Time to Test the 1:48 Twists Capabilities

[Idaholewis]

I just put together an OLD, Yet New Un-fired .50 Cal TC Renegade. I plan to test both the .50 and 54 Cal STOCK 1:48 Twist Barrels to the FULLEST, I will Soon find out what they Will, and Will Not do? As most of you guy’s know i Shoot Green Mountain Fast Twist Bullet Barrels on the Majority of my Rifles, i have never Tested a Stock 1:48 Twist to it’s Fullest Potential? And as Many of you know, i have a BUNCH of Bullets for Both .50 and .54 Cal, From Mild to WILD, Grease Groove, Paper Patch, Even Jacketed Sabotless (.50 Cal)

I found this Old TC Tang Peep for a “Song & Dance” So i grabbed it. It just Showed up today

I had to Drill & Tap the Tang on this one, Some are done from the Factory, and Some Not.

I installed my Favorite Lyman 17 Globe front Sight, With Lee Shaver Fine BPCR inserts. NOW i can Shoot this thing to it’s FULLEST Potential

I have this Bore Looking like a Mirror, She’s Ready to “Roll Out”

 

[daveheffner110]

I will be watching this with great interest. There is much to learn for me. Lewis, make sure to address the hunting side as well as the target shooting group.

 

[Idaholewis]

I will be watching this with great interest. There is much to learn for me. Lewis, make sure to address the hunting side as well as the target shooting group.

I Definitely will Dave

 

[Matthew323]

I'd really like to see you wring out the Lee R.E.A.L. molds, especially in slightly harder than normal alloys. The rifling in a 1:48" twist T/C barrel is only 0.005" deep; only 0.0005"-0.0015" deeper than a typical fast twist barrel's rifling.

A 1:60 to 1:40 alloy just might shine, especially with the picky R.E.A.L.'s.

It will be interesting to see just how accurate the Lee R.E.A.L.'s, and the Thompson/Center Maxi-Ball & Maxi-Hunter bullets can be made to shoot by someone with your casting abilities.

 

[Saxtonyoung]

With a boat load of 1-48" twist barrels out there this is definitely a worthwhile project . Playing with the Accurate 50-345M I've gotten some decent 100 yard groups but the main issue is that the stock bead sight on my TC Hawken covers the whole target. Definitely need to take your lead and install a Lyman 17 globe with some Lee Shavers inserts. Running the numbers the 54 caliber should be better suited for the 1-48 twist , I however have decided to stick with the 50.

 

[edmehlig]

Who knows, but I doubt it, I may even try my 54 cal Renegade bbl again that is just sitting in my Gun Safe gathering dust. Then I also need to start shooting my Flintlock Lyman Deerstalker. I haven't fired her in years since I started shooting my White's and Renegade.

Lew, let us/me know if you come up with some lighter loads for the 54 cal that shoots good. I hate Recoil especially since I had Rotator Cuff surgery.

 

[sdporter]

With a boat load of 1-48" twist barrels out there this is definitely a worthwhile project . Playing with the Accurate 50-345M I've gotten some decent 100 yard groups but the main issue is that the stock bead sight on my TC Hawken covers the whole target. Definitely need to take your lead and install a Lyman 17 globe with some Lee Shavers inserts. Running the numbers the 54 caliber should be better suited for the 1-48 twist , I however have decided to stick with the 50.

Maybe you’re not doing this but, try not to think of the center of the front bead as the center of POI. Try this: Aim at the smallest target you can still see and put it right on the top of the front bead.

 

[edmehlig]

What Sdporter said is what they taught me in the Marines. Have your target sit on top of your post and have your bullets hit there at 6 o’clock. It is what they called “Point of AIM, = Point of Impact”. Made perfect sense to me and works great for hunting as well!

 

[Hatchet Jack]

My .50 cal. 1-48 Renegade barrel shoots good groups with;
460 grain NE, an oversized wool wad pushed by 65 grains of 2F Swiss.

 

[Idaholewis]

I am looking forward to Testing this in every way i can think of

Truth is, The 1:48 Twist has never fascinated me in the least, the first thing i do with these Stock Renegade And Hawken’s (Most of them had Barrels that were not in Great Shape) I Pull the Factory Barrel and Replace them with a Green Mountain LRH (Fast Twist) For Bullets, Or a Green Mountain Slow Twist Roundball Barrel. In theory the 1:48 Twist is suppose to Shoot a Bullet, or Roundball Equally well, But this Twist is Not a Master with Either Projectile. Personally, I would Rather have Dedicated Twists for each Projectile, But that also means you need 2 Separate Rifles, No doubt these Companies that Go with the 1:48 Twist are Doing so for the “General” Public, They Know that Not everyone Has the ability, or the Want for a SAFE FULL of Muzzleloaders like some of us So i fully understand their Reasoning Behind the 1:48 “Compromise” Twist

I believe that PURE Lead will be my Best Friend here, and Alloy will be the Enemy? Back when i got in to Muzzleloading, i started down this Rd with Paper Patch Bullets and was Met with DISASTROUS FAILURE, But truth is, I didn’t know what the Heck i was Doing Back then? I figured Lead was Lead? I didn’t think Hardness Would Matter? I had more outings than i care to remember that I literally couldn’t hit the Entire Target I had Bullets Plow Through the Ground in front of my Target, Bounce up and Break my Target Frame, And other Shots i had no idea where they Went? I’m not sure it was Safe to Stand Behind me Come to find out, the Lead i had mixed in with my PURE stuff was HARD, Like Wheel Weight Hard! Therefore I Ruined a WHOLE Batch of Good Soft Plumbers Lead, I stil have that Stuff in Ingots, Piled up out in my Garage

Anyway, I am going in to this Project with a Lot of Learned Knowledge. And just as importantly, with PLENTY of Previous FAILURE, But i learned a Lot Back then, So All wasn’t Wasted. I plan to Focus mainly on Pure Lead, and up to, But NOT exceeding 1-40 Alloy.

What got me interested in this? I have seen the 1:48 Twist Shoot Pretty DARN GOOD, And Since i Can’t Shoot Regular Open sights worth a DARN, I thought to myself Why not Set one of these NICE Old Stock 1:48 Twist Rifles i have up with my Sight System, That i can Shoot REALLY Well, And put the 1:48 Twist to the Test.

 

[Saxtonyoung]

I usually just use a 9" paper plate as a target out to 100 yards and when the bead covers the plate I shoot. Yes I understand the whole aim small-miss small concept that's why I believe a finer bead would be beneficial. I'm already using the Lyman 17 with Lee Shavers inserts on another muzzleloader and it helps tremendously.

 

[Harleysboss]

Hey Lewis, don't have the results be to good. People will see it and it will drive up the prices on the TC guns with 1-48 barrels.

 

[Matthew323]

What Sdporter said is what they taught me in the Marines. Have your target sit on top of your post and have your bullets hit there at 6 o’clock. It is what they called “Point of AIM, = Point of Impact”. Made perfect sense to me and works great for hunting as well!

When I get my Optima V2 pistol back in my hands I am trying to figure out how to incorporate a low globe front sight with a quick-detachable rear sight. One that will attach to the Warne, rear, steel, Weaver/Picatinny scope base. That can be removed, and replaced with the same repeatability that the Warne Q-D lever scope rings can be.

So I can shoot a 6 o'clock hold with a fine bead insert, and not obscure my target. My vision already sucks bad enough without handicapping myself any farther.

 

[edmehlig]

Then that 6 O'clock hold will put your bullets at 6 O'clock and that will be your new bullseye for the range you sighted it in at.

 

[DESPERATE LEE]

Lewis
i am waiting on your results. Do you plan on PP any bullets for the Renegade? My 1:48 twist TC Hawken would like to know. I have 410, 385, and 240 grn bullets waiting to see your results. All are GG bullets from Hornady. Great Plains and PA pure swaged lead.
DL

 

[Confederate rifleman]

My 3 .50 caliber and 1 .54 barrels are watching carefully.
Happily, all 3 .50's ( 2 Hawken caplock and a Renegade flint) LOVE sabots with up to 250 grain 45 XTP's. The Renegade also likes 200 grain 45 XTP's.
But I'd like my sidelocks to handle ball and conical too. Especially minies. Ditto the .54. Day may come when sabots might be the weak link. Gotta be able to shoot!

 

[DESPERATE LEE]

I tried sabots when i first got my TC Hawken back in the late 70's or early 80's and i was not impressed with them, but maybe now days there is alot of improvement in bullets and sabots. Me thinks i will just stay with big lead in my rifles.
DL

 

[Hatchet Jack]

PS......My 1-48 also shoots the Hornady Great Plains 385 grain cupped base very well also. With a variety of different loads. No wads needed.

 

[Matthew323]

Anybody, besides me, think that the compilation of ALL of our members' TESTED & PROVEN ( in at least 3 different barrels?), 1:48" twist load data should become a sticky at some point in the future?

 

[DESPERATE LEE]

I would say so. The 1:48 twist was TC's goto twist was it not? I have read many manufacturers used that same twist. Good to know others like it and use it. Now if Lewis does his magic, as he always does, we can all get a better a understanding of how to work these loads more easily. My $.02 worth. And by the way Lewis thank you for all you do and the effort you put into it.
DL