VA SB 886

Discussion in 'General Topics' started by phenix78_99, Feb 15, 2020.

Modern Muzzleloader

Help Support Modern Muzzleloader:

  1. Feb 15, 2020 #1

    phenix78_99

    phenix78_99

    phenix78_99

    Supporter Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2016
    Messages:
    273
    Likes Received:
    118
    I know we all have our opinions about what is happening in Virginia. On the whole, I do not like the majority of the proposed legislation coming up for this session. I think much of the proposed legislation is absolutely an infringement on gun owner rights, and I am not happy with it, although, in the spirit of full disclosure, I do believe in universal background checks for firearms transactions, including private sales transactions.

    That said, if my life has taught me anything, it is that you have to take the good with the bad, and this bill is a small bright spot in the largely dark legislative session: http://lis.virginia.gov/cgi-bin/legp604.exe?201+sum+SB886 Although it is no longer moving forward, at least it was considered, which means people are thinking.

    I have not shared an experience from this past hunting season with you all, yet, but I think now is the appropriate time given the fact that I have received much venom for expressing my mostly negative sentiments here regarding using hounds for hunting deer (and the right to retrieve law - which, in my opinion, is an infringement on landowner rights). I want you all here to know that I support legal and ethical hunting, whether hounds are used or not, and I want to stand shoulder to shoulder with ethical hunters to keep our hunting tradition alive for myself and subsequent generations. I think the reason folks have been upset with me is because they lack perspective on the reality here. in my neck of the woods.

    In late December, I was home for the weekend, and as many weekends in December require, I was trying to catch hounds running deer across our property. When I was unable to catch the dogs on one portion of our property, I took our UTV back to the house to recover from the morning. As I approached the house, my father was standing in our driveway, and waved me down. When I turned the UTV off, I could hear a man on the road, about 40 yards from the entrance to my aging parents' home, yelling unintelligibly. My father then told me this guy had been yelling at my father and asking my father if he had a problem with him, while my Dad was walking our new German Shepherd pup in our front yard. So, I decided to walk down to the road to deescalate things. Well, as I approached the edge of our property, just prior to the ditch line, this guy, and his wife sitting in his truck, let me have it. They yelled and swore at me from the road, calling me things that I will not post here. I have been on active duty military service or in law enforcement for the past 19 years, and I have been verbally dressed down in English, Pashto, Farsi, French, German, Arabic, Spanish, Mandarin Chinese, and probably some other languages I don't recall, and this guy and his wife could hold their own with the best of them.

    The most ironic thing was that I had not spoken a word to them, and I did not for the next 23 minutes of their tirade, as I waited on the Conservation Police Officer (CPO) to arrive, who had been out here earlier that morning. All I did was record their tirade, and when the CPO arrived, I identified myself as a law enforcement officer, informed the CPO I was armed, and asked if he wanted me to disarm before I approached. You should have seen the look on this guy's face when he heard me say I was a law enforcement officer; I could have picked his jaw up off of the pavement. Anyway, during the four way interaction, this guy continued to passively insult my father by asking him about his sexual orientation, among other things, with no response from the CPO. I can't blame the CPO, though, he was new and overwhelmed by the situation. As such, with his concurrence, I guided the conversation to inform this guy that what he had just engaged in was, in my professional opinion, a violation of Virginia Code (I am a former Virginia State Trooper). Anyway, the CPO reviewed the video, and agreed. In the end, we all went our separate ways. By the way, this guy doesn't live here, or own property here; he lives about an hour and a half away. He told me that he had been hunting out here since he was a boy, and that his family had been here since the 1800's, long before my family moved out here, like that even matters. Afterwards, I swore out a summons against the guy with the local magistrate for a violation of Virginia Code 18.2-416. Luckily, I had the background to successfully do so; I can't imagine what the average citizen would do, not being well versed in how to go about doing so. The CPO (and his supervisor) asked me to swear the summons out based on the fact that it was a suspected criminal code violation, which was not in his wheelhouse.

    From that day until the end of the season, we had trucks driving by the house and incessantly honking their horns, shots fired after dark on the land this guy was "hunting," to include one at 1900 on the last day of the season. These shots were close enough for us to hear the compression of the shots in the house. It's hard to describe that, but I think most of you will know what I mean. On a weekday, while I was not here, according to my mother who saw him, one of the guys we see hunting with this guy parked in our neighbor's driveway, jumped out of his truck, ran across the road to his lease just on the side of the road, and fired ten successive rounds from a shotgun, ran back to his truck, and sped off. This is what we deal with here; this is just as bad, if not worse, as some of the crazy legislation being introduced here. This is why I think the way I think, not because I hate hunting or hunting with hounds. I greatly respect ethical hunters, and I count myself as one. As ethical hunters, we have to separate ourselves from folks like this to preserve our privilege to hunt, legally.

    Once this matter has been dealt with in the local General District Court, I will post back here. I will also post a link to the video of this guy, and his wife, doing their thing, on YouTube, so that you can make your own decision(s). At the conclusion of it all, I also plan on sending the video/YouTube link to every media outlet willing to listen, as well as every member in our state legislature, until someone does something.
     
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2020
    steve egan and D55 like this.
  2. Feb 15, 2020 #2

    toytruck

    toytruck

    toytruck

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2005
    Messages:
    2,477
    Likes Received:
    268
    Location:
    Virginia
    You handled that situation better than I would have, especially when parents are involved. No sense in people acting like that. Best of luck in court!
     
  3. Feb 15, 2020 #3

    D55

    D55

    D55

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 7, 2018
    Messages:
    240
    Likes Received:
    124
    I agree with how you handled it and agree with toytruck that I would not have dealt with the situation with the same grace that you did. It is not always popular to do the right thing.
     
  4. Feb 15, 2020 #4

    j_jim

    j_jim

    j_jim

    Supporter Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 15, 2019
    Messages:
    24
    Likes Received:
    14
    Location:
    SE VA
    The "I've hunted here for years" mentality and the manner with which they carry on regardless of whom they encroach on is frustrating, and difficult to deal with sanely. They usually come in numbers physically, not mentally.
     
  5. Feb 15, 2020 #5

    Mnt monkey

    Mnt monkey

    Mnt monkey

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2020
    Messages:
    244
    Likes Received:
    333
    I have a place in Southwest Arkansas once they start running dogs there's no point in even trying to deer hunt anymore,,I live in Southeast Texas when I was a kid you could run dogs and of course everyone did a lot of hunting out of season 2 they made it against the law and strictly enforced it when I was a kid at that age if you saw one deer or two deer for the whole two months deer season in Southeast Texas you were lucky and you had to just shoot that deer cuz you weren't going to see another one,, now there's deer everywhere and really good trophy deer,ever seen the look on a deer's face that's been run hard for 4 or 5 hours ,the hunters with the dogs come from the three states around Arkansas because they can't run them in their own States anymore,to make things worse three-quarters of the people running the dogs aren't even hunting they're just out running the dogs because they enjoy it,,many of the backwood hayseed dog runners have no idea how good the Hunting could be in their states if they would just back off the dog running,, I get that all this is our tradition I grew up with that tradition,, man I need to settle down I will,, better not catch dogs running on my place that's all I have to say.... And I guess would say this to all you deer dog people,,get you some catahoulas and go run hogs if you want something exciting leave them deer alone.. down there in Texas they put hot rod people like you ran across in jail we used to have a lot of people like that down here they started enforcing the game laws especially to the jerks, they'll put you in jail for trespassing down here now
     
    Ninering62 likes this.
  6. Feb 15, 2020 #6

    toytruck

    toytruck

    toytruck

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2005
    Messages:
    2,477
    Likes Received:
    268
    Location:
    Virginia
    VA.started asking if you used dog's when checking a deer by phone in 2018. Not sure what that means in the future for hunting with dogs.
    It's only legal East of the blue ridge mountains, but that doesn't stop some.
     
    Ninering62 likes this.
  7. Feb 16, 2020 #7

    Sideshow

    Sideshow

    Sideshow

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2019
    Messages:
    1,556
    Likes Received:
    608
    Location:
    Michigan
    Wow what a TERRIBLE situation to find yourself in !!!! Geez what a Mess !!!!! Your poor folks gotta be really afraid . So many of those clowns just love the idea of gettin back at you too . Better keep a close eye on them !!! Id ask the local police to do the same !!!
    Sure am glad my state doesnt allow running dogs on deer !!!
     
    Ninering62 and michiganmuzzy like this.
  8. Feb 17, 2020 #8

    Idaholewis

    Idaholewis

    Idaholewis

    Supporter Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2017
    Messages:
    4,139
    Likes Received:
    970
    I have been 1 that Met phenix78_99 with Resistance about Hound Hunting. Fact is, We live in 2 VERY different Parts of the World, WHAT a Sad deal that Hound Hunters would be like that there! All i can say Is that DOES NOT Represent The Hound Hunters out West here where i have Grown up, and in the Time Period i was Around it, NOTHING CLOSE to that!!

    I hate to see Sportsman Disagree, and Divide, It’s usually never a Good thing, I also feel In some cases it is necessary. Sad part is, When they Start Taking Stuff Away, That is just the TIP of the Iceberg of What’s to Come!! I have Seen it, LIVED IT! Wa State, They Took away Hound Hunting, They also put a STOP to Fishing the Rivers i Grew up Fishing, The place is a SAD Shell of what it use to be, Ran by SNOW FLAKES. I was born n Raised there, Spent 38 Years of my Life there. I have Lots of Family, and Friends there. I moved away 10 Years ago, I haven’t been Back, and if all goes as planned, i will NEVER EVER see that Country Again as long as i live. I have memories of what it use to be, I prefer to keep and Cherish those in my Mind, Than go back over to Visit and look at What a SAD Mess it has Become

    I grew up in a Hound Hunting Family, My Dad was an AVID Hound Hunter, I have a Few picture Albums FULL of His Hound Stuff. Most of Our Friends hunted Hounds. What you Speak of There, is ABSOLUTELY NOTHING like anything i have ever seen, or heard of out West here with Hound Hunters. This Country is EXPANSE with MILES N MILES of Mountains, And Mountain Rds, LOTS of State And Forrest Service Land. Running across Private Land isn’t something that happens a Bunch, Though it DOES Happen! But the Hound Hunters and Land Owners usually Get along Well, I can’t remember my Dad ever having issues with Anyone over his Dogs getting on their Land? He use to Coon hunt at Night on the River Bottoms, He ended up on Private Land often on those types of Hunts, BUT Dad also Knew Everyone (Small Town) and they Knew My Dad. Most everyone in the Area Grew up together, or knew one another Some way or Another?

    The above would likely be IMPOSSIBLE this Day n Age, My Dad Wouldn’t Know Everyone anymore? Most of the Old timers, Property owners back then are LONG GONE. Their Property bought up by New owners, Out of Towners, Out of State Transplants, Etc. It’s a Different Time we live in these Days, that’s for sure!

    One has to Remember, An animal being Pursued by hound Dogs, and the Hounds themselves Know NO PROPERTY LINES, BOUNDARIES? They simply end up, where they end up. If they end up on Private Land It would be up to the Hound Hunter to Approach the Land Owner And Work the Situation out. Hopefully peacefully, But what happens if the Land Owner JUMPS ALL OVER the Hunter for Trespassing? And is TOTALLY unreasonable about the Situation? REMEMBER, The HUNTER Had ZERO Control of WHERE the Quarry, and Dogs Ultimately Ended up, it WASN’T The Hound Hunters Choice. What is the Hound Hunter to do if he Meets UNREALISTIC Resistance from a Land Owner? I can see where this could get NASTY if a Land Owner Went BALLISTIC on a Hound Hunter.
     
    Ninering62 likes this.
  9. Feb 17, 2020 #9

    toytruck

    toytruck

    toytruck

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 23, 2005
    Messages:
    2,477
    Likes Received:
    268
    Location:
    Virginia
    I can see your point Lewis. There is still no excuse for the hound/dog owners or whatever for acting like they did. Curse/abuse is against the law as well as firing a gun on or near a roadway towards a home to intimidate. I don't own a dog never had a hunting dog. I do have personal experience with hunting dogs with friends for rabbits that was much fun.

    I have also been on National Forrest during bear hunting season where dogs are running to chase bear. Deer seasons are also open. On more than one occasion I saw first hand bear dogs running deer. Most bear dog owners here will deny that their dogs don't do that, but I have seen it. Also dog owners here in western VA. where chasing deer is illegal have set their dogs out on the edge of other property owners land so they will chase the deer to another side of said property to be shot off that property by their family/friends that are waiting. I have been hunting on said private property when this has happened! It gives hunters a bad name to say the least not to mention not sportsman like or legal.
     
    Ninering62, steve egan and Idaholewis like this.
  10. Feb 17, 2020 #10

    Idaholewis

    Idaholewis

    Idaholewis

    Supporter Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2017
    Messages:
    4,139
    Likes Received:
    970
    I FULLY AGREE!! The Behavior Described Above is ABSOLUTELY UNCALLED For, NO EXCUSE For that Amount of Ridiculousness!

    Simply Put, We are in a different Day n Age, Back When my Dad Was AVID with Hounds, People were FAR MORE Understanding of your Dogs crossing Their Property on the occasion it happened. Heck, Many of them would have invited you to Hunt on their Property, My Dad got plenty of Bear over the Years that were DESTROYING Fruit Trees Etc. This Day n Age folks are FAR more likely to Get Mad Over Hounds on their Property.

    Running Deer with Hounds here is NOT a Sport, and something NOT Tolerated. It is a Death Sentence for the Dog if the Owner isn’t on Top of the Situation trying to get his Dog Caught. It is ILLEGAL Here to intentionally Run Deer, NO HOUND Hunter here wants their Dog to Run Deer, it is one the 1st Lessons a Hound Pup learns, they Get BROKE off Deer!

    Again, 2 VERY Different Areas, And Way’s of doing things.
     
    Ninering62, Mnt monkey and toytruck like this.
  11. Feb 17, 2020 #11

    phenix78_99

    phenix78_99

    phenix78_99

    Supporter Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2016
    Messages:
    273
    Likes Received:
    118
    "But what happens if the Land Owner JUMPS ALL OVER the Hunter for Trespassing? And is TOTALLY unreasonable about the Situation? REMEMBER, The HUNTER Had ZERO Control of WHERE the Quarry, and Dogs Ultimately Ended up, it WASN’T The Hound Hunters Choice. What is the Hound Hunter to do if he Meets UNREALISTIC Resistance from a Land Owner? I can see where this could get NASTY if a Land Owner Went BALLISTIC on a Hound Hunter."

    The key word in your quote is "Trespassing." In Virginia, trespassing is a crime, sir. How would you respond to a landowner adjacent to your property growing marijuana which spread just over your property line because he didn't properly control it? After all, the plants know "NO PROPERTY LINES, BOUNDARIES." How would you define a "TOTALLY unreasonable" response to this activity, which is in fact illegal, in this situation? Ignorance of property lines and the inability, or unwillingness, to control their dogs, or stop them from crossing onto private land is not a legitimate defense, and doesn't make trespassing any less illegal. They either need to train and control their dogs better, or hunt land masses large enough to preclude this from happening, or both. If you can't see this, it's because you choose not to, for whatever illogical and indefensible reason that may be.

    Further, I challenge you to define "UNREALISTIC Resistance from a Land Owner," when these people, whom you count as fellow "Sportsman" stand on the road calling you a "fuc#$%^ fag$%^", a "fuc&*() bit#$", for 23 minutes, even though you have not spoken a single word to them,as you stand on your own property. Then, they call your 70 year old Vietnam Veteran father who grew up in a house with dirt floors and five brothers and sisters, who worked and scrounged from the age of 9 years old to save enough money to buy a farm and give his family a wonderful life a "fag$%^" right in front of you. And they do this all because you are trying to keep their dogs off of your property so you can use it in the way you wish, by hunting the way you desire to do so, and are trying to prevent them from infringing on that ability.

    This is not a "divide" between "Sportsman," it is a divide between criminals and law abiding citizens. Which side are you on? I'm not sure you know. I would remind you that once you own a property, you are afforded landowner's rights; hunting, wherever you choose to do so, is a privilege. There is a legal difference. Further, I would also remind you that our land is not portable, but hounds are, so the onus is on the "hound hunters" to control their portable property while engaging in a privilege, not on the landowner to accommodate their desire to hunt in anyway they wish to do so. Any reasonable person would agree with this, as would any court of law.

    Anyway, for those of you who have mentioned my grace in handling this situation, I cannot accept this compliment without reservation. My love for my family, my desire to keep my job and provide for my family, my desire to handle things in a manner consistent with the Federal, State and Biblical laws I am required to abide by, my desire to keep my freedom and not to go to jail, and my desire not to lose my credibility as a law enforcement officer, are what keep/kept me in check. I will not become a criminal to fight the criminals; it is a challenge, as it has always been, but I refuse to do so. I can only hope that this whole situation, and resulting conclusions, will be the catalysts that finally motivate the legislature of this Commonwealth to wake up to what goes on here and do something about it. Personally, I do hope that hunting deer with hounds is eventually done away with here, as the "hound hunters" have continually, and increasingly, shown a completely abject inability and unwillingness to conduct themselves in a legal and ethical manner.

    For those of you who support me, I appreciate it. For those of you that don't, I understand, and respect your opinion, no matter what it is; I have served to protect and defend this right for you, and me, and I would never deny it to you.
     
    Wild Thing, Mnt monkey and toytruck like this.
  12. Feb 17, 2020 #12

    Idaholewis

    Idaholewis

    Idaholewis

    Supporter Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2017
    Messages:
    4,139
    Likes Received:
    970
    I was hesitant about even responding above, But I did, i was Nice and Polite, And I stand by what i said.

    As I’ve said, i come from a hound hunting Background, Though i chose not to do it myself, i grew up around it. Therefore i stand on the Side of the Men that Hunt Their Hounds. What you Describe their in Virginia is NOT the Way it is out West here, at least not the Hound Hunters i know, Grew up with and was Around all of my Life, including the Few Hound Hunters i have Met here since Living in Idaho. These are a Darn Good bunch of Guy’s, That Work hard, and Hunt Hard. I hope their Sport lives on STRONG
     
    Ninering62 likes this.
  13. Feb 17, 2020 #13

    Idaholewis

    Idaholewis

    Idaholewis

    Supporter Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2017
    Messages:
    4,139
    Likes Received:
    970
    I would Grab a Lawn Chair, Sit down And BURN one! Then go Shoot a Muzzleloader :lewis:
     
    Ninering62, twild, Sideshow and 2 others like this.
  14. Feb 17, 2020 #14

    Mnt monkey

    Mnt monkey

    Mnt monkey

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 7, 2020
    Messages:
    244
    Likes Received:
    333
    I absolutely love dogs and hunting dogs , and I wish I could say that most of the dog owners that I grew up aroundwere like the men described out west who had honor, I've lived out watching our deer herd here in Southeast Texas go from absolutely nothing to the good hunting that it is today, again I grew up in a traditional hound hunting family and yes my grandpa cousins and brothers would run those dogs year round like all the others, I went with him as a child many timesI remember getting set somewhere by my grandpa and told just stay here the deer will cross here I remember sitting there on a stump watching that poor Doe run down the trail with the group of Walker hounds on her I remember the look on her face as she ran by broke my heart still, someone mentioned earlier that we should stay United I don't even consider hound hunting to be hunting,, the dogs are doing the hunting you're not ,hard for me to philosophically be United with hunters that aren't hunting, I'invite all of you to Southwest Arkansas you'll find a hunting wonderful until the dogs start running, climb up your stand and try hunting after it starts ,wont see a deer for the rest of the year,and the spirit and attitude of the people running the dogs is exactly what this gentleman described. 80% of the menI've been around that run dogs could care less about your private land rights they don't care if they mess your hunting up and they're ready to fight and beat you up if you say anything,I'm so much against it I don't care if all the dog runners are men of Honor and preachers and pastors I'm against their dog running simply because of what I see it doing to the deer herd and deer behavior people are jerks it doesn't matter whether they run dogs or not even man who don't run dogs are jerks aren't they? I'm not against dog running because of the honor or dishonor of a man ,I'm against dog running because it dishonors the deer herd,, a touchy subject isn't it
     
    Wild Thing and toytruck like this.
  15. Feb 17, 2020 #15

    Idaholewis

    Idaholewis

    Idaholewis

    Supporter Supporter

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2017
    Messages:
    4,139
    Likes Received:
    970
    Like i said Above on Running Deer Around here with Hound Dogs, it is 100% illegal to Knowingly do so, These guy’s Work diligently to BREAK their Dogs from Running Deer, it is the 1st Lesson a Hound Pup is Taught here. ANY idaho/Wa Resident that I personally know that Caught Dogs Running Deer, Without the owner Trying to Stop the Situation would KILL Them in a RAPID Heart Beat, that is including myself, in Fact i have Killed Dogs for it in Wa, The Game Dept would BACK YOU UP 100% For doing so. Dogs Running Deer is NOT TOLERATED HERE

    https://idfg.idaho.gov/press/dogs-and-deer-do-not-mix

    Idaho law also provides that, "Any dog found running, harassing, attacking, or killing deer or any other big game animal may be destroyed...by any peace officer." This does not provide legal standing to all persons to remove offending dogs, only Apeace officers.
     
    Mnt monkey and toytruck like this.
  16. Feb 17, 2020 #16

    ENCORE50A

    ENCORE50A

    ENCORE50A

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2009
    Messages:
    3,630
    Likes Received:
    883
    Location:
    NELP
    Shooting and killing another owners dog, short of some state's laws pertaining to attack, livestock, poultry, etc, opens up the shooter to civil action. Some civil actions have resulted in very high restitution to the actual owner who's dog was killed. That's not to mention all the other legal costs, attorneys etc. the shooter will pay.
    Always best to let law enforcement do their job.
    I can't stand slob hunters.
     
    Sideshow and phenix78_99 like this.
  17. Feb 17, 2020 #17

    Sideshow

    Sideshow

    Sideshow

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 15, 2019
    Messages:
    1,556
    Likes Received:
    608
    Location:
    Michigan
    In Michigan the bow season and ruffled grouse season overlap . I was on state land hunting ruffs with my pair of Brittanys . Pretty close working dogs . I never saw that bowhunter on the backside of a tree or id have called my dogs and changed directions . This guy stood and actually drew on my male britt !!!! I quickly told him "you drop that dog and i'll drop you" . The bead was on him . I called them in and we left that immediate area . The whole time he got a Loud Earfull . Stuff happens while hunting but there was No Good Reason for that guy to Draw on my dog . And Yes i Would Have Shot all 5 rounds . My dogs wore bells and work close . A simple stand up and arm wave could have prevented ALL of This long before we got close . I got more respect for a Dog than an AXX like THAT .
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2020
    ported45, twild and michiganmuzzy like this.
  18. Feb 17, 2020 #18

    phenix78_99

    phenix78_99

    phenix78_99

    Supporter Supporter

    Joined:
    Jan 3, 2016
    Messages:
    273
    Likes Received:
    118
    For what it is worth, I very much respect your opinion, and personally appreciate the manner in which you have shared it. Without civil discourse, nothing separates us from the animals.

    I think you are saying here that you would smoke some marijuana, then go shooting. I would respectfully caution you against using any illicit drug and handling a firearm, for your safety and the safety of those around you. Further, I do not know the state/local legality of using marijuana where you are, but I would also caution you against breaking the law in doing so, as there may be repercussions for doing so that may negatively impact your life, and the lives of your family members. Finally, there may be a chance that the marijuana consumed, unless one grows it himself, has in some way, supported other criminal activity, so I would ask you to consider that before sparking up. If I have misinterpreted this post, please disregard this portion of my reply, with an apology for misunderstanding you.

    As far as it pertains to "hound hunters" here in the Commonwealth, and their "honor," please see the following link: https://www.dgif.virginia.gov/wp-content/uploads/deer-hunting-with-dogs.pdf

    This is a report from 2017 from the VDGIF, and I would specifically refer you to page 5. On this page, a map of the Commonwealth indicates that up to 25.8% of the complaints the VDGIF gets from the citizenry deal with hound hunting, where my family lives (see the red portion of the map). Further, in the text, the writer of the report concedes that "dispatch data should be viewed as a conservative reflection of all dog-related complaints received by VDGIF." Although the state average is approximately 4.9%, I would remind you that hunting with hounds is only legal in about 50% of the Commonwealth, so the counties that where "hound hunting" is illegal are factored into the equation, which lowers the overall percentage. However, you will also notice that there are some complaints regarding hunting with hounds in those counties even where it is illegal. Gentlemen, I would submit to you this suggests that this is not a problem unique to a small number of "hound hunters."

    Actually, the portion of the Idaho law you have posted here states that the dog may only be "destroyed" by a peace officer. However, it does not say that only a peace officer may "remove" the offending animal(s). There is a distinct difference there. I will NEVER shoot a hunting dog unless s/he is attacking me or our house dogs...ever..whether it is legal or not. When we catch and remove dogs here, we love on them, feed them, love on them, then take them to the pound so that they can get the medical treatment they seem to ALWAYS need, based on the fact they are bags of bones and have damaged pads. We have no anger against the poor animal who never asked for the life they have, or the neglect they receive. The dog would not be there if their negligent owner conducted him/herself in an ethical, responsible, and in some cases, legal manner.

    For what it is worth coming from me, this post is absolutely dripping with good wisdom and ethics. I thank you for who you are sir.

    On a brighter note, the so called "assault weapon ban" bill was rejected today in my Commonwealth. Four Democrats broke ranks and voted with Republicans to defeat the bill. It appears as if commons sense took the day...
     
    toytruck and NatureNick like this.
  19. Feb 17, 2020 #19

    NatureNick

    NatureNick

    NatureNick

    Supporter Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2008
    Messages:
    87
    Likes Received:
    90
    Location:
    Iowa
    Lewis, any tips on ensuring reliable ignition with that smokepole?

    (Just going for a little levity there - as, I'm sure, was Lewis.)
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2020
  20. Feb 17, 2020 #20

    Rockman

    Rockman

    Rockman

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2019
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    45
    Location:
    Central MN
    Insinuating someone is smoking weed, and shooting, in any thread here at MML? Are you serious? This thread is starting to swirl the drain,folks...
     

Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page

Group Builder
arrow_white