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You are correct. They are considered firearms that can be used in ML season.someone correct me if i'm misunderstanding something here ......
View attachment 34610
https://www.atf.gov/firearms/firear...arms-ammunition-gun-control-act-definitions-0
".......... C. Any muzzle loading rifle, muzzle loading shotgun, or muzzle loading pistol, which is designed to use black powder, or black powder substitute, and which cannot use fixed ammunition. For purposes of this subparagraph, the term antique firearm shall not include any weapon which includes a firearm frame or receiver, any firearm which is converted into a muzzle loading weapon, or any muzzle loading weapon which can be readily converted to fire fixed ammunition by replacing the barrel, bolt, breechblock or any combination thereof. ......."
if the ATF doesn't recognize it as a muzzleloader i wonder what states do or might ?
does this also mean the 45 scout V2 ML conversion aren't legally MLs ???
once again , someone correct me if i'm not understanding something here .
Grouse,Some people on here are asking when the Mongrel will be available. The fastest and easiest way to get one is if you already own an T/C Contender. If you do, your looking two to three months. And this is what you would get.
https://hosting.photobucket.com/ima...Sj8b5xruA.jpg?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
https://hosting.photobucket.com/ima...iHCTeTci4.jpg?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
Forearm, Barrel, Ramrod, Bullet starter, Range Rod, 20 bullets, 20 charges, loading jag, and a hat.
Let me see what I can find out. Maybe Dave or Gordy can reply on this message.Grouse,
I sent an email to Gordy Edwards several days ago as you recommended & I have not received a reply. I appreciate your communication efforts, but I cannot wait another two or three months for my Texas hog hunt - my requirement is much sooner. I already own a Gen 1 T/C Contender Pistol. I've already purchased a 24" Bullberry muzzleloader barrel. I have already purchased the SSK Flip Grip. I want to purchase the Mongrel Forearm (with the hole at the end for the ramrod) & a hanger bar. Is the Mongrel Forearm & Hangar Bar available now ? If so, what's my cost ?
I have an upcoming deer hunt this season in Nevada. The Nevada game & fish office says that the Mongrel doesn't qualify for my muzzleloader hunt.
I do hunt in states you've listed that the Mongrel is legal. I have plans to ride my motorcycle to the east coast before the weather gets too bad - the Mongrel's 17" barrel would be a good fit for that hunt. When the Mongrel 'upper assembly" is available I plan to purchase one. What does it cost ?
At the Shot Show SSK mentioned plans to make other barrel lengths of the Mongrel System. What Mongrel system barrel lengths are planned & when do you anticipate availability ?
So far, you're the only person that has replied to my inquiries. Thank you for the replies.
There’s a shelf on both sides of the barrel that the bullets rests on.What stops the bullet from going all the way down the barrel?
It sounds like these guys have copied the idea for the Nitrofire muzzleloader from Traditions with their own version of the "Firestick" loaded with BH209 or something similar.There’s a shelf on both sides of the barrel that the bullets rests on.
Grouse,
I sent an email to Gordy Edwards several days ago as you recommended & I have not received a reply. I appreciate your communication efforts, but I cannot wait another two or three months for my Texas hog hunt - my requirement is much sooner. I already own a Gen 1 T/C Contender Pistol. I've already purchased a 24" Bullberry muzzleloader barrel. I have already purchased the SSK Flip Grip. I want to purchase the Mongrel Forearm (with the hole at the end for the ramrod) & a hanger bar. Is the Mongrel Forearm & Hangar Bar available now ? If so, what's my cost ?
I have an upcoming deer hunt this season in Nevada. The Nevada game & fish office says that the Mongrel doesn't qualify for my muzzleloader hunt.
I do hunt in states you've listed that the Mongrel is legal. I have plans to ride my motorcycle to the east coast before the weather gets too bad - the Mongrel's 17" barrel would be a good fit for that hunt. When the Mongrel 'upper assembly" is available I plan to purchase one. What does it cost ?
At the Shot Show SSK mentioned plans to make other barrel lengths of the Mongrel System. What Mongrel system barrel lengths are planned & when do you anticipate availability ?
So far, you're the only person that has replied to my inquiries. Thank you for the replies.
Thank You for your reply. It answered my questions.As far as copying Traditions im not sure about that?? I'm almost positive ive been using the Mongrel since 2018. Dave came up with this idea along time ago. Either way it doesnt matter. This method is so much cheaper to shoot and the primer is included.
Maybe the guys who came up with the Nitrofire copied Dave's idea.As far as copying Traditions im not sure about that?? I'm almost positive ive been using the Mongrel since 2018. Dave came up with this idea along time ago. Either way it doesnt matter. This method is so much cheaper to shoot and the primer is included.
It was at the ATF so long, wouldn't surprise me if they stole the idea lolMaybe the guys who came up with the Nitrofire copied Dave's idea.
It might take a patent search to answer that question, or Dave could have come up with the idea and then did not file a patent for it.
Doing what? just curiousIt's not really a novel concept. Bad Bull has been doing it for a while too.
Just noticed Pennsylvania changed there law so the Mongrel and the Traditions are legal.I went to the range today to try out several bullets types in the new Mongrel sabot less Muzzleloader by SSK. I shot four different types of bullets and was amazed how well they all shot. My original prototype a couple years ago was a Douglas barrel. This new one is now a Green Mountain. I shouldn't really be surprised about the accuracy cause Knight rifles uses Green Mountain as well.
The first target was with the 260grn Brass bullets. Muzzle velocity 1980fps
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5859.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
The second bullet is with the 270grn Parker bullets.
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5860.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
The third bullet is the 280grn PowerBelts.
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5861.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
The fourth and final bullet is the bullet I've been using the last couple years the 240grn Copper bullet. Muzzle velocity 2050fps
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5862.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
Here is a couple pics of the targets together.
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5857.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5858.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
Not really much to say about the accuracy. They all shot very well, and as usual the pointy bullets always seem to shoot more accurate then the Hollow points. At least in my experience over the years. I've still shot some amazing groups with hollow point, just not today. LOL
As far as ease of loading, they all loaded very well. The Powerbelts and the Parkers loaded really easy. And the Hollow point bullets were a little tighter but loaded really good. All four bullets did very well in all aspects.
Took some random pictures today ill share with you.
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5849.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5848.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5846.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5851.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
https://hosting.photobucket.com/images/v315/grouse1/IMG_5850.HEIC?width=590&height=590&fit=bounds
As you can see above, a clean empty barrel and one with a bullet in it. So easy to tell if the gun is loaded or not. No weighing/measuring powder. It just makes for the safest and easiest Muzzleloader ive ever used. It really shows to, i grab it first every time i go hunting. Is this for everyone?? Hell no, but its fun and cheap to shoot!!
I will note this is not Legal in all states for Muzzleloading. Here are some states that i have an understanding that they are.
Montana, Wyoming, South Dakota, Iowa, Michigan, Ohio, Kentucky, Oklahoma, Alabama, Georgia, New York, Vermont, New Jersey, and Maryland. I use it during rifle season here in PA.
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