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Sharpsman

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For What It May Be Worth!

I'd like to make myself clear from the get go on my approach and reason for this brief synopsis and that it is not my intention to 'talk down' to anyone on this forum! Conversely so...it is my desire and intention to possibly help someone improve the accuracy of their marksmanship ability while shooting patched round balls with blackpowder! My job in the military for five years was as a shooter on the US Army Rifle Team and as an instructor. I won't delve into whatever my accomplishments were in shooting competition; that's all on record at the NRA Competitions Division and nothing else need be stated by me. For those of you that are inclined to read this short treatsie...the only thing you'll be out is a little time!

Newton's Third Law

"To every action there is always opposed an equal reaction"!

Thus when 100 grs. of FFg blackpowder is dropped down the bore of a muzzle loading rifle, a patched roundball crammed down atop the powder, a cap installed and the trigger is squeezed, we hear a loud BOOM, smoke rolls, and we feel a hefty shove back against our shoulder! If you've been shooting with a 'runny nose' it might pay you to wipe your upper lip off for the recoil possibly deposited what was in your nose there! While instructing at Camp Perry, Ohio at the National Matches one year I had occasion to listen to a friend give a marksmanship seminar basically upon the attributes of the .308 Winchester cartridge. One of the statements made by this gentlemen who was a champion shooter and also was in previous years employed as a ballistics engineer with the Frankfort Arsenal was that from the time the firing pin struck the primer of the cartridge until the bullet left the muzzle that the rifle would move rearward 40/1000 of an inch!!

How we control our rifles during the recoil phase has everything to do with the accuracy achieved! For anyone whom has ever shot .22 caliber rimfire in competition, one main lesson possibly realized was that if correct 'follow-through' procedure wasn't adhered to, the potential accuracy of the rifle would not be achieved! The velocity of .22 rimfire Eley Match Ammunition today is running IIRC somewhere around 1085-1100 fps! That's very slow when compared to most of the whizz-bang smokeless cartridges people are shooting today! How does this relate to we as lovers of shooting blackpowder and patched roundballs? It's really pretty simple when given some thought! What is so-called 'follow-through'? It is the LEARNED ABILITY to be able to pay attention to the iron-clad rules of marksmanship which are unyielding in their nature, to be able to establish as near as possible a static shooting position, the application of correct trigger control, correct utilization of vision, and to watch the sights all the way through the recoil phase and to be able to call the shot! These things are only learned by trigger time and making smoke!

When we go to the range today we're shooting rifles that have velocities ranging anywhere from possibly 1400-1900 fps depending of course upon caliber, projectile, and charge used; in some cases this is only 50% or less when compared to modern smokeless powder projectiles! Over a period of quite a few years in shooting heavy recoiling rifles such as a Sharps 50/90 or a Sharps 45 2 7/8 cartridges, with bullets weighing from 550 grs. upwards of 720 grs. that unless I could in some minute way control the rifles during the recoil phase that it would not be able to shoot good groups with consistency! From many photos I have examined posted on various forums showing shooting tables, shooting rest, etc. it appeared that my method is a little different! Here's a photo of my rest:

24809226089_62134a5153_b.jpg
GRRW .54 Caliber Hawken by Rick Mulhern, on Flickr

It's a rolled up shooting mat which I have shoved into the middle a 2" round stick of hickory to prevent the roll from collapsing and I have found this to be a very good front rest....FOR ME! Shooting off the left shoulder my right hand goes out to the very end of the forearm/underneath, and my hand is rested atop the shooting mat! I grasp the forearm with a good grip but not overly hard while pulling the butt plate back into my shoulder and in this manner the recoil can be somewhat dampened!  There is no rear bag! I know there are some good groups and accurate shooting done by folks that rest their rifle barrel or forearm directly upon a front rest while bringing their left arm/hand around to the rear rest. I have no problem with that; it just doesn't work for me! I have tried it both ways and more than once but in the final analysis it was proven on the target that even though my method may have been only helpful in a small degree toward controlling the recoil....that on the target it showed up in a big way!

Hey guys...I really like this forum! Many great comments and experiences showing up here!

HOLD HARD & STAY CENTER!! :cheers: :D
 
I rarely feel talked down to because I like to listen and always assume there is some one behind me in line. Carry on!
 
I don't feel talked down to at all on the forum. For the most part the majority here are already shooting and are happy with their results. How they shoot either with a sling or bench rest is how they enjoy shooting. (I haven't used a sling since I was in the Marine Corps back in '66). 
 Sometimes the subject may get a little heated or a member feels his "way is the only way" but we manage to get over it. 
What it boils down to is, it doesn't matter what kind of rifle he uses or powder or if he weighs his powder load or use a powder measurer. It doesn't matter if he shoots 3 round groups all touching at 100 or 200 yards or is happy with 3 rounds in a 9" circle or if he shoots offhand at 50 yards or off a rest.
We have a good bunch of members here that supply the forum with tons of info and for the new ML'er shooter whether it's traditional, in lines or  smokeless, he can always get info here.

Ray............. :thumbs up:
 
Im willing to try anything new. One thing that I do not like is laying down to shoot. Because I have a bulged disk in my neck, it hurts to look up and cock my head/neck area like we normally do when shooting.
 
I feel the same way guys!!  Some really good points, especially the "Follow through" definition. If a shooter wants to improve their skill level, Sharpsman stated it clearly: "These things are only learned by trigger time and making smoke!", and I might add......"Perfect" practice makes perfect.
 
FrontierGander said:
Im willing to try anything new. One thing that I do not like is laying down to shoot. Because I have a bulged disk in my neck, it hurts to look up and cock my head/neck area like we normally do when shooting.
The prone days for me are over also as I have two herniated disc in my lower back! And Old Arthur is beginning to hinder certain movements!
 
My back is garbage now. If I shot in the prone position i'd never get up.

Probably why I love shooting standing offhand. I'm already up.  :D
 
Man, maybe I should rename this place the Crippled back muzzle loading association! :lol!:
 
FrontierGander said:
Man, maybe I should rename this place the Crippled back muzzle loading association!  :lol!:
That would be fine, as long as you don't rename it to "broke back" muzzle loading association!
 
Playing six years of football and jumping out of airplanes eventually takes a toll!:cry:
 
I tried the cardboard today with a 2" orange dot and that worked out really well for me in bright sun light. I am considering building a new target stand with a sun shade.
 
No sun shade! :No: You'll have overcast days when you want to shoot and target resolution won't be good enough based on my prior experience! I think you'd do much better with the brown cardboard background and a black bull!  :D

What works for me may not be your cup of tea but this is what I use:

25153348021_4018b6dbb4_b.jpg
Hawkenzero by Rick Mulhern, on Flickr

This is when I first shot my GRRW Hawken as I was filing the front sight down and tapping the rear barrel sight around to get centered. The shots in the bull are my last eight rounds from 75 yards using 100 grs. KIK 2F powder and a Hornady .530" ball. I think it will do better than what's shown...but time will tell as I play with the charge a bit! The bull is 3" diameter for reference.
 
hawgslayer said:
I don't feel talked down to at all on the forum. For the most part the majority here are already shooting and are happy with their results. How they shoot either with a sling or bench rest is how they enjoy shooting. (I haven't used a sling since I was in the Marine Corps back in '66). 
 Sometimes the subject may get a little heated or a member feels his "way is the only way" but we manage to get over it. 
What it boils down to is, it doesn't matter what kind of rifle he uses or powder or if he weighs his powder load or use a powder measurer. It doesn't matter if he shoots 3 round groups all touching at 100 or 200 yards or is happy with 3 rounds in a 9" circle or if he shoots offhand at 50 yards or off a rest.
We have a good bunch of members here that supply the forum with tons of info and for the new ML'er shooter whether it's traditional, in lines or  smokeless, he can always get info here.

Ray............. :thumbs up:
Ray

" For the most part the majority here are already shooting and are happy with their results"

And the NEW SHOOTER coming into the game was who my initial posting was directed toward! Many people are rather fearful of asking questions for not wanting to appear ignorant! Well...I'm ignorant about the correct procedure for doing brain surgery....but I could learn with the right training and information offered! :cheers: :cheers:
 
Like I said, lot's of free info whether it's smokeless, in lines or side locks. Post your questions and I'll bet you'll get more then a few opinions or first hand knowledge replies to help you out.
One thing you have to keep in mind............... :scratch: 
Read all the replies, digest them and then do what's good for you because not every rifle or powder or powder charge or bullet or primer works the same in every rifle no matter what your shooting. 
Good luck,
Ray............. :thumbs up:

You can always send a PM if that's more to your liking.
 

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