What do you think?

[nuprofessor]

I have to admit, I have been cheating on another muzzleloader website   .

I received this from the other site.  Most of it I can believe, but one comment- that Fiocci 616 primers are not hot enough to use with BH209 I call BS!  I have used Fiocci exclusively since starting BH209 and have NEVER had an issue.
Anyone else with an opinion on that statement?

I have attached the message I received below:

From

• MuzzleloadingTips.com  
  
  
  
  

To

• Mike Hughes
  

<table id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5798" align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="600"><tr id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5796"><td id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5795"><table id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5794" style="text-align: left; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial, sans-serif; font-size: 12px; margin-bottom: 5px;" align="left" bgcolor="#ffffff" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="600"><tr id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5792"><td id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5791" class="yiv4822406021body" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 12px;"><table id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5788" class="yiv4822406021row" style="width: 100%;"><tr id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5786"><td id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5785" class="yiv4822406021container" style="width: 33%;" valign="top" width="33%">[font=Arial, sans-serif]Hi Mike
You bet they will!   And here's why...
Some 209 primers are just too hot...they throw too much flame.  I have to tell you, I have never used any of the "for muzzleloader only" primers.  For one thing they are too expensive compared to other primers.  You will soon see what I use...and why.

Primers that are too hot can move the charge/sabot-bullet slightly up the barrel.  This will decrease your accuracy because of the lack of consistency and the load not leaving the barrel from the same spot.  Does that make sense?
Of all the brands I have used and tested, which is most of them, the Fiocchi 616 , primer gives me the best groups for a 209 primer.  From testing I have done, this one has proven to be least hot... I have never had a miss fire or hang-fire.  I use them with Triple 7 and Pyrodex RS.  Not hot enough for Blackhorn 209.
All of the being said...here's the ignition system gives me the tightest groups.  The Vari-flame adapter.  Click here to find out more. These will ignite BH 209 as well as Pyrodex RS and Triple 7.  I have the older version that uses small rifle primers, with Triple 7 with outstanding results.  Click Here to take a look (target is under the heading, Hodgdon Triple 7 Results).  They replaced them with this one.  Will soon be adding the new system.

I have used CCI Magnum 209's, Remington STS and Winchester 209's with BH 209 (not Triple 7 or Pyrodex RS). and get decent results with no mis-fires or hang fires.  The Vari-flame adapters will shrink the groups even more.
Here's two of the targets from a week ago...I did not scale weigh the powder on these.  Click here to see them.  These were shot with CCI 209M's.  I will post more results in the future with the Vari Flame adapters.

Not much difference in the two groups with 10 volume grains less.  Hmmm...in this instance more powder is not better from an accuracy standpoint.
Smoke note:   Here's what the folks at Blackhorn 209 have to say about which primers they recommend...just click on the link below...

What is the best primer for Blackhorn 209?
There you have it.  Primers make a difference, sometimes significant, in the accuracy of your muzzleloader.
Well, I hope you picked something up from this issue that will help you out.
In the next issue we will talk about how sabot alignment can effect accuracy...Until then...
Aim small, miss small and have fun with your smoker.
Take care,
Paul Sammons
www.muzzleloadingtips.com


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<table id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5991" style="padding: 8px !important; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana !important; font-size: 10px !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);" align="center" border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="600"><tr id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5989"><td id="yui_3_7_2_1_1378833269900_5988" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Verdana !important; font-size: 10px !important; background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);">210 S 23rd Street, Temple, TX 76504, USA</td></tr></table>

 

[exMember]

I had some misfires with the fiocchi primers when i had the original plug, but no issues with the BH209 Plug and those primers. I strictly use CCI 209M primers as I want the hottest primer available.

I do not agree with the, hot primers push loads off before the powder ignites BS. I've shot the W209, CCI and federal 209a primers with pyrodex and t7 and no accuracy issues other than the bad crud ring we all have come to hate.

 

[hawgslayer1]

 
I'm not going to bum wrap anyone or anything here but I use FIOCCHI 616-209 PRIMERS. Never had a problem with them. Never had a miss or hang fire. I use them with Blackhorn 209 and wouldn't change.  Had lots of problems with Remington STS primers with burn/crud ring. No crud/burn ring with Fiocchi's. As far as accuracy goes, just check the range reports.  
I don't know what kind of comparisons this guy did. I just wonder but after the statement, "Not hot enough for Blackhorn". I just didn't read any further.

Ray.............

 

[Muley Hunter]

I think the pushing the load started with pellet loads. If my memory isn't failing me again?

 

[Muley Hunter]

I signed up for his newsletters. We'll see what he has to say, and if his tips are just pleasing sponsors.

 

[patocazador]

I have been using Remington #97 primers that are over 20 years old. No failures yet.

 

[exMember]

im not sure the veri flame works with bh209 as well. I always heard the pistol/rifle primers were not strong enough to set it off.

 

[GregK1]

I've shot hundreds of 616 primers. Never had an issue. This guy sounds like a user/marketer

 

[MLN1963]

I use the Fiocchi 616 exclusively and have had zero misfires or hang fires with Blackhorn 209.

 

[Spitfire1]

Like Pete says ..maybe he's just pleasing his sponsors ?

 

[Underclocked]

On Carlos recommendation I bought some Fiocchi 616 and have not had any issues with them. They even worked fine in my modified Hunterbolt using the wolf breech plug. Just need to make sure to get the carbon out.

 

[Muley Hunter]

He might have tried them in a gun with a lousy BP, but I don't see how rifle primers would be any better?

We'll see when he starts sending me his tips.

 

[SCHUNTER1]

I used PR Bullets (Cecil) BH209 BP for the encore. I shot 75 to 100 rounds using a Federal 215M which is a large rifle magnum primer laoded into a 6mm Rem. case. I had perfect ignition for everyone of those shots at various temperatures from the 40's to the 70's. The first deer I pulled the trigger on in Oct. 2010 I had a hang fire, temp. was in the 50's.

The deer was close and I hit him in the spine and he went down but required a follow up shot which was also a hang fire.

Cant explain it but that's what happened and the BP sits in my muzzleloader box now and the Encore was sold.

Scott

 

[patocazador]

I don't know how similar the Encore is to the Contender but my Contender did that with centerfire cartridges with smokeless powder .. not always but once it started, it was like every third shot was a misfire. The primer was dented but no BANG. It turned out to be a broken firing pin. I had it replaced and it broke again about a year later. If the 2 broken pieces were in good alignment with the pieces touching one another, it went off. If not = 0.