I'm in my 70's, own and live on my own hunting ground and would like to get another deer after rifle season to consume. Shot's would be close, maybe out the kitchen window or from a heated enclosed stand, nothing long range, hopefully something close to my truck. If price was no object and you wanted something for the kids and grand kids to inherit, what would you buy? I'm partial to Leupold scopes, have Vari X III's on my rifle season guns. I have no gun stores within a few hours drive that stock much to look at so would appreciate advise on what to buy and from what source.
What should I buy?
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Knight Ultra-Lite. Other then Knight direct as far as buying not sure. Maybe others know somewhere else.
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Where you live and what hunting regulations your state has may determine what rifle you buy.
Cooper Firearms makes a beautiful looking wood stocked muzzleloader. That was the first rifle that came to mind when you mentioned passing it down the family line. They are expensive but I would think a rifle from them would be top-notch.
You don't have to pick a factory produced rifle either, a custom rifle could be built for you or you could do the work yourself. There are many builders and options to choose from.
Cooper Firearms makes a beautiful looking wood stocked muzzleloader. That was the first rifle that came to mind when you mentioned passing it down the family line. They are expensive but I would think a rifle from them would be top-notch.
You don't have to pick a factory produced rifle either, a custom rifle could be built for you or you could do the work yourself. There are many builders and options to choose from.
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Where you live and what hunting regulations your state has may determine what rifle you buy.
Imo buying a factory built rifle. I would definitely put knight mountaineer and ulite at top.
I would also consider finding a very nice stainless700 ml and have it rebarreled and boltnose kit installed with custom stock of choice. This can be done for little more than new knight and awesome rifle.
I hear if you go to knight dealers there a dealer in nappanee, In
That stock alot of rifles at great price and he cks gun over and fixes any issues before shipping
Imo buying a factory built rifle. I would definitely put knight mountaineer and ulite at top.
I would also consider finding a very nice stainless700 ml and have it rebarreled and boltnose kit installed with custom stock of choice. This can be done for little more than new knight and awesome rifle.
I hear if you go to knight dealers there a dealer in nappanee, In
That stock alot of rifles at great price and he cks gun over and fixes any issues before shipping
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Welcome to this board alfalfa
When I think of bolt-action rifles, it reminds me of the 1950s and 1960s. Buy a modern muzzleloader and the link below offers you a wide choice/selection. The 2nd one listed below is an entry-level ML, called the Impact. Read about the other four T/C models and let us know which you find most appealing.
These fall/break-action muzzleloaders listed on the page below are the most modern and conceal the muzzleloader ignition systems the best. Sealing ignitions is #1 with me, when buying a muzzleloader. #2 is buying something with the least amount of large moving parts.
That's why I rule-out bolt-action muzzleloaders like the recommended Knight Ultra Light. It's a top-tier muzzleloader, for sure. But it's a bolt-action and the reason why Knight sells so little products these days. The #1 and #2 selling modern muzzleloaders today are either fall or break-action MLs. If Knight invested more heavily in fall-break action MLs, they would triple their business.
If I was in my 70s and wanted my kids to continue using my guns, I'd want them to have the most modern available today. If you agree, then scratch the idea of buying a bolt-action ML.
https://www.tcarms.com/firearms/muzzleloaders
When I think of bolt-action rifles, it reminds me of the 1950s and 1960s. Buy a modern muzzleloader and the link below offers you a wide choice/selection. The 2nd one listed below is an entry-level ML, called the Impact. Read about the other four T/C models and let us know which you find most appealing.
These fall/break-action muzzleloaders listed on the page below are the most modern and conceal the muzzleloader ignition systems the best. Sealing ignitions is #1 with me, when buying a muzzleloader. #2 is buying something with the least amount of large moving parts.
That's why I rule-out bolt-action muzzleloaders like the recommended Knight Ultra Light. It's a top-tier muzzleloader, for sure. But it's a bolt-action and the reason why Knight sells so little products these days. The #1 and #2 selling modern muzzleloaders today are either fall or break-action MLs. If Knight invested more heavily in fall-break action MLs, they would triple their business.
If I was in my 70s and wanted my kids to continue using my guns, I'd want them to have the most modern available today. If you agree, then scratch the idea of buying a bolt-action ML.
https://www.tcarms.com/firearms/muzzleloaders
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GoexBlackhorn said:
Cant say I agree with that at all.. A bolt muzzleloader is not only a more modern concept, but also a class above any break action.
But really, for short ranges, any muzzleloader will do. A lot comes down to budget and personal preference.
the 2 TOP selling muzzleloader are no doubt CVA or TC brands. the reason? Price and availability. they are mass produced to a much greater scale, and carried by virtually every sporting goods store, everywhere. Priced very competitively. Plus much more is spent on advertising, and commercial endorsement.
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I attend different classes than Squeeze and consider mine higher than his. My definition of bolt-action is old-school technology. Anything big and moves is subject to replacement in today's tech driven society. Smaller moves and less moves are more ideal in a product that sees the worst weather, coldest weather and worst climates of the shooting industry.
The most popular of all mid-winter shooting sports is rabbit hunting. How many rabbit guns have I witnessed that are single-shot bolt-action?..... ummmm zero.
How many fall-season squirrel guns have I witnessed that are bolt-actions..... ummm zero again. Why?..... cumbersome to work and reload.
Doc White was another muzzleloader patriot that went out of business because he never adapted to modern technology and what ML purchasers wanted most........ fall or break-action muzzleloaders.
I am done with this. Hopefully I get new member alfalfa at least considering what his sons and grandsons will be shooting in future decades.
The most popular of all mid-winter shooting sports is rabbit hunting. How many rabbit guns have I witnessed that are single-shot bolt-action?..... ummmm zero.
How many fall-season squirrel guns have I witnessed that are bolt-actions..... ummm zero again. Why?..... cumbersome to work and reload.
Doc White was another muzzleloader patriot that went out of business because he never adapted to modern technology and what ML purchasers wanted most........ fall or break-action muzzleloaders.
I am done with this. Hopefully I get new member alfalfa at least considering what his sons and grandsons will be shooting in future decades.
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Not necessarily in this order but these are all very fine options.
Knight Ultra Lite...near custom level at a sub custom price.
New Ultra Light Arms M209,,,got a year to wait and like a SUPER light rifle?
Custom built 45cal on a Remington action...these are nearly impossible to beat with all the Rem700 aftermarket support. The options are endless.
Cooper M22...lotta custom built rifle for the price and very little wait time to get one.
Gunwerks or Swinglock...SUPER expensive though and it might take a long time to get one....a very long time.
No break action will ever hold a candle to any of these in quality or performance unless you have one custom built. They do exist.
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That is just plain silly. I shot so many rabbits and squirrels with bolt action 22s as a kid that i got tired of hunting them.
I suppose you have seen tons of rabbit guns in a break action too. :wink:
This shows how little you know about Doc White and why White went under....Try again after doing more research on what happened between White and Knight rifle.
I suppose you have seen tons of rabbit guns in a break action too. :wink:
This shows how little you know about Doc White and why White went under....Try again after doing more research on what happened between White and Knight rifle.
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GM54-120 said:
The ones you list are custom built. Even Knight sells so few muzzleloaders these days. Why/.... because they're all bolt-actions and devote little or nothing investment power to their Knight Vision series.... or even look to expand it.
If a custom builder would move into the fall/break-action concepts, they would hold a bigger candle than your bolt-action.
Get off the 1950s and 60s. Open your arms to 2017. Candles today are made much better too.
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The old Knight did move to break actions and what did it get them?
Even Wakeman figured it out.
While you are at it reread the OPs post which i quoted the relevant part. He is looking for something special.
Even Wakeman figured it out.
While you are at it reread the OPs post which i quoted the relevant part. He is looking for something special.
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You make no sense at all. What exactly is it that makes a break action better than bolt on a Muzzleloader? On ANY level, for any purpose?
In What competition circuit does a break action beat a bolt? or even outside competition? production, and availability only. You seem aware of the date, but not the subject.
In What competition circuit does a break action beat a bolt? or even outside competition? production, and availability only. You seem aware of the date, but not the subject.
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Some people seem to forget that at one time Knight made several break actions as well as a rolling block and the Revolution trying to compete with cheaper imports. Even the KP1 was not well accepted even though it was the best of the bunch. All those ventures cost Knight millions in revenue because you simply cant make it here for the same price.
Those Walmart end of year blow outs and Cabelas "bargain cave" sales just make it even harder. CVA made millions selling them buy the train loads to those places. Half price sales on made in America MLs are few and far between. Its simple economics.
The current Knight has never wanted to compete with cheaper imports. Why would they? Cooper surely isnt trying to compete with Savage/Remington/Winchester and its obvious why...Its not the market share they are targeting.
Companies like NULA, Gunwerks and Swinglock are backed up for years in some cases making those "old 50s and 60s tech" rifles. Why in the world would they care if you want a break action and they dont get a piece of that pie? ATM Swinglock has a 3 year waiting list. NULA is about a year. Try ordering a Shiloh Sharps and see how long you wait.
Those Walmart end of year blow outs and Cabelas "bargain cave" sales just make it even harder. CVA made millions selling them buy the train loads to those places. Half price sales on made in America MLs are few and far between. Its simple economics.
The current Knight has never wanted to compete with cheaper imports. Why would they? Cooper surely isnt trying to compete with Savage/Remington/Winchester and its obvious why...Its not the market share they are targeting.
Companies like NULA, Gunwerks and Swinglock are backed up for years in some cases making those "old 50s and 60s tech" rifles. Why in the world would they care if you want a break action and they dont get a piece of that pie? ATM Swinglock has a 3 year waiting list. NULA is about a year. Try ordering a Shiloh Sharps and see how long you wait.
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If it was me and my money, I would buy a Knight UltraLite. I love that rifle, and it fits my hunting style perfectly. Made in USA, high quality, light, compact, great looks/fit/feel, and a tack driver! IMO, the best production ML you can get.
As mentioned, any ML will work for those distances. It comes down to what you want.
As mentioned, any ML will work for those distances. It comes down to what you want.
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"Doc White was another muzzleloader patriot that went out of business because he never adapted to modern technology and what ML purchasers wanted most........ fall or break-action muzzleloaders."
Doc, had a falling block design that resembled the Ruger 1 that was in the works. Unfortunately White went out of business before it became a reality. I saw the design while hunting with Doc and strongly believe had they not went out of business it would have been the finest ML ever designed. Especially in a 45 caliber!!! LOL
Doc, had a falling block design that resembled the Ruger 1 that was in the works. Unfortunately White went out of business before it became a reality. I saw the design while hunting with Doc and strongly believe had they not went out of business it would have been the finest ML ever designed. Especially in a 45 caliber!!! LOL
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The only thing sexier than a Ruger #1 muzzle loader would be a High Wall. Several people have done the conversion. Even Bad Bull used to offer them.
This one is kind plain Jane but its still cool
This one is kind plain Jane but its still cool
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alfalfa
One doesn't need to spend $1K to 1.5K on a muzzleloader to have ownership of a nice gun. Plus a roundabout 5-$600 ML makes it so much more easy to take inside thick swamps, heavy brush or wading thru creek bottoms. Isn't that what our guns are for?.... to use in an anywhere / anytime situation, without fear or regret over an unfortunate scratch or nick on it?
Also, again my opinion, custom builders that are being pushed here like Cooper, should have considered "trend-in-technology" when designing their new bolt-action ML. It's one thing to customize a traditional ML, as many have done. But when customizing modern muzzleloaders, it only makes sense to design something that the current public are asking for and buying in large masses.
...... and that ain't bolt-action muzzleloaders BTW.
Cooper would be doubling or tripling their sales or waiting lists, had they designed that new make/model as a break/fall-action ML. There's no doubts about it. They do produce outstanding work. It's just unfortunate it's an outdated, old-school design, that's very expensive to own.... and not something to be carrying around in real-world hunting places, unlike the many fancy blinds and country club atmospheres, all decked-out with fancy tripods, roofs, heat and even food & coffee - plus bait piles galore with all kinds of hanging deer scents, that members here use on their private land.
That's not hunting folks. Come with me and my hunting buddies on public land and I'll show you some real-world primitive hunting, that requires gun scratches and nicks - no roofs - no blinds - no bait piles - no scents - no tripod gun rests.... certainly a place not fit for a customized Cooper for sure.
One doesn't need to spend $1K to 1.5K on a muzzleloader to have ownership of a nice gun. Plus a roundabout 5-$600 ML makes it so much more easy to take inside thick swamps, heavy brush or wading thru creek bottoms. Isn't that what our guns are for?.... to use in an anywhere / anytime situation, without fear or regret over an unfortunate scratch or nick on it?
Also, again my opinion, custom builders that are being pushed here like Cooper, should have considered "trend-in-technology" when designing their new bolt-action ML. It's one thing to customize a traditional ML, as many have done. But when customizing modern muzzleloaders, it only makes sense to design something that the current public are asking for and buying in large masses.
...... and that ain't bolt-action muzzleloaders BTW.
Cooper would be doubling or tripling their sales or waiting lists, had they designed that new make/model as a break/fall-action ML. There's no doubts about it. They do produce outstanding work. It's just unfortunate it's an outdated, old-school design, that's very expensive to own.... and not something to be carrying around in real-world hunting places, unlike the many fancy blinds and country club atmospheres, all decked-out with fancy tripods, roofs, heat and even food & coffee - plus bait piles galore with all kinds of hanging deer scents, that members here use on their private land.
That's not hunting folks. Come with me and my hunting buddies on public land and I'll show you some real-world primitive hunting, that requires gun scratches and nicks - no roofs - no blinds - no bait piles - no scents - no tripod gun rests.... certainly a place not fit for a customized Cooper for sure.
GM54-120 said:The only thing sexier than a Ruger #1 muzzle loader would be a High Wall. Several people have done the conversion. Even Bad Bull used to offer them.
This one is kind plain Jane but its still cool
That is cool!! More info please.
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yes, more info. definitely a rebarrel. What kind of ignition and plug?
definitely a rebarrel. What kind of ignition and plug?Similar threads
