I'm toying with the idea of buy an new center fire rifle. Right now I have a Reminton Model 4 chambered in 30-06. It was the fore runner of the 7400. It's a fussy rifle. I tried to hand load for it but nothing I did would work. Only thing that works in it is factory ammution. I haven't used it on deer for 3 years. I've been shooting a 243 the last couple of year. Anyway I'm looking for something else. You never know, I might go for something bigger than deer. I keep thinking of a 300 Win mag but think it's a little too much for deer. I was also thinking of some of the short magnums but know little about them.
What should I buy?
- Thread starter RAF
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hmm...
I don't have any cf's other than varmint calibers. .223, .221 Fireball, .204 Ruger... Guess I got a .30-06 too, but we can't hunt with anything but MZ's or Shotguns in Ohio............
Soooo, I am guessing that if it were me I would have a hard time picking between a few calibers.
I think a .280 would be a very good choice.
A .270 is certainly proven...
Like the '06 the .35 Whelen will do it all and would absolutely flatten any deer that got in it's way!
If I were to buy a WSM, it would be a .325 WSM ... In a Browning A-bolt or a Win 70...
And since ya asked, 8) I dont think a 300 Winmag is too big for deer. If you hand load you can shoot it the same as your '06 if ya want.
As ya can tell... I can't make up my mind either!!! If I bought a cf rifle it would most likely be in the .325WSM but if I got an Encore Barrel it would be a .280 or 7-08.
:lol: 8)
I don't have any cf's other than varmint calibers. .223, .221 Fireball, .204 Ruger... Guess I got a .30-06 too, but we can't hunt with anything but MZ's or Shotguns in Ohio............
Soooo, I am guessing that if it were me I would have a hard time picking between a few calibers.
I think a .280 would be a very good choice.
A .270 is certainly proven...
Like the '06 the .35 Whelen will do it all and would absolutely flatten any deer that got in it's way!
If I were to buy a WSM, it would be a .325 WSM ... In a Browning A-bolt or a Win 70...
And since ya asked, 8) I dont think a 300 Winmag is too big for deer. If you hand load you can shoot it the same as your '06 if ya want.
As ya can tell... I can't make up my mind either!!! If I bought a cf rifle it would most likely be in the .325WSM but if I got an Encore Barrel it would be a .280 or 7-08.
:lol: 8)RAF,
I tested a Savage M114 in .30-'06, and took it on an antelope hunt. Modest price, great performance -- it shot factory ammo under 3/4". Also you can switch barrels on the Savage rifles with a barrel nut wrench and a fired case (or a gauge) to set the headspace.
Nosler has submitted the .280 Ackley to SAAMI to be standardized if you want a great cartridge that is transitioning from wildcat to factory round. They will make the ammo and brass.
You could buy the Savage and a second barrel and have a bolt '06 and a .280 Ackley.
jim
I tested a Savage M114 in .30-'06, and took it on an antelope hunt. Modest price, great performance -- it shot factory ammo under 3/4". Also you can switch barrels on the Savage rifles with a barrel nut wrench and a fired case (or a gauge) to set the headspace.
Nosler has submitted the .280 Ackley to SAAMI to be standardized if you want a great cartridge that is transitioning from wildcat to factory round. They will make the ammo and brass.
You could buy the Savage and a second barrel and have a bolt '06 and a .280 Ackley.
jim
Raf I just set up a cheaper Weatherby in 300 wsm for a friend. It cost 420 dollars at Gander Mtn. The test target in the box showed a 1.5 moa group. We shot factory ammo in it for sight in and got several 1 moa groups with an avg just a hair under 1.5. The bolt was smooth and trigger was a decent 4lbs. Stock was a tupperware ala savage but had no POI problems. The 300 wsm runs a 180 at 2960 fps, same as the 300 win mag. Reloading is easier because there is no belt like on the 300 win mag. The gun was fairly light and once the barrel was hot the shots would wander a little, however when cool, it shot very well, and a cold dirty barrel shot at zero every time on paper at 200 yds. With a Leupold 3.5-10x it was quite easy to shoot well to 500 yds.Recoil was a little heavy however no too bad, alot less then my Savage with the 300 gr Barnes load I shoot. Overall it was alot of gun for the money.
Rman
Rman
The 7 SAUM shares ballistics with the .280 Ackley, so it will work well. Also I am not so sure about its continued presence in the market, so you might find a bargain.
I forgot to mention the Savage came from the factory with a 2.5# trigger.
jim
I forgot to mention the Savage came from the factory with a 2.5# trigger.
jim
I just got back from the gun shop. Nothing new in my gun room but saw something I like and going to give it some serious thought. I'm leaning towards a 300 WSM. The one I looked at was a Tikka but in 300 win mag(no WSM in stock at the moment). I like the feel of the rifle. It was blued with synthetic stock. Balance was great and it was light. It was priced good too, $719. I could easily load it with 150 grain bullets and should work good on deer and if I went for something bigger, it wouldn't be hard to step up to a heavier bullet. There is a draw back. They're not interested in my 30-06 because it's an auto loader. They say there have been problems with the extractor on the 7400 models. Mine is a model 4 so it's older. There's also concern about the ever evolving gun laws and there may be a problem in the future with auto loaders.
but saw something I like and going to give it some serious thought. I'm leaning towards a 300 WSM. The one I looked at was a Tikka but in 300 win mag(no WSM in stock at the moment). I like the feel of the rifle. It was blued with synthetic stock. Balance was great and it was light. It was priced good too, $719. I could easily load it with 150 grain bullets and should work good on deer and if I went for something bigger, it wouldn't be hard to step up to a heavier bullet. There is a draw back. They're not interested in my 30-06 because it's an auto loader. They say there have been problems with the extractor on the 7400 models. Mine is a model 4 so it's older. There's also concern about the ever evolving gun laws and there may be a problem in the future with auto loaders.Raf I have been thinking about what you said about having trouble with your autoloader Raf. I think the solution is quite simple. First, almost all factory ammo is undersized, as it has to be capable in running through tight guns as well as guns that are looser. It is a simple thing to get a headspace gauge from either Redding or Dillon and check out what I am saying. Drop a factory cartridge in and you will see it is undersized. Then mike the case length, and you will see the case is shorter then the trim to length dimension given in reloading manuals. I learned this when reloading for many autoloaders over the years.
The solution:
Buy a small base resizing die in 30-06, I prefer the Redding. Resize your cases in this. Check your adjustment with a headspace gauge and resize the case just a gnats hair on the small side.
Then after resizing, trim your cases to the same length as a factory cartridge.
Last seat the bullets to the same overall length as a factory round, it will be quite a bit shorter then what the book calls for.
Also since you have a gas operated autoloader you will need to be pretty close to a factory load in velocity. You need to have enough gas to function the action.
The extractor problem is over stated as well. A clean gun and extractor and a new spring for the extractor will make that a mute point.
Hope this helps.
Rman
The solution:
Buy a small base resizing die in 30-06, I prefer the Redding. Resize your cases in this. Check your adjustment with a headspace gauge and resize the case just a gnats hair on the small side.
Then after resizing, trim your cases to the same length as a factory cartridge.
Last seat the bullets to the same overall length as a factory round, it will be quite a bit shorter then what the book calls for.
Also since you have a gas operated autoloader you will need to be pretty close to a factory load in velocity. You need to have enough gas to function the action.
The extractor problem is over stated as well. A clean gun and extractor and a new spring for the extractor will make that a mute point.
Hope this helps.
Rman
The Small Base dies are intended for the auto-loaders. Autos need ammunition of the "expected" size, shape and strength to function as designed. Each of those parameters has a window of tolerences that will properly operate the firearm, and these are much smaller than a bolt gun for example. Some autos are even sensitive to powder types.
I like the Tikka rifle. I used to shoot a Tikka .308 carbine and it was very accurate even with its 20" barrel. A friend bought it from me as he was impressed. The factory makes their barrels on the same line so you are getting a SAKO barrel for a smaller price.
jim
I like the Tikka rifle. I used to shoot a Tikka .308 carbine and it was very accurate even with its 20" barrel. A friend bought it from me as he was impressed. The factory makes their barrels on the same line so you are getting a SAKO barrel for a smaller price.
jim
Rman, thanks for your reply and infor on resizing. I had a small base die but that didn't seem to help. Maybe I didn't have it set up right. Will have to take another look and do some comparisons. When I first tried this I spent about $100 on components and it didn't work. Could have bought 5 boxes of factory ammo for that with would have lasted many years. When this was the only rifle I hunted deer with I averaged 4 shots a year. 3 at the range to confirm my zero and one at a deer(back in the 1 deer per year days). 5 boxes would have gone a long way . I still might go with the Tikka 300 WSM, just cause I like the rifle and you know, ya gotta do what ya gotta do :wink: .
Back to the 30-06, the more I think of it the more I think it was the dies. I got them from someone used and seems they broke since. I probable chucked them :cry: . Might have to look for new ones.
. I still might go with the Tikka 300 WSM, just cause I like the rifle and you know, ya gotta do what ya gotta do :wink: . Back to the 30-06, the more I think of it the more I think it was the dies. I got them from someone used and seems they broke since. I probable chucked them :cry: . Might have to look for new ones.
After I wrote the last post I really started wondering. Since I was already going downstairs to check the laundry , I headed for my reloading room. I compared the diameter of some of my reloaded 30-06 ammo and found it was 3/1000 bigger. The length of brass was 3/1000 longer. Would this be enough to make a difference. Keep in mind the loads I measured were for my sons bolt action. I neck size only those for him and bullet is seated longer to fit his rifle so didn't measure the overall length. I looked for my small base dies and I still have them. They're Lyman and I never really liked them. The way they set up is ackward in my mind.
, I headed for my reloading room. I compared the diameter of some of my reloaded 30-06 ammo and found it was 3/1000 bigger. The length of brass was 3/1000 longer. Would this be enough to make a difference. Keep in mind the loads I measured were for my sons bolt action. I neck size only those for him and bullet is seated longer to fit his rifle so didn't measure the overall length. I looked for my small base dies and I still have them. They're Lyman and I never really liked them. The way they set up is ackward in my mind.RAF, here's what I'd buy if I were to get an new centerfire today for deer hunting....
It's the Weaterby Vanguard SUB-MOA Matte with the tan spiderweb stock and matte blued barrel. I'd probably get it in .257 Weatherby Magnum. They also make a stainless version. It comes with a 3 shot accuracy guarantee of .99" or less at 100 yards. I saw one of these at Cabela's and they are a very nice looking gun.
It's the Weaterby Vanguard SUB-MOA Matte with the tan spiderweb stock and matte blued barrel. I'd probably get it in .257 Weatherby Magnum. They also make a stainless version. It comes with a 3 shot accuracy guarantee of .99" or less at 100 yards. I saw one of these at Cabela's and they are a very nice looking gun.
RAF,
This is weird, because I'm looking at the same gun...same calibre. The T3 stainless lite. Its rumoured to be coming out in a lefty version, that's why I've been so interested. I've strictly been a Rem 700 man but my buddy has the 300 WSM in the Tikka stainless and he loves it.
I won't be giving up my 7mm mag in the rem 700..ever, but I always like the idea of more guns. Why not keep the model 4. I don't think you would get what its worth to you. Ahh, the memories. :lol: Even if you never hunt with it again, maybe a grandchild would love to use Grandpa's old gun? Just an idea.
This is weird, because I'm looking at the same gun...same calibre. The T3 stainless lite. Its rumoured to be coming out in a lefty version, that's why I've been so interested. I've strictly been a Rem 700 man but my buddy has the 300 WSM in the Tikka stainless and he loves it.
I won't be giving up my 7mm mag in the rem 700..ever, but I always like the idea of more guns. Why not keep the model 4. I don't think you would get what its worth to you. Ahh, the memories. :lol: Even if you never hunt with it again, maybe a grandchild would love to use Grandpa's old gun? Just an idea.
Tikka
The Tikka rifles are superb except that I have chrongraphed 2 that had very slow barrels.
One was a 270 WSM that was 200 FPS slower than spec..heck is was slower than my model 70 left-hand stainless in 270. Another Tikka was a 25-06 that would not break 3000FPS for a 115 grain bullet. Of course the barrel was 22 7/16.
I have never chrongraphed a slow Savage rifle. I chronographed a Savage 16 in 270 WSM this summer that clocked 3442 with a 130 Barnes TSX.
Now that is fast...who needs a 7MM STW.
choc-dog
The Tikka rifles are superb except that I have chrongraphed 2 that had very slow barrels.
One was a 270 WSM that was 200 FPS slower than spec..heck is was slower than my model 70 left-hand stainless in 270. Another Tikka was a 25-06 that would not break 3000FPS for a 115 grain bullet. Of course the barrel was 22 7/16.
I have never chrongraphed a slow Savage rifle. I chronographed a Savage 16 in 270 WSM this summer that clocked 3442 with a 130 Barnes TSX.
Now that is fast...who needs a 7MM STW.
choc-dog
Yup, going to have to go back and have another look at that Tikka. I'll have to see when they'll get one in in 300 WSM. They're moving in January to a new and bigger store so don't expect them to be bringing in any new stock until then.
As far as my Model 4 is concerned, I might have to keep it. It didn't take long to realize I won't get any where near what it's worth.
Looks like I'll also need a new scope. Know what I'll get. Just bought a Bushnell Elite 3200 in 4 - 12 x 40 on my Savage muzzle loader. Just love it and will put that on.
As far as my Model 4 is concerned, I might have to keep it. It didn't take long to realize I won't get any where near what it's worth.
Looks like I'll also need a new scope. Know what I'll get. Just bought a Bushnell Elite 3200 in 4 - 12 x 40 on my Savage muzzle loader. Just love it and will put that on.
You can certainly reload for the Remington 742, 7400, Model 4s. The problems you are having is because the case is too large after sizing OR the bullet isn't seated enough. Rifleman gave good advice on how to go about correcting that...
As far as rifles go...I'm more likely to stick with the old reliables. A good 'ol Remington 700 in 7mm08 would be a fantastic rifle for whitetail, mule deer, even elk/bear with the right load. This is SUCH an easy cartridge to reload and you will be amazed at the accuracy this caliber will deliver. This is one of my VERY favorite chamberings as it delivers flat trajectory, plenty of energy, AND low recoil. It'll do most of what a 30-06 will do in a shorter, more compact action. I think you'd like it!
As far as rifles go...I'm more likely to stick with the old reliables. A good 'ol Remington 700 in 7mm08 would be a fantastic rifle for whitetail, mule deer, even elk/bear with the right load. This is SUCH an easy cartridge to reload and you will be amazed at the accuracy this caliber will deliver. This is one of my VERY favorite chamberings as it delivers flat trajectory, plenty of energy, AND low recoil. It'll do most of what a 30-06 will do in a shorter, more compact action. I think you'd like it!
I was back in the shop yesterday and they had one in stock. Looked it over real close. I really like the rifle but I wasn't impressed with the removable magazine. Was disappointed that it's made of plastic. Not a big deal though. My plan, if I decide to go ahead, will be to buy it in the new year. Of course if I do, I doubt if I could wait until spring to shoot it but the weather here in winter is not good for going to the range ???. :cry: While I was looking at it another customer came along and cautioned me no to buy it, saying you'll be sorry. Asked what he meant and he said his father had one and the recoil was wicked. I'm not that concerned about recoil and if that's the only complaint, no big deal . I then had a look around at other supplies I'll need. Dies, brass, bullets and powder. My reloading manual is an older version and doesn't have any info in 300 WSM so I bought a new one. Had a quick look through it and find that there are other short magnum calibers out there to consider but I still think I'll stay with WSM.
RMan. I've decide to also keep my 06 and try loading for it again. When in the store yesterday went looking for small base dies. Can you believe they don't have ANY :shock: . Like I said before they are moving to a new and bigger location and are trying to keep stock down. Less to move in a month. I could order them but didn't bother. Couldn't shoot this time of year anyway.
. I then had a look around at other supplies I'll need. Dies, brass, bullets and powder. My reloading manual is an older version and doesn't have any info in 300 WSM so I bought a new one. Had a quick look through it and find that there are other short magnum calibers out there to consider but I still think I'll stay with WSM.RMan. I've decide to also keep my 06 and try loading for it again. When in the store yesterday went looking for small base dies. Can you believe they don't have ANY :shock: . Like I said before they are moving to a new and bigger location and are trying to keep stock down. Less to move in a month. I could order them but didn't bother. Couldn't shoot this time of year anyway.
