?

Don't really know. Have only shot 50 of them sub bases. Didn't seem to be a problem using them whilst loading, and shooting. Accuracy was good.

Photo inside barrels follow. First photos are near muzzle, then down barrel to powder.


First the Dream Season

Second the X7

Last a Standard Omega which has never had a bridge shot through

Could be the grooves in the rifles that shot the sub bases get darker stained toward the powder. Perhaps the stain is from the sub bases. Perhaps the stain is from the bullets.

The standard Omega has only shot bullets in sabot, never bullets touching the barrel.



Hopefully you can answer your question, because i sure can't.

 

[Hatchet Jack]

10-4 Thanks
Good post, good shooting.

 

[sabotloader]

I have been using the sub bases for several years shooting full bore - flat based bullets and see no indication of a plastic build up.

 

[ronlaughlin]

Years ago now, an Omega with the QLA was used to shoot some conicals sent me. That was a total failure. The bullets flew like shotgun pellets at just 25 yards. So the QLA was cut off. Just a couple shots at 25 yards revealed a huge difference. A quick move to 100 yard target, and the conicals made a good group, and it was good. Three Omega rifles here have had the QLA cut off, and they, all three, shoot conicals well; 50 caliber bullets well. .

It seems there is another option. The sub base makes 50 caliber bullets shoot accurately even with the QLA. A lot of sub bases are coming in the mail.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

I have been using the sub bases for several years shooting full bore - flat based bullets and see no indication of a plastic build up.

Ive started shooting sub bases too. But have to make my own cuz no one makes them in 45 that i can find.

 

[sabotloader]

Ive started shooting sub bases too. But have to make my own cuz no one makes them in 45 that i can find.

Correct I really wish MMP would make them but has not happened. I might try to talk to Del and see if he might be interested especially with the popularity of the 45 these days.

 

[sabotloader]

Ive started shooting sub bases too. But have to make my own cuz no one makes them in 45 that i can find.

I did talk to MMP today about both of the needs that I have. One was I would really like to have a 40-45 sabot with longer petals than the current 45 sabots and I asked about the 45 cal. sub-bridges.

So - yes the current MMP sub-bridge is the same polymer formula as used in the HPH sabots - so it really should not be causing undo plastic fouling in the barrel

I also approached them about the possibility of a quality 45 sub-base. MMP indicated they would look at the possibility of creating such a thing. I tried to emphasize the new popularity of the 45 in todays' market.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

Ill call them or send them an email. The more requests they get the more likely they are to make something.

 

[sabotloader]

Ill call them or send them an email. The more requests they get the more likely they are to make something.

You are correct... the more people that show an interest the better chance we have. I can not believe how expensive the molds to make a new product are...

I am not sure they knew about the new use of the sub-bridge as wad was and how well it works. Ron's discovery could make a lot of people with TC - QLA's real happy!

 

[michiganmuzzy]

You are correct... the more people that show an interest the better chance we have. I can not believe how expensive the molds to make a new product are...

I am not sure they knew about the new use of the sub-bridge as wad was and how well it works. Ron's discovery could make a lot of people with TC - QLA's real happy!

I sent mmp an email about them back in late fall and that was the response i got. The molds were super expensive. And with unknown demand it wasnt worth it. Yet.

 

[Matthew323]

The average cost for an injection mold for a plastic part used to be in the neighborhood of $250K-$300K.

I am sure that the current cost is even higher.

The hot plastic has a definite wearing effect as it is forced into the mold under pressure. The type of plastic, it's temperature at injection, and other factors determine how many cycles a manufacturer gets before the mold must be scrapped.

So the economic reasons need to be present for a company to invest in a new, untested market.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

Thats a lot of sub bases just to break even.

 

[Matthew323]

Thats a lot of sub bases just to break even.

I don't know how many bases would be molded from a single cycle. Something that small, there might be 50-100 linked together with gates in the mold. It all depends upon the complexity of the item being molded. My knowledge is WAY OUT OF DATE. There have been all kinds of advances since the last time I was in a machine shop helping the tool & die makers finish a mold. Advances in metallurgy with steels for the mold bodies. All kinds of things have changed since then.

 

[sdporter]

Years ago now, an Omega with the QLA was used to shoot some conicals sent me. That was a total failure. The bullets flew like shotgun pellets at just 25 yards. So the QLA was cut off. Just a couple shots at 25 yards revealed a huge difference. A quick move to 100 yard target, and the conicals made a good group, and it was good. Three Omega rifles here have had the QLA cut off, and they, all three, shoot conicals well; 50 caliber bullets well. .

It seems there is another option. The sub base makes 50 caliber bullets shoot accurately even with the QLA. A lot of sub bases are coming in the mail.

Why do you suppose that is? The QLA causing all the accuracy issues? My conicals have shot like crap out of my Accura. They should be shooting lights out, based off of length and twist rate.

 

[jcnull2305]

I'm not a doctor, and I don't play one on TV, but my 2¢ on the QLA accuracy issue would be that at the point the bullet passes off the rifling and into the QLA region, the gasses are permitted to accelerate past the bullet, but not evenly as they would upon exiting the barrel. I believe this would tend to, or at least have the propensity to kinda kick the bullet in the rear, and knock it all cattywampus.

That's just a theory. But it allowed me to use "cattywampus" in my post. So, there's that...

 

[ronlaughlin]

So.......notdoctor, how do the sub base attenuate the propensity of cattywampusness?