slower powders

[1640]

I'm still new at this smokeless shooting but why don't we use slower powders? I have been useing the common powders that are mentioned here with out any problems. I almost grabbed some Varget to see what happens but I wimped out. I'm shooting a ULA with 250 to 300 bullets.

 

[Savage Shooter]

Maybe this will help

Maybe this will help some as a guideline to where burn rates apply to different bullet weights. As always this is a guide, you must test in YOUR gun. Start low and work up as with any load development. These loads have been shot in Savage ML's. I do not know how that compares with the ULA. I do know that some are real rompers & stompers in the Savage.

N120
250 grain bullet: 65-69 grains
300 grain bullet: 58-63 grains
350 grain bullet: 58-62 grains


H and Imr-4198: Maximum loads should be reduced by 2 grains if using Imr-4198 the loads listed are for H-4198
250 grain bullet: 65 to 71 grains
300 grain bullet: 64 to 68 grains
350 grain bullet: 64 to 66 grains
400 grain bullet: 60 to 64 grains

Reloader #7
250 grain bullet: 64 to 69 grains
300 grain bullet: 60 to 65 grains

N130
300 grain bullet: 69 to 73 grains
350 grain bullet: 64 to 68 grains

10X
250 grain bullet: 74 to 78 grains
300 grain bullet: 71 to 75 grains

H322
300 grain bullet: 72 to 76 grains
350 grain bullet: 70 to 74 grains
400 grain bullet: 66 to 70 grains

Xmr-2015 (very similar to H322)
300 grain bullet: 73 to 78 grains
350 grain bullet: 71 to 75 grains
400 grain bullet: 65 to 70 grains

Imr-3031
350 grain bullet: 77 to 80 grains
400 grain bullet: 73 to 76 grains

 

[SW]

why don't we use slower powders?

We don't use "slower" powders because the bullet moves comparatively easily compared to a cartridge gun which has both neck tension(minor) and land engraving(major). The bullet just goes down the barrel too easily for pressure to build with the slower powders, so we get around this by shooting faster powders. Another way, and better IMO, of getting around this "easy bullet movement" is to use 2 powders, a faster powder first and a slower powder over the faster powder(called duplex loading). Velocity std deviations have been much lower with duplex loading(there is no random mixing as some claim), pressure for velocity has been lower, and accuracy is better than single powders. Duplex helps most with 250g bullets in the 50 cal, some with 275g bullets, and less, but still some with 300g bullets.

 

[1640]

Thanks savage shooter for all that information. Did you ever chrony any of those loads? I never thought about how slick the bore is compared to a rifle when using sabots in the muzzle loader.

 

[mikec]

Re: Maybe this will help

These charge weights seem much higher than the Savage books recommend. Does the gun handle them OK with no damage? I would love to push my bullets a little faster!

Mike

Maybe this will help some as a guideline to where burn rates apply to different bullet weights. As always this is a guide, you must test in YOUR gun. Start low and work up as with any load development. These loads have been shot in Savage ML's. I do not know how that compares with the ULA. I do know that some are real rompers & stompers in the Savage.

N120
250 grain bullet: 65-69 grains
300 grain bullet: 58-63 grains
350 grain bullet: 58-62 grains


H and Imr-4198: Maximum loads should be reduced by 2 grains if using Imr-4198 the loads listed are for H-4198
250 grain bullet: 65 to 71 grains
300 grain bullet: 64 to 68 grains
350 grain bullet: 64 to 66 grains
400 grain bullet: 60 to 64 grains

Reloader #7
250 grain bullet: 64 to 69 grains
300 grain bullet: 60 to 65 grains

N130
300 grain bullet: 69 to 73 grains
350 grain bullet: 64 to 68 grains

10X
250 grain bullet: 74 to 78 grains
300 grain bullet: 71 to 75 grains

H322
300 grain bullet: 72 to 76 grains
350 grain bullet: 70 to 74 grains
400 grain bullet: 66 to 70 grains

Xmr-2015 (very similar to H322)
300 grain bullet: 73 to 78 grains
350 grain bullet: 71 to 75 grains
400 grain bullet: 65 to 70 grains

Imr-3031
350 grain bullet: 77 to 80 grains
400 grain bullet: 73 to 76 grains

 

[DW]

I have shot at or above the max load listed with 250gr and 300gr bullets and 10X, Rel 7, and H4198. They were safe in my gun.

Personally, I think the slower powders are better suited for 300gr bullets like SW said, in my experiences the 250's resulted in loads that were temp sensitive for the most part, with H4198 and duplex being the exception.

 

[DW]

Thanks savage shooter for all that information. Did you ever chrony any of those loads? I never thought about how slick the bore is compared to a rifle when using sabots in the muzzle loader.

74gr of H4198 was good for 2500+fps with a 250SST.

 

[Savage Shooter]

Re: Maybe this will help

These charge weights seem much higher than the Savage books recommend. Does the gun handle them OK with no damage? I would love to push my bullets a little faster!

Mike

Aw ha! Not the right question. You see the gun (SAVAGE) handles them fine, now as to how the shooter handles them that is the right question!

The Savage becomes a recoil beast with some of these loads, especially the higher quantity (slower) powders with heavier bullets.

As SW stated, with the 300gr bullets you can get good dependable speed with powders like Rel 7, 4198's, n120 (quite shootable) and even H322 or N130 (both of which become stompers).

I tend to get best accuracy with ANY 300 gr bullets in the 2300-2350fps range. The powders listed above can reach this easily.

But with the 250gr class bullets you bout gotta duplex to reach any real speed (2500 + fps) safely/dependably.