Any Thompson center big Boar fans here?

[Howie1968]

Are there any TC big boar .58 fans here? luckily i own 2 that are in great condition, so far i shoot 2 loadings the TOW Maxiball it says 600 grains (ive never weighed them) and a .570 roundball .018 patch in one and the other like .015 patch. i may get criticized but i rarely shoot past 50 yards on the range and keep all shots under 50 when hunting its helped my success rate on big hogs. i do have a lee REAL 440 grain mold and may try those in the maxisballs i found 90 grains of pyrodex rs does the trick 100 grains of pyrodex in the roundball with a wonder wad over powder then my patched roundball would like to hear about others loads sights etc right now im using the factory sights. i thought of getting a skinner for it

 

[Fyrstyk]

I have a modified Renegade Big Boar. Mine is a flint lock with a Hoyt .58 round ball twist barrel. 290 grains of lead round ball for deer is plenty. I load 100 grains of 2f Goex, a .015 mink oil lubed hand cast roundball. My gun has the T/C hunter peep and a firesight front sight. I sight in 1.5" high at 50 yards which puts me dead on at 75 yards which is as far as I will shoo with iron sights and failing eyesight. I switched from a .54 to the .58 cause I needed to drop deer in their tracks, and the big .58 does the job. I've had several well hit deer run off when shot with a .54, and in the heavy brush and laurel where I hunt that means a long (on hands and knees) follow up of the blood trail. The last deer I shot with a .54 was double lung shot and also took off the big aorta above the heart but the deer managed to go about 100 yards before dropping for good. Took me 3 hours of crawling to find the deer, and another 4 hours just to drag it out of the stuff. The last 4 deer i have shot with the .58 have gone down immediately, or had only take a few steps. Love the .58.

 

[Howie1968]

i also have a couple of renegade .58s one i have a 1-66 twist the other a 1-32 twist. i was having a problem with roundballs not passing through big pigs in 4 cal and 50 so i jumped up to .58 and that issue was solved. ive got a pedersoli double .72 but the gun weighs 12 lbs i would really like a .62 rifled 1-66 on a renegade

 

[Matthew323]

Howie1968,
I have been reading your posts/threads over on The Muzzleloading Forum for a couple of years now. I remember when you got the first Big Boar rifle, and how amazed you were that a .570" diameter patched ball was shooting completely through most of the hogs that you shot with the rifle.

I never got the chance to hunt with my .62 caliber, 1:48" twist, 42" long, swamped octagon, Getz barrelled longrifle, before I was forced by circumstances beyond my control to sell all of my firearms, modern & muzzleloading alike.

A load of 75 grains of fffg Goex black powder, and a 0.615" diameter ball, with cotton canvas duck material patching measuring approximately 0.024" thick; gave 5-shot groups at 100 yards measuring the size of a silver dollar, sometimes less, from the bench.

Since my self-imposed limit for hunting was a maximum of 50-60 yards due to my eyesight, there is no question in my mind that that load would have killed deer as dead as a doornail.

If I can talk myself into it, I want to build another big bore patched ball rifle, only this time with a very short swamped octagon-round barrel measuring somewhere between 16" long to 21" long.

With a bore at least .62 caliber, if not Rice's .66 caliber, which actually has a bore diameter of 0.672". And shoots a pure lead ball weighing just a few grains shy of 1 ounce.

How many hogs do you think you have killed with your brace of BIG BOAR rifles?

 

[Matthew323]

i also have a couple of renegade .58s one i have a 1-66 twist the other a 1-32 twist. i was having a problem with roundballs not passing through big pigs in 4 cal and 50 so i jumped up to .58 and that issue was solved. ive got a pedersoli double .72 but the gun weighs 12 lbs i would really like a .62 rifled 1-66 on a renegade

I don't know if Colerain will rifle a straight octagon barrel in .62 caliber, but Rice will.

Ask Jason, at Rice, to rifle the .62 caliber, patched ball barrel with square bottom grooves that are only 0.008" deep, as opposed to the normal 0.016" round bottom grooves.

In a 1" diameter, across the flats octagon barrel, this will give you a barrel wall thickness of 0.182" to work with for drilling & tapping the screws for the underrib, the ramrod retaining spring, the barrel key underlug, and the rear sight (unless you want to use a dovetail).

Call Scott at Colerain, and get the name of the man in Pennsylvania who makes up custom, Thompson/Center, drop-in barrels for any model Thompson/Center rifle. Then, have Jason ship the completed barrel to him for installation of the breech plug, sights, barrel key underlug, underrib, ramrod pipes, and ramrod retaining spring.

Better yet, call Jason at Rice, and BEG HIM to fabricate the complete barrel himself. For some odd reason that I cannot fathom, he currently won't make a Thompson/Center drop-in barrel in patched ball twists in anything over .40 caliber. There's got to be a good reason behind Jason's logic, but he declined to share it with me. And got snippy when I kept approaching the subject from around the corner, so to speak.

If you could get Jason to make the complete barrel for you, you would get a better barrel than a Thompson/Center original.

The entire barrel, including the breech plug, would be CNC machined, and it would consist of the barrel, the percussion hooked patent snail drum breech plug to fit the Thompson/Center lock (drilled and tapped for a 1/4"-28 nipple), the underrib, two ramrod pipes, a ramrod retaining spring, the barrel key underlug, and a set of Williams fiber optic front & rear sights. Barrel steel would not be 4140CM, but Rice's standard grade of gun barrel steel.

Last I heard, Jason was charging $395.00 for a patched ball, Thompson/Center, drop-in barrel. But, he might want more for working outside of his box making a .62 caliber barrel, which would require reprogramming the CNC computer for drilling and tapping the shallower holes necessary for the thinner barrel wall thickness of the .62 caliber barrel.

 

[Howie1968]

Howie1968,
I have been reading your posts/threads over on The Muzzleloading Forum for a couple of years now. I remember when you got the first Big Boar rifle, and how amazed you were that a .570" diameter patched ball was shooting completely through most of the hogs that you shot with the rifle.

I never got the chance to hunt with my .62 caliber, 1:48" twist, 42" long, swamped octagon, Getz barrelled longrifle, before I was forced by circumstances beyond my control to sell all of my firearms, modern & muzzleloading alike.

A load of 75 grains of fffg Goex black powder, and a 0.615" diameter ball, with cotton canvas duck material patching measuring approximately 0.024" thick; gave 5-shot groups at 100 yards measuring the size of a silver dollar, sometimes less, from the bench.

Since my self-imposed limit for hunting was a maximum of 50-60 yards due to my eyesight, there is no question in my mind that that load would have killed deer as dead as a doornail.

If I can talk myself into it, I want to build another big bore patched ball rifle, only this time with a very short swamped octagon-round barrel measuring somewhere between 16" long to 21" long.

With a bore at least .62 caliber, if not Rice's .66 caliber, which actually has a bore diameter of 0.672". And shoots a pure lead ball weighing just a few grains shy of 1 ounce.

How many hogs do you think you have killed with your brace of BIG BOAR rifles?

Not as many as i would like to hogs have been scarce around my place since Febuary between the 2 big boars in my notes ive taken 63 with the big boar .58s At first i started with the TOW maxiballs and they b;lew right through them, But i really wanted to hunt them with roundballs after about the 3rd big boar the .58 made me a believer now i do like .54s ive got more .54s than everything i have 8 .58s the cabelas hawken .58 was my first im just a big fan of Thompson centers i do have quite a few lymans 2 deerstalkers a gph in .54 but those big boars just kind of belong in my hands if you knowwhat i mean. im like you i keep everything 50 ish yards and pray to god i never have to sell my big boar .58s my white mountain .54 my tc hawken with a green mountain .54 barrel and a couple of my sxs 12 gauge smoke poles other than that i could sell them all as long as i dont have to part with these

 

[Howie1968]

besides bullet weight and mass how much better would the .62 be compared to my .58/ ive got some sxs smokepoles that i use a .690 rball and it knocks them right over with 80 grains of pyro rs

 

[snapbang]

For the smaller calibers maybe a round ball made of harder lead would help pass throughs. I used a lot of .50 PRB made of wheel weights and was always satisfied and never found a bullet. On deer that is.

 

[Fyrstyk]

i also have a couple of renegade .58s one i have a 1-66 twist the other a 1-32 twist. i was having a problem with roundballs not passing through big pigs in 4 cal and 50 so i jumped up to .58 and that issue was solved. ive got a pedersoli double .72 but the gun weighs 12 lbs i would really like a .62 rifled 1-66 on a renegade

Unfortunately, the usual Renegade barrel can only be bored out to .62 as a smooth bore. There is not enough metal for rifling for the barrel to be safe, or so I have been told on multiple occasions. You would have to open up the stock to accept a 1-1/8" barrel, and have a custom breech plug and tang made.

 

[Matthew323]

besides bullet weight and mass how much better would the .62 be compared to my .58/ ive got some sxs smokepoles that i use a .690 rball and it knocks them right over with 80 grains of pyro rs

Howie,
Back when I was shooting/hunting, I never got caught up in the weighing/measuring craze that currently exists in both traditional muzzleloading, and so-called modern/inline muzzleloading.

I was talking with MtMonkey earlier this morning, and neither of us had anyone to teach us anything about muzzleloading.

He's been doing it for about a decade. I started at 16 with an Italian, percussion, Colt 1860 Army revolver. Less than a year later, I purchased a semi-custom, .45 caliber, flintlock longrifle for $330.00. More than enough in 1971 to purchase a Remington 700BDL bolt-action rifle with a 3-9x Leupold scope on it. As I was reminded EVERYTIME one of my relatives/peers saw the flintlock.

My only "Teachers" were the Lyman Black Powder Handbook, as well as copies of Muzzleloader & Muzzle Blasts magazines. I had no human mentor. NO INTERNET. NO GOOGLE. NO YOUTUBE. NO ability to hit a computer and find SOMEONE ELSE in the world who has the answer to my question. RIGHT NOW!!!!!!!

So, I learned everything the hard way. Sometimes, GOD was looking out for me, and I escaped killing/maiming myself. And, other times GOD saw fit to let a passionate 17 year old kid learn something hard the EASY WAY.

I always followed the maxim of ordering my ball moulds 0.005" under bore diameter. My rifles over the years were........

.45 caliber = 0.445" diameter ball
.50 caliber = 0.495" diameter ball
.62 caliber = 0.615" diameter ball

ALL WEIGHTS ARE IN PURE LEAD

0.445" diameter = 132.1 grains
0.495" diameter = 181.8 grains

0.575" diameter = 285 grains (284.9866523)
(your BIG BOAR's)

0.615" diameter = 348.7 grains

285 gr. ÷ 348.7 gr. = 0.8173215 × 100 = 81.7%
100% - 81.7% = 18.3%
18.3% = percentage greater in mass that a 0.615" caliber ball is than a 0.575" caliber ball.

So, to answer your question, for roughly the same amount of propellant, at a slightly lower muzzle velocity, with 18% greater mass, the .62 caliber ball WILL OUT PERFORM the .58 caliber ball. It's going to punch a bigger hole in any game animal it strikes, and create a larger wound channel.

Now take my new favorite, the Rice .66 caliber, which is really a 0.672 caliber.

I would order the custom ball mold in 0.668" diameter, which is only 0.004" under bore diameter.

0.668" diameter = 446.84 grains

285 gr. ÷ 446.84 gr. = 0.63781 × 100 = 63.8%
100% - 63.8% = 36.2%

A ball measuring 0.668" in diameter has 36.2% greater mass than a 0.575" diameter ball.

348.7 gr. ÷ 446.84 gr. = 0.7803688 × 100 = 78%
100% - 78% = 22%

A ball measuring 0.668" in diameter has 22% greater mass than a 0.615" diameter ball.

A 0.690" diameter ball weighs 482.5 grains.

Which has 9.3% greater mass than the 0.668" diameter ball.

It's all relative. How much recoil are you willing to withstand?

Lightweight rifles & heavy patched balls make for substantial recoil. Assuming, like most males, you CANNOT RESIST THE TEMPTATION to keep increasing the powder charge.

That is why if I decide to have Jason make me a .66 caliber barrel that is short & handy, it will have a rate of twist NO MORE than 1:48". I am tempted to order the barrel with a 1:40" twist, just so I WON'T BE TEMPTED to go for big powder charges.

A 1:40" twist coupled with a 0.672" diameter bore, probably will not like 90-100 grain powder charges. And, truth be told, 75-80 grains behind the 466.84 grain ball will have PLENTY of killing power out to 60 yards, my maximum distance with open sights.

I would still have Jason make the breech diameter as large as his machinery will allow, which is 1.330" in diameter.

The swamped octagon barrel I am visualizing would be something as follows.......

1.330" diameter (beginning of the breech) {0" from the breech} × 1.290" diameter (end of the breech) {5" from the breech} × 0.850" diameter (waist) {13" from the breech} × 1.090" diameter (muzzle) {18" from the breech}.

The 1.330" to 1.290" × 5" long breech section will have sufficient barrel wall thickness to allow Jerry Dove, at Dove's Custom Guns, to machine Talley scope ring dovetail bases with recoil shoulders into the top flat of the octagon.

Put that short, swamped octagon barrel in a straight comb Jaeger stock with matching right & left cheek pieces. Add a Chris Laubach, CNC machined, 1740's, curved lock plate, German flintlock actuated by a single trigger. Probably, use brass, Brandenburg style, Pistor buttplate and triggerguard. One 7/16" diameter forward ramrod pipe, with matching entry ramrod pipe. Front & rear sling swivels. English walnut fullstock. Tang-mounted ghost ring rear sight, with front sight THAT I COULD SEE.

And, I would search real hard for an Old School, German/Austrian, 2.5× to 4× fixed power riflescope that would accept 1" scope rings. A scope like that, especially if you could find one with a 42mm objective bell, would be able to gather all kinds of light early in the morning, and late in the evening.

 

[Henry Miles]

I'm breaking in a 58cal 1-66" GM TC drop-in barrel for my Renegade. I also have a J Browning Mtn Rifle that I just got back from Bob Hoyt that he opened up to 58cal 1-66". Both of these barrels are exceeding my expectations for accuracy after only a dozen or so shots. My load to date is 90grs 3F Goex, 24ga card, 24ga wad and a .562 PRB w/double cotton duck patch, until I find some pillow ticking. At 70yds, I'm easily getting 3" groups with ageing eyes and iron sights. They both will shoot better than I can!

 

[Henry Miles]

And Jason at Rice won't do a 58cal or larger 1" TC barrel. I talked to him personally at the last Friendship shoot. He said he may consider a barrel w/o being drilled for the under rib. Good luck talking him into it!

 

[Matthew323]

You could always run the .62 caliber barrel with dovetails for the front & rear sights, and NO underrib, ramrod pipes, or ramrod. That would mean carrying a collapsible carbon fiber ramrod with you while hunting. Not a huge deal breaker, if you make the first shot count. Which a 348.7 grain, pure lead, patched ball would certainly help to do. It would also mean having to use a Track of the Wolf, #UL-TC-H, Thompson/Center, old school style underlug that requires being dovetailed into place. Jason might breech a .62 caliber barrel with his CNC'd percussion breech plug if you gave him your assurance that no underrib would be installed on the barrel.

 

[Howie1968]

thank you some options for sure i dont need a underib and i like barrels in the 24 to 26 inch range much easier to carry i can handle recoil pretty well ill give jason a call

 

[Buttonbuck]

Unfortunately, the usual Renegade barrel can only be bored out to .62 as a smooth bore. There is not enough metal for rifling for the barrel to be safe, or so I have been told on multiple occasions. You would have to open up the stock to accept a 1-1/8" barrel, and have a custom breech plug and tang made.

I have one Bob Hoyt bored out and rifled for me, sadly a used56 SB I bought cheaply I had asked him about the maximum caliber and he was fine with62, he measured screw depth I believe.

 

[Buttonbuck]

Bob Hoyt with a junked out Renegade barrel or The possibles shop to have one made is the route I’d go. Some have had the green mountain IBS barrels rifled,I’m keeping mine smooth since I have the rifled one.

 

[Matthew323]

thank you some options for sure i dont need a underib and i like barrels in the 24 to 26 inch range much easier to carry i can handle recoil pretty well ill give jason a call

If you go with a 24" long barrel, then the CVA, Paramount, 4-pc., collapsible, folding, carbon fiber ramrod would work perfectly.

 

[Howie1968]

i talked to Bob hoyt and he said depending on screw depth he may be able to go to .62 ive got several .54 renegade barrels laying around even if its a smooth barrel i dont need it to shoot far all of my hog hunting spots i set up 25 yards and less

 

[Buttonbuck]

i talked to Bob hoyt and he said depending on screw depth he may be able to go to .62 ive got several .54 renegade barrels laying around even if its a smooth barrel i dont need it to shoot far all of my hog hunting spots i set up 25 yards and less

It was a decade ago,I think I said if 62 didn’t work go 58.