The Myth of the "Cull Spike"

[Semisane]

A small spike will never be a good buck? We named this guy "Funky Ear" when he first showed up in January 2020.

 

[Danaidh]

Research at a local university over 6 years indicated the same effect with even greater pronounced antler growth on spikes or small first year antlered deer. Generally, Given the same food to all deer, the research showed that a 4-6 year old buck [that had only a spike or small rack in it's first year] had larger and considerably more massive racks in the 4-6 year time frame. It is not for sure known why this effect but it was speculated that there was some sort of early life "nutrient saving" going on until later years in the bodies of the mature massively racked deer.

The same research program did show that SOME deer just have inferior genes or lack quality food and stay a spike or small racked into later years. However, one will never know if it is killed in the first or second year of life.

Let them grow up fellers.

 

[TiggerLueb]

We had an issue in my area with what I refer to as a "Utensil Buck," Forked antler and Knife or spike on the other side. At the same time MDC assigned to our hunting area an antler point restriction for adult hunters. The youth hunters were allowed to shoot any deer, if it's brown its down. I even offered to buy my daughters Corvettes if they shot the Utensil Buck he was almost 4 years old. They didn't help with Culling this buck. The next spring my steers went through the property line fence to check out the neighbors massive woodlot. As I searched for them I found the remains of the Utensil Buck. He was rubbing his antlers on two small saplings and got his head stuck. He died a slow agonizing death just feet away from a major deer trail. I haven't seen any of his offspring, so maybe he didn't pass on his antler defect to others?

 

[Bushfire]

Even here a lot of young deer get "culled", I often think it's a justification to pull the trigger. Mind you we have no wanton waste so it's perfectly legal to lop a deers head and leave the meat to rot which many do.

 

[bstorric]

I can only speak for myself but I do not get to hunt much and hunt in heavily pressured public lands out east. I shoot anything that is legal for my first deer of the year (other than fawn unless its getting late in the season). I hunt mainly for the meat and love to cook... I have not found a good recipe for antlers yet. I understand why people want bucks to get passed on and grow bigger antlers but just remember not everyone gets the opportunity to spend alot of time in the woods. So long as its legal, I try not to judge anyone else who hunts differently than myself

 

[retrieverman]

I can only speak for myself but I do not get to hunt much and hunt in heavily pressured public lands out east. I shoot anything that is legal for my first deer of the year (other than fawn unless its getting late in the season). I hunt mainly for the meat and love to cook... I have not found a good recipe for antlers yet. I understand why people want bucks to get passed on and grow bigger antlers but just remember not everyone gets the opportunity to spend alot of time in the woods. So long as its legal, I try not to judge anyone else who hunts differently than myself

I don’t think anyone here is judging, and public land is a whole different deal. You have no control over the management practices and are in constant “competition” with other hunters.
Even those of us hunting small acreage private land have to contend with neighbors that aren’t management minded. I own 380 acres in NW Oklahoma, and I’ve been fortunate to kill several really nice mature bucks in the almost 20 years I’ve been hunting it. My current hunting neighbors are decent guys that actually try to practice QDM, but their need to fill a buck tag sometimes gets the best of them.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

I only miss hunting public land when im sitting in a warm permanent blind surrounded by acres of corn, soybeans, turkeys, deer, and skwirls, raccoons, coyotes, rabbits... I know someday ill be back there, but for now, no judgment on those that are hunting public

 

[TiggerLueb]

I too am a small property owner with just 40 acres to work with. The large wood lot behind me has 1200 acres and maybe 4 hunters. My neighbor to the north with 40 acres, might shoot a big buck so he can brag at the coffee shop about it. I will harvest 2-4 deer a year because it is delicious when prepared correctly but I haven't found any antler stew recipes that I care for.

 

[toytruck]

I only miss hunting public land when im sitting in a warm permanent blind surrounded by acres of corn, soybeans, turkeys, deer, and skwirls, raccoons, coyotes, rabbits... I know someday ill be back there, but for now, no judgment on those that are hunting public

I used to hunt public land (National Forest). We got up very early, drive for an hour then walk in to our hunting area, probably over a mile in. That felt like deer hunting to me back when I was in my 30's, 40's and 50's. Then there was the long drag out, most of the hair would be worn off the deer we killed by the time we got to the truck. Then drive home an hour and start butchering the deer. Oh, to be young again...
Now the forest service had most of the area timbered out, the power company who own the right of way, put a gate at the county road making the walk in even farther. The game commission politicians have allowed bear hunters to train their dogs before the hunting seasons an even have a five day bear season with firearms. So the deer just go down to private lands and feast on corn, beans an apples, etc.
I don't even get the NF permit anymore. I now hunt private farms, one goes where the game is if you want to bring home meat! I have killed my share of deer, nice bucks, does and some small antlered bucks and when they fool me even button bucks (hate that) they all taste real good an look the same in the freezer.

 

[WV Hunter]

Yep Semi, that sums it up in many cases. From everything I've read and what I've seen personally...most of the crummy spikes are just late born deer that put all their energy into growing their body, and leaves little for their first real rack....so they are always behind. I've seen the same thing you showed here - and with age, most bucks can turn into something nice.

And yes, whatever someone wants to take that is legal, by all means. The only one who it matters to is you.

 

[SteveH]

I think the science is pretty clear that there is no way to predict antler growth based on a buck's first year's appearance, other than perhaps some idea of the general geometry (shape). Nonetheless I often hear justifications for shooting that "goofy spike," because he will never have a decent rack. Where I usually hunt, I have the luxury of passing on the little 4 pointers but in any case am more concerned with body size over head gear.

 

[MrTom]

Here in SE Minnesota the four point rule has flooded the herd dynamics with smaller deer and lopsided racks until the adult deer get to about 4 years of age. I'm not certain that the four point rule will be in place again this year...it was passed on last year with covid. Like at least one of my deer sizeable for what I do with the meat. If I keep any of the meat for cooking it'll be the chops. All else goes to jerky or sausage of some sort....this year will be sticks.

I generally try to take a mature buck within the first four days but I also carry a antlerless specific tag management tag and will pop a decent doe early and use that tag so I can keep hunting. My general deer firearms license allows me to take either sex and any age. As far as eating goes, these deer are corn, bean and alfalfa fed animals with acorn suppliments so taste-wise they are superb. Tender-wise is an entirely different story. Some of the toughest deer I've had were the youngest or the smallest. Some of the tenderest deer meat I have ever eaten has come off a couple of the largest bucks I have taken where they were shot and dropped on the spot while simply wandering thru the woods un-disturbed by anything.....other than the bullet. I'm convinced that a lot has to do with whether the deer was on the chase or being chased and to what degree tender is determined. I know that deer which were pushed or were chasing a doe on the run or ran after being shot need to get cooled down as fast as possible or the level of gaminess goes uphill.

 

[Matthew323]

Any animal, especially big game animals, that has built up lactic acid in its muscle tissues is not going to be as tasty as the same animal killed without the lactic acid buildup.

Most of the bad tasting wild game that I have experienced, has resulted from two things.

The first reason is poor meat handling practices, usually resulting from not getting the hide removed, and the meat cooled off quickly enough.

The second reason is an animal killed when it was stressed from being chased. I am convinced that when an animal the size of a whitetail deer, antelope, mule deer, elk, caribou, or moose is frightened, experiences a massive adrenaline dump because it believes that its life is in danger, and then runs any distance that will cause a significant amount of lactic acid to accumulate in its muscles; the combination of the adrenaline & lactic acid will sour the meat.

If the meat is poorly handled as well, then you have a triple whammy perfect storm that renders the flesh of a hard earned game animal to be virtually inedible.

Neither lactic acid, nor adrenaline taste good in, and of themselves. While I have had access to adrenaline as a medic in the Army back when I was on active duty, I never actually tasted any. Same with lactic acid.

But, I do know how I have smelled when coming down off of a massive adrenaline dump/rush from being extremely frightened. My body smelled ranker, and more unpleasant, then I have ever smelled from any amount of exercise, or from not being able to bathe for an extended period of time.

 

[ENCORE50A]

No doubt poor handling after the kill results in a lot of "taste" complaints. However, I've eaten mule deer that was properly handled, immediately skinned and cooled, and couldn't eat it. It tasted like eating a mouth full of sage.

Lactic acid in an unstressed animal at death has muscle glycogen converted into lactic acid, which helps keep meat tender, pink, and flavorful.

Adrenaline on the other hand caused by stress uses up glycogen, which means there’s not enough lactic acid produced postmortem.
This affects different kinds of meat in different ways but, in general it’ll be tough, tasteless, and high in pH, and will go bad quicker than unstressed meat.

 

[mnoland30]

NM had a 3 point or better on one side rule for a couple of years. It included the eye guards, which some mule deer don't have. I saw some nice bucks after the second year. I also saw dead forks, that were shot and abandoned when they realized they weren't legal.

I've tried dragging deer. It is too much work, and results in cactus spines everywhere. I use the gutless method now, and can carry out the meat in several loads if necessary. I can carry out a big deer in two easy loads, and an elk in 3 or 4. Field butchering cools the meat much faster.

I've made every mistake you can think of in caring for meat. I've never had deer that didn't taste good, except for the first one. It ate sagebrush. I've quit hunting deer that eat sage.

Not having a wanton waste law is a shame. Here, they don't require you to take javelina or bear meat. Silly, because both of them taste excellent. George Herter had a great recipe for javelina. Uses pickling spice, and tastes like corned beef.