PRB - Ya'll finally convinced me!

[snapbang]

'sewerpipe on a stick'

LOL, Thats funny. Very descriptive.

 

[deermanok]

Here's a sample of fired patches from my last outing.
The round one is the over powder and the square is the ball patch.
I'm using cut strips of ticking and precut round patches.

 

[Dave951]

LOL, Thats funny. Very descriptive.

Yup, and it's butt ugly too. I out shot a fellow at the range who had a practically new TC. His excuse was "some rust in the bore". You should have seen the look on his face when I showed him the bore on mine, priceless. Moral is, most muzzleloaders will shoot if you take the time to experiment and find what works.

 

[snapbang]

Moral is, most muzzleloaders will shoot if you take the time to experiment and find what works.

I had a friend supply me with a knight that sounds like a twin to your sewer pipe. I scrubbed it out but there was barely any rifling to speak of. At least not noticeable. Without any load development I put two bullets an inch apart at 80 yards. Agreed, you need to try it before you condemn it.

 

[Fyrstyk]

I have an 1840ish .35 caliber percussion rifle that has a very rough bore, even after scrubbing with bore paste and a scotch brite patch. The gun will still shoot 1" groups at 50 yards with 35 grains of 3f, a .015 mink oil lubed patched ball, and a 1/4" thick felt over powder wad.

 

[Dave951]

One of my friends in the N-SSA had an original 1858 Smith that was MISSING chunks of rifling and it would shoot 1in groups at 50yd.

 

[UndeadPoet]

As long as your lubed patches aren't dripping wet, you'll be alright.
Some shooters use 5 or 10 grains of corn meal as a filler between powder and patched ball.

Can’t do that now…corn meal is getting as rare and expensive as real black powder…

 

[Captain Dock]

Reading this thread makes me want to try PRB! I am even getting into the vernacular! However I am starting from scratch.
With a .45 Encore and .45 Disc, what diameter ball is recommended? I am transitioning to BH209, suggested starting loads?
And to completely my spoon feeding, where to get the patches?
TIA

 

[Dave951]

Reading this thread makes me want to try PRB! I am even getting into the vernacular! However I am starting from scratch.
With a .45 Encore and .45 Disc, what diameter ball is recommended? I am transitioning to BH209, suggested starting loads?
And to completely my spoon feeding, where to get the patches?
TIA

This isn't rocket science.

Generically speaking this is a good starting point, experimentation will lead to accuracy.

440 round ball, .015 pillow ticking patch (wally world), spit patch to start, 50g 3f loose black powder

Make your own patches. Pillow ticking is cheap. Wash hot and dry hot to remove sizing and tighten weave. Cut to strips about an inch wide. Use on the muzzle and cut with patch knife just after short starting while loading OR, cut to squares a bit larger than the barrel and load as is. If double patching, dry patch on powder followed by lubed patch and ball- spit or whatever. I use Neatsfoot oil in my sewerpipe.

 

[rfd]

PRB is THE way to go for me, too. I use patch strips cut at the muzzle and see no need for anything to go over the powder and before homing down the PRB. Patch lube is important and bear oil (thanx Ed!) has become my fave, followed by GatoFeo. Patch strips are prelubed. Fouling control is another important issue for my shooting, and each long gun dictates when and how that's accomplished.

Lastly (actually, this is a firstly), ALL my rifled gun bbls get the "Lee Shaver" treatment before the first shot is taken (even if the gun has been used).

Excerpt from “Breaking In a Barrel” by Lee Shaver:

Several years ago, I developed a process for breaking-in barrels for lead
bullet use that eliminated the afternoon of shooting and cleaning with
jacketed bullet. It began because I would occasionally have to get bad
leading out of a barrel for a customer, and when you charge what a
gunsmith must charge to stay in business you don’t want to spend an
afternoon scrubbing the lead out of a customer’s gun. And I’m sure the
customer would rather not pay for said services.

What I learned was that when scrubbing lead out of a barrel, I could run
a tight oily patch through a few times and then take the patch off the
jag. I would then unroll a little 0000 steel wool and cut a piece the size
of the patch. Place that over the patch and then run it all through
together. (The proper fit is when you have to bump the rod a few times
with the palm of your hand to get it started in the bore.) When you
shove that steel wool over a patch through the bore of a badly leaded
barrel, it may sound like paper tearing as the lead is ripped out of the
barrel in a pass or two. I can clean the lead out of the worst barrel in
about ten or fifteen minutes that way, and an average leaded barrel will
be clean in a few strokes.

After using this technique for a while, I began to notice that the rifles
that I was de-leading that way seemed to lead less afterwards, which
got me to thinking. We use fine steel wool on the outside of old guns all
the time to do some cleaning or spot rust removal, and it does not
damage the surface of the steel. It just scrubs it. Which lead me to
consider the fact that we are trying to break in a barrel by smoothing
the surface without cutting, and it seems to me that process would go
much quicker if we used something on the inside of the bore that was
closer to the hardness of the barrel instead of lead or copper. So I
started trying the steel wool and oiled patch technique on new barrels
before shooting them. I use it about as tight as I can get in the bore and
wear out a steel wool pad or two in about 15 minutes, then I go and
shoot the rifle.

How well does it work you might ask? On a few occasions, I have built a
new rifle and taken it to a match without ever having fired the rifle. All
have performed flawlessly in their first match and several times I won
the match or set a record with them. On one occasion, I set a new 300
yard range record with the first 13 shots out of a barrel. This method
has become a service we offer to our customers here in the shop and I
have shared the technique many times with others.

 

[middlejohn]

PRB is THE way to go for me, too. I use patch strips cut at the muzzle and see no need for anything to go over the powder and before homing down the PRB. Patch lube is important and bear oil (thanx Ed!) has become my fave, followed by GatoFeo. Patch strips are prelubed. Fouling control is another important issue for my shooting, and each long gun dictates when and how that's accomplished.

Lastly (actually, this is a firstly), ALL my rifled gun bbls get the "Lee Shaver" treatment before the first shot is taken (even if the gun has been used).

Excerpt from “Breaking In a Barrel” by Lee Shaver:

Several years ago, I developed a process for breaking-in barrels for lead
bullet use that eliminated the afternoon of shooting and cleaning with
jacketed bullet. It began because I would occasionally have to get bad
leading out of a barrel for a customer, and when you charge what a
gunsmith must charge to stay in business you don’t want to spend an
afternoon scrubbing the lead out of a customer’s gun. And I’m sure the
customer would rather not pay for said services.

What I learned was that when scrubbing lead out of a barrel, I could run
a tight oily patch through a few times and then take the patch off the
jag. I would then unroll a little 0000 steel wool and cut a piece the size
of the patch. Place that over the patch and then run it all through
together. (The proper fit is when you have to bump the rod a few times
with the palm of your hand to get it started in the bore.) When you
shove that steel wool over a patch through the bore of a badly leaded
barrel, it may sound like paper tearing as the lead is ripped out of the
barrel in a pass or two. I can clean the lead out of the worst barrel in
about ten or fifteen minutes that way, and an average leaded barrel will
be clean in a few strokes.

After using this technique for a while, I began to notice that the rifles
that I was de-leading that way seemed to lead less afterwards, which
got me to thinking. We use fine steel wool on the outside of old guns all
the time to do some cleaning or spot rust removal, and it does not
damage the surface of the steel. It just scrubs it. Which lead me to
consider the fact that we are trying to break in a barrel by smoothing
the surface without cutting, and it seems to me that process would go
much quicker if we used something on the inside of the bore that was
closer to the hardness of the barrel instead of lead or copper. So I
started trying the steel wool and oiled patch technique on new barrels
before shooting them. I use it about as tight as I can get in the bore and
wear out a steel wool pad or two in about 15 minutes, then I go and
shoot the rifle.

How well does it work you might ask? On a few occasions, I have built a
new rifle and taken it to a match without ever having fired the rifle. All
have performed flawlessly in their first match and several times I won
the match or set a record with them. On one occasion, I set a new 300
yard range record with the first 13 shots out of a barrel. This method
has become a service we offer to our customers here in the shop and I
have shared the technique many times with others.

Great info..........thanks for posting.........

 

[rfd]

For those who don't know Lee Shaver, he's one of the best, if not The Best, gunsmith in America that specializes in firearms of the 19th century, and he's a world class muzzleloader long range match champion to boot.

 

[Dave951]

I have a set of Lee Shaver Soule sights on my original 1869 rolling block. Lee is a great guy and knows his stuff. I've spoken with him on several occasions.