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OK guys I have a question or two. My Scout conversion shoots .45 cal 300 gr Hornady SSTs B2B well under MOA. My hunting opportunities are 99.9% under 100 yards but I do have a couple areas where this distance can be extended out to about 250 or 300 yards. I've been doing a lot of thread reading here and I see quite a few of you shoot 225 gr .40 cal Furys in sabots. Can you tell me what the advantages are of the Furys over the Hornadys?
 
Furys are bonded. XTPs are not. That said, you can get velocities up pretty good on the fury bullets if needed to get the accuracy you want without having the bullets gernade or disintegrate on bone like an XTP that has a much lower operating velocity range might.

I've killed deer with my Kodiak .45 and 200 grain XTPs just fine but even at BH209 speeds [maybe 2200-2300 pfs] the bullets came apart. Last fall when I got my Fury 225 grain .40s cals I took a 50 gallon garbage can and filled it with folded, packed newspaper and filled it with water, let the paper take up the water they could then rolled it out on the range 100 yards and pinned a plastic plate on the exposed paper and shot one each of the fury 225 and a 200 xtp into it, one shot on either side of the plate to keep them apart. I used my Patriot for this using 56 grains of IMR4198. When I pulled the paper mass from the barrel by layers it became apparent that the XTP was in several pieces and had about 14" of penetration. That 225 grain Fury was in one nicely expanded piece with just under 22" of penetration. I decided right there that in the Patriot I was going to hunt with either a Barnes XPB or the Fury, hopefully both, but only managed one deer with the Patriot using a Barnes 195. I have several boxes of 200 grain XTPs and use them exclusively in the Kodiak to hunt and in the Patriot at the range.

I have shot .40 A-Frames in the Patriot at the same charge level and they hold together nicely. Very similar to the XTP, but bonding makes all the difference, so my advice is to stick with bonded or monolithic if you are referring to smokeless and possibly even when using T7 or Bh..
 
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Furys are bonded. XTPs are not. That said, you can get velocities up pretty good on the fury bullets if needed to get the accuracy you want without having the bullets gernade or disintegrate on bone like an XTP that has a much lower operating velocity range might.

I've killed deer with my Kodiak .45 and 200 grain XTPs just fine but even at BH209 speeds [maybe 2200-2300 pfs] the bullets came apart. Last fall when I got my Fury 225 grain .40s cals I took a 50 gallon garbage can and filled it with folded, packed newspaper and filled it with water, let the paper take up the water they could then rolled it out on the range 100 yards and pinned a plastic plate on the exposed paper and shot one each of the fury 225 and a 200 xtp into it, one shot on either side of the plate to keep them apart. I used my Patriot for this using 56 grains of IMR4198. When I pulled the paper mass from the barrel by layers it became apparent that the XTP was in several pieces and had about 14" of penetration. That 225 grain Fury was in one nicely expanded piece with just under 22" of penetration. I decided right there that in the Patriot I was going to hunt with either a Barnes XPB or the Fury, hopefully both, but only managed one deer with the Patriot using a Barnes 195. I have several boxes of 200 grain XTPs and use them exclusively in the Kodiak to hunt and in the Patriot at the range.

I have shot .40 A-Frames in the Patriot at the same charge level and they hold together nicely. Very similar to the XTP, but bonding makes all the difference, so my advice is to stick with bonded or monolithic if you are referring to smokeless and possibly even when using T7 or Bh..
Nice test. If you want to do it again with the XTP mags (vs. the non mag XTP and Fury)i will send you a bunch.
 
Pending state I`d go to an all lead bullet like a 240 grain hollow point, WHY? Cumberland Outdoors Man on youtube shows exactly why, jump over investigate T/C Shock Wave, Spoiler is that actually 1 in 10 actually perform decent enough, that was my trial with them Cumberland Outdoors Man has about the same rate. Copper Jacketed Bullet are only equal to failures
 
Pending state I`d go to an all lead bullet like a 240 grain hollow point, WHY? Cumberland Outdoors Man on youtube shows exactly why, jump over investigate T/C Shock Wave, Spoiler is that actually 1 in 10 actually perform decent enough, that was my trial with them Cumberland Outdoors Man has about the same rate. Copper Jacketed Bullet are only equal to failures
I gotta check that out.
 
Pending state I`d go to an all lead bullet like a 240 grain hollow point, WHY? Cumberland Outdoors Man on youtube shows exactly why, jump over investigate T/C Shock Wave, Spoiler is that actually 1 in 10 actually perform decent enough, that was my trial with them Cumberland Outdoors Man has about the same rate. Copper Jacketed Bullet are only equal to failures
Please post a link.
 
Muzzle Loading unless smoke less, well to its core has been soft lead.

these are Thompson Centers Lead, I lay into 5-6 boxes each season, I can cost from 2024 until dead, and still have, Now the coppers, Plinking and target, just my opinion
 
Copper Jacketed Bullet are only equal to failures
Couldn’t disagree more with that statement.

The bonded 300 gr TC Shockwaves have been my go-to for years. I’ve killed hundreds of animals from impala to moose with them. I’ve been very happy with terminal performance.

The 250 gr non-bonded (that the dude tested there) is of course a totally different bullet.
 
Couldn’t disagree more with that statement.

The bonded 300 gr TC Shockwaves have been my go-to for years. I’ve killed hundreds of animals from impala to moose with them. I’ve been very happy with terminal performance.

The 250 gr non-bonded (that the dude tested there) is of course a totally different bullet.
Well I say Good for You, as for me copper jacketed bullets, just fail. I went back to straight lead about 22 years ago in my smokeless, when I started down black powder I attempted Shock Waves, NOPE the results are POSTED copper jackets only fail, back to PRB or a hollow point in lead only, I can pour my own thus saving time, money and road trips. If your results vary KUDOS but I have seen and tested the failure rate, I will pass when my or families life on the line failure is not an option. Now That is ME and my Opinion. If Copper Jackets are your Friend Party ON my Friend.
 
Muzzle Loading unless smoke less, well to its core has been soft lead.

these are Thompson Centers Lead, I lay into 5-6 boxes each season, I can cost from 2024 until dead, and still have, Now the coppers, Plinking and target, just my opinion

Those would do better if they were slowed down.
 
Those would do better if they were slowed down.
Not Really much better my testing was 80 and 85 grains and 30 shock waves out of which 3 opened, I do not like those odds. Following a few months later I had copper jackets peel off others and get stuck in the chamber, next round would not load, I had to peel the Jacket out of the Chamber. Slow em down if you want, I no longer fool with Copper Jackets they are ineffective and unreliable. That is also on my 9mm .40s and .45s I cast semi-wad cutters, round ball and hollow points, I will not fool with copper jackets.
 
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