When the stars align....

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MrTom

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When I hit the club to shoot I generally take one of the rifles [either the .45 Kodiak or the .50 Accura] and the Optima pistol. All three guns are well sighted-in, both rifles at 100 yards and the pistol at 50, and my shooting is nothing more than form maintenance. I take a few shots at the bench then I stand and use one of the 6X6 uprights as a vertical rest much like I would if I were using the side of a tree to take a couple shots with both whatever rifle and the pistol. The pistol I also take shots at 25 both sitting and standing using the upright. About every other trip to the range, I'll stretch the rifles out to 150 yards both sitting and standing so I know can do it if needed but on deer I seldom have shots over 30 yards. To end each range session with the rifles I shoot a couple shots off-hand at the 100 yards, just to stay in touch with it if I need it.

I'm a real die hard stand hunter and once I'm in there I seldom leave it except for about 10 minutes every three hours or so to take a leak and basically just stand to let blood run normally in the legs. I let the gun down and go to the ground and walk around the immediate stand area for circulation's sake then got back to the stand. Twice on my little exercise expeditions I have shot deer that happened along, off-hand. But still, off-hand is my least preferable shot, paper or hair.

A couple years ago the nephew wanted to hunt my stand as I had already filled my tags, so I said have at it and I went back along the ridge and took a ground stand on a large boulder that allowed me to see a wide sweeping hillside with a sharp drop of about 60 degrees from top to bottom. The woods are super clean along the hillside with a short "bench" that parallels a gravel road that follows the bottom. That bench is a superhighway for deer migrating from across the road or going form out land to the neighbors across the road. I set up on my rock and wasn't situated for more than 20 minutes when a bunch of does and fawns came along on our land on that bench, head for the road. They all stopped and watched the road and seemed not to be in a hurry, so I shouldered the Accura and took stock of what was there. One was a large doe and the kid had two open tags, so I took a deep breath, let some air out and settled the crosshairs on her. Now remember, I'm shooting downhill at around 60 degrees, so the point of aim was a little foreign to me, totally un-practiced. When in my mind's eye the crosshairs were where I thought they should be I squeezed the shot off. That doe staggered and dropped, then got up and wobbled and followed the other deer as they continued around the base of the hill on the bench. I waited 15 minutes and then reloaded and slid down the hill, there's simply no such thing as walking down the hill. I got to the log that was my landmark and found where she hit the snow and blood was everywhere. I only had to go about 35 yards and there she was piled up against a tree where the other deer had dropped down and crossed the road. When I opened her up I found that the Barnes 250 grain XPB had trashed her heart and both lungs. After dressing her out I scaled that slippery such of a hill and went back to the kid, who in my absence had popped a small doe and was finishing up. I told him what I had down so now he was one happy dude. Neither one of use heard the other shoot, I guess it was just the lay of the land. He slid his deer down the hill to the road and fetched his truck while I took his rangefinder and walked back along the top of the ridge to mu big rock. I'd left my gun and pack where the deer I shot had originally dropped and based on my tracks around the rock to where the pack could be seen the range was 167 yards,

I honestly think that the stars aligned for me on that shot. In after-thought I'd never take a shot like that again. I never, ever, have had anywhere to practice with a drop of that severity and distance, let along totally off-hand. I've shot the distance off a bench on flat ground but never under those circumstances. I guess I just felt confident.

How many of you shoot at distance off-hand as practice. How many of you practice shooting downhill? The ridge I hunt has radical slopes on both sides of it but for the life of me I have never had an opportunity to practice downhill shots especially the kind of downhill I hunt next to.
 
It would seem to me that gravity would have less effect on bullet drop shooting down hill. I say this because I've never practiced that myself. I really don't know how you would practice a down hill shot.
 
I,m not a physics expert, but I wouldn't worry in the least about taking that shot. I know there is some kind of trajectory issue when it comes to hunting with a bow when a steep angle comes into play, but a bullet is traveling so much faster that I wouldn't worry about it at all at under 100 yards. Just keep in mind where you hit that deer isn't going to be where the bullet exits, based on the trajectory. When I am taking a shot at a steep angle, I always make sure my POA is high because that bullet is going to travel down through the body and exit low (assuming it exits). I know some range finders are sold with "angle compensation" but it has been awhile since I have read about it. I bow hunt whenever it isn't gun season, but almost exclusively from the ground so I didn't pay a great deal of attention to the angle compensation information. Might be something you want to look into
 
Well congrats on getting that doe but I don't know if its legal where you live to shoot a deer and use someone elses tag. Definately not here in PA.
Secondly, on that steep angle, if you were using a range finder that doesn't account for that, your range was probly less than 100 yards. You need only to be concerned with the horizontal distance.
 
It would seem to me that gravity would have less effect on bullet drop shooting down hill. I say this because I've never practiced that myself. I really don't know how you would practice a down hill shot.
gravity is consistent regardless if you're shooting uphill, downhill or level. the reason you will shoot higher shooting up or down is because the line of sight distance is longer and you will think its farther than it is. Example: Say your shooting at a severe up hill angle at a deer. From your perspective that deer is 200 yards away when in actuality only 75 yards is affected by gravity.
(you have 2 range finders one without angle compensation distance = 200 yards, one with compensation distance = 75 yards due to the angle. It doesn't matter if its up or down) That is why people say your bullet hits higher
Another point I've read is this. If you were to shoot a bullet out of a perfectly level barrel across perfectly level ground and dropped a same bullet from the same height at the same time they would both hit the ground at the same time even though the one fired will have traveled a much greater distance. Reason - gravity is consistent.
 
up/down hill doesn't come into play here in Florida really, but it also doesn't really matter. As far as gravity and that whole 9.8m/s/s drop rate thing goes, all it cares about is the straight "bottom" flat line from you to the target. Think about a triangle, you are at small pointy end, target is up at the top of the big end, the long flat side is parallel to gravity NOT local ground slope. The linear distance (straight line you to deer) is longer than the actual gravity pull distance (from you straight out until it is directly under deer)
 
It would seem to me that gravity would have less effect on bullet drop shooting down hill. I say this because I've never practiced that myself. I really don't know how you would practice a down hill shot.
Shooting uphill or downhill has no affect on bullet trajectory....none..zero. The only force affecting you're trajectory is gravity. The reason you miss high when shooting uphill or downhill is because you misjudge the distance. If you are shooting uphill or downhill your line of sight will always be more than the actual horizontal distance (the distance that is affected by gravity). For example, if you were shooting down off a high bluff and the deer was 400 yards (line of sight) your horizontal distance may only be 150 yards. If you shoot thinking the range was 400 yards you would shoot way over it. Same as if shooting uphill.
 
When shooting from a tree stand, it all depends on the height of the stand and the distance from the base of the stand to the target. The steeper the angle the more you have to adjust. I would suggest placing tall targets at different distances and check it out. Hills as well. I have shot over deer shooting down a steep hill, because I failed to adjust. { there are parts of the country that don't know what a hill is, We are infected by them} I learned this in archery, but it does apply to a bullets trajectory as well.....I may have some disagreement but I am convinced by my failures and verification by my tests.
 
I think the problem most have when shooting steep up or down angles is poa.
If when shooting downhill, your shot hits center on entrance and exits a lot lower. If your bullet is traveling at a 45 degree angle the exit will be 12" lower than its entry if the deers body is 12" wide
 
I practice shooting offhand after I've got my muzzleloader dialed in. I like to hunt on the ground a good bit and therefore I practice shooting offhand.
 
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