600 Yard .50 Cal Patched Roundball

[Matthew323]

Lewis,

I love that you push the envelope with the round ball and distance.

You are correct in that I am POSITIVE that I WOULD NOT want to be hit in the chest over my heart by even a .40 caliber patched ball propelled by 50-60 grains by volume of Swiss black powder at 200 yards.

While on paper that 92.4 grain pure lead ball would show terrible BALLISTICS at 100 yards, much less 200 yards; I AM ABSOLUTELY SURE THAT I WOULD NOT WANT TO BE THE HUMAN STANDING STILL TO PROVE HOW INEFFICIENT A PATCHED BALL AT 200 YARDS IS.

That being said it is commonly accepted that unless one has exceptional eyesight, a patched ball rifle is basicly a 100 yard weapon. This is presuming that traditional 18th/19th Century sights set at 18th/19th Century distances are being used with those exceptional eyes.

If the hunter feels the need to hunt out to 150 yards, then to have adequate penetration on elk/moose sized game with a quartering shot; then the caliber must be increased, so that the ball's weight is increased, so that penetration may be increased.

This generally means at least .58 caliber, some say .62 caliber, others argue for .66 caliber. As caliber goes up to keep trajectory as flat as possible, so does recoil increase.

Balls are 0.005" under bore diameter
.58 caliber = 284.987 grains
.62 caliber = 348.696 grains
.66 caliber = 421.255 grains

To take advantage of a flat trajectory it is usually necessary to slow down the rate of twist in the rifling in order to not strip patches with heavy powder charges.

This is where the design of the English Sporting Rifle comes into play. It mitigates recoil better than any other traditional stock design. It is the basis from which ALL MODERN STOCK DESIGNS HAVE EVOLVED. Especially if one adds a modern recoil pad to the stock.

Patched balls kill exceptionally well, FAR BETTER than their paper ballistics would indicate. For the most part the ball is a under 75 yards projectile. Which is OK, because that is where the vast majority of American game is shot.

If you have got the eyes to see to shoot it, and the youth to tote a heavy patched ball rifle around; then by all means stretch it out to 150 yards if you feel your skills are up to ethically harvesting game at those distances.

 

[Ninering62]

Lewis,

I love that you push the envelope with the round ball and distance.

You are correct in that I am POSITIVE that I WOULD NOT want to be hit in the chest over my heart by even a .40 caliber patched ball propelled by 50-60 grains by volume of Swiss black powder at 200 yards.

While on paper that 92.4 grain pure lead ball would show terrible BALLISTICS at 100 yards, much less 200 yards; I AM ABSOLUTELY SURE THAT I WOULD NOT WANT TO BE THE HUMAN STANDING STILL TO PROVE HOW INEFFICIENT A PATCHED BALL AT 200 YARDS IS.

That being said it is commonly accepted that unless one has exceptional eyesight, a patched ball rifle is basicly a 100 yard weapon. This is presuming that traditional 18th/19th Century sights set at 18th/19th Century distances are being used with those exceptional eyes.

If the hunter feels the need to hunt out to 150 yards, then to have adequate penetration on elk/moose sized game with a quartering shot; then the caliber must be increased, so that the ball's weight is increased, so that penetration may be increased.

This generally means at least .58 caliber, some say .62 caliber, others argue for .66 caliber. As caliber goes up to keep trajectory as flat as possible, so does recoil increase.

Balls are 0.005" under bore diameter
.58 caliber = 284.987 grains
.62 caliber = 348.696 grains
.66 caliber = 421.255 grains

To take advantage of a flat trajectory it is usually necessary to slow down the rate of twist in the rifling in order to not strip patches with heavy powder charges.

This is where the design of the English Sporting Rifle comes into play. It mitigates recoil better than any other traditional stock design. It is the basis from which ALL MODERN STOCK DESIGNS HAVE EVOLVED. Especially if one adds a modern recoil pad to the stock.

Patched balls kill exceptionally well, FAR BETTER than their paper ballistics would indicate. For the most part the ball is a under 75 yards projectile. Which is OK, because that is where the vast majority of American game is shot.

If you have got the eyes to see to shoot it, and the youth to tote a heavy patched ball rifle around; then by all means stretch it out to 150 yards if you feel your skills are up to ethically harvesting game at those distances.

Awesome post Bruce.

 

[sdporter]

Lewis,

I love that you push the envelope with the round ball and distance.
Patched balls kill exceptionally well, FAR BETTER than their paper ballistics would indicate. For the most part the ball is a under 75 yards projectile. Which is OK, because that is where the vast majority of American game is shot.

I have to agree with most of your post, however, out here in the west, at least where I hunt, very seldom is a big game animal taken, during a rifle hunt, inside of 100 yards. Most of everything I’ve shot, has been 100 plus yards, the last four in order from most recent, 200 yards, 180 yards, 130 yards, 347 yards. Only the 347 was verified with a range finder. Those were all centerfire .30-06, all mule deer, all moving targets, except the 180 yard shot, that was a cow elk, standing broadside, with a MZ. all but the 130 yards were shot offhand, all one shot kills, the 347 went about 30 yards. The cow elk about 40 yards, The other two, bang flops. This country is just too open for shots to present themselves inside 100 yards, unless you’re really lucky.

 

[Matthew323]

I have to agree with most of your post, however, out here in the west, at least where I hunt, very seldom is a big game animal taken, during a rifle hunt, inside of 100 yards. Most of everything I’ve shot, has been 100 plus yards, the last four in order from most recent, 200 yards, 180 yards, 130 yards, 347 yards. Only the 347 was verified with a range finder. Those were all centerfire .30-06, all mule deer, all moving targets, except the 180 yard shot, that was a cow elk, standing broadside, with a MZ. all but the 130 yards were shot offhand, all one shot kills, the 347 went about 30 yards. The cow elk about 40 yards, The other two, bang flops. This country is just too open for shots to present themselves inside 100 yards, unless you’re really lucky.

That's why the HAWKEN was the first real long range patched ball rifle to be commonly available. It was the result of the first Mountain Men bringing their experiences back east after time spent in the Rocky Mountains.

After the Lewis and Clark Expedition, and the following 10-15 years of exploration, the design parameters for the Western style of rifle had been set.

Barrels were shortened from 42" plus, to an average of 32"-36". Average diameter, A.T.F. octagon, was about 1 1/16" to 1 3/16".

In conjunction with the Snail Drum Patent Hooked Breech, the thicker barrel walls allowed for much heavier powder charges, which in turn allowed for a flatter trajectory, which in turn allowed for the ability to shoot accurately over longer distances.

Rifles went from fullstock to halfstock. Barrels went from being pinned into place with solid 1-pc breech plugs/tangs; to being held with 1-2 wedge keys, and a hooked breech plug.

The Hawken Brothers, Sam & Jake, pioneered a lot of the innovations of the day. Their rifles were the best of English and American designs. A Hawken rifle was about a years wages, easily 2-4 times as expensive as the next most expensive Western rifle.

 

[Ninering62]

That's why the HAWKEN was the first real long range patched ball rifle to be commonly available. It was the result of the first Mountain Men bringing their experiences back east after time spent in the Rocky Mountains.

After the Lewis and Clark Expedition, and the following 10-15 years of exploration, the design parameters for the Western style of rifle had been set.

Barrels were shortened from 42" plus, to an average of 32"-36". Average diameter, A.T.F. octagon, was about 1 1/16" to 1 3/16".

In conjunction with the Snail Drum Patent Hooked Breech, the thicker barrel walls allowed for much heavier powder charges, which in turn allowed for a flatter trajectory, which in turn allowed for the ability to shoot accurately over longer distances.

Rifles went from fullstock to halfstock. Barrels went from being pinned into place with solid 1-pc breech plugs/tangs; to being held with 1-2 wedge keys, and a hooked breech plug.

The Hawken Brothers, Sam & Jake, pioneered a lot of the innovations of the day. Their rifles were the best of English and American designs. A Hawken rifle was about a years wages, easily 2-4 times as expensive as the next most expensive Western rifle.

Bruce you are a virtual wealth of fascinating information & you write and articulate exceptionally well. I enjoy reading your posts & very knowledgable contributions. Thank you

 

[Dave James]

HOLLY SMOKES!! IL, I have trouble seeing 100 yards any more let alone 600,that's is just amazing to me,glad your having fun doing it

 

[Idaholewis]

HOLLY SMOKES!! IL, I have trouble seeing 100 yards any more let alone 600,that's is just amazing to me,glad your having fun doing it

All in Fun, This isn’t practical, Just fun to Streeeeeeeeeetch the envelope

 

[Dave James]

Oh I understand fun, used to win beer bets with my 8bore, guys were always telling me I couldn't hit the 100 yard target

 

[alaskagrizz49]

Great post!