zero distance

[OneShotScott]

I have the CVA Optima v2 LR. I shoot 4 pellets of triple seven (132gr) with Hornady sst 50 cal 250grain sabot. My zero is 150 yards. It is 2” high at 50 yards and 1” high at 100 yards.

 

[Dougs136Schwartz]

100 yards

 

[GM54-120]

I have the CVA Optima v2 LR. I shoot 4 pellets of triple seven (132gr) with Hornady sst 50 cal 250grain sabot. My zero is 150 yards. It is 2” high at 50 yards and 1” high at 100 yards.

4 pellets?

 

[dbowling]

Dont believe you are supposed to use 4 pellets at least you were not supposed to along time ago, what gr pellets are you using? 33 gr?

 

[GM54-120]

Might be the new Firestars but if its the older pellets that load is not an approved load by CVA or by Hodgdon. 5 Firestars is the same as the old 3 pellet load "they claim" but it weighs more too. More powder by weight is more powder no matter how its shaped.

Old pellets weighed around 30gr each. New are around 24gr in actual weight. Simple math tells me 90gr (3 old pellets) is less than 96gr (4 new pellets) but old pellets varied abit so its close...i guess. Chemically both are the same propellant. Its not some new formula.

 

[52Bore]

100 with every scoped rifle.
No matter how long it’s been (maybe more than a decade) I always know it’s Zero. Reconfirming is going to happen to before hunting.
I can do the math (ballistic chart) from there.

 

[ported45]

I have the CVA Optima v2 LR. I shoot 4 pellets of triple seven (132gr) with Hornady sst 50 cal 250grain sabot. My zero is 150 yards. It is 2” high at 50 yards and 1” high at 100 yards.

777 pellets do not come in weight grains, but in volume equivalency. Options are either 30, 50, or 60 grain loose powder equivalent. If you are using 4 pellets, I hope it is of the 30 grain variety and means you are shooting the equivalent of 120 grains of loose powder.

If you are shooting 4 of the FireStar pellets then you would be shooting the equivalent of 133.3 grains of loose 777 which would still be under the 150 volumetric grain magnum ceiling.

I used to shoot 125 grains by volume of 777 powder and it was plenty hot. 2" high @ 100 yards would put me 3" low @ 200 and 2" high @ 50 as well with the .429" 270 grain Speer GoldDot out of a Black Diamond XR.

 

[GM54-120]

If you are shooting 4 of the FireStar pellets then you would be shooting the equivalent of 133.3 grains of loose 777 which would still be under the 150 volumetric grain magnum ceiling.

I just find it amusing that 4 Firestars weigh more than 3 Triple7 pellets. You are shooting more of the same powder yet they claim 5 Firestars is the equivalent of the old 3 pellet load. This aint rocket science. 5 Firestars would weigh slightly over 120gr in actual weight. That is a huge increase in weight vs the old pellet "mag load".

 

[jlynch75]

I'm using 70 grs of loose 777 by volume and shoot 451 grs by weight bullets and my Whitelighting is right on at 100 yards and 2" high at 50 yards. Seems like way to much powder to me.

 

[mnoland30]

It is all about point blank range for western hunting where a 200 yard shot is not unusual. When I hunt javelina, I sight in at 50 yards, because they are small and usually close. For elk, I sight in at 164 yards (150 meters), because they're big and usually far. With 115 gr 777 behind a 405gr. .458 Remington, I can aim right on out to 200 yards and be 4.4" high at 100, and 5 inches low at 200. I can use the post on my duplex reticle for 225 yards. That works fine for elk, although I've found that high shots kill quicker, so I usually aim a little high on the longer shots.

 

[45-70]

why not use the knobs on the scope

 

[ported45]

I just find it amusing that 4 Firestars weigh more than 3 Triple7 pellets. You are shooting more of the same powder yet they claim 5 Firestars is the equivalent of the old 3 pellet load. This aint rocket science. 5 Firestars would weigh slightly over 120gr in actual weight. That is a huge increase in weight vs the old pellet "mag load".

I have never weighed any pellets, so I can't speak to what the different ones weigh.

I only know that when 777 hit the market, we called Hodgdon and was able to chat with someone there about it. We were told by that person that to duplicate a blackpowder load you would need to use 15% less of 777 powder by volume. Also that a 50 grain equivalent 777 pellet would not weigh the same as 50 volumetric grains of 777 powder. We just took their word and never verified the weight difference. Whoever wanted to buy powder was told to subtract 15% if they wanted to duplicate their load and that 127.5 volumetric grains was what Hodgdon considered max load for a magnum blackpowder rifle. If they wanted pellets, we just told them to treat them like they were the equivalent of 50 volumetric grains of blackpowder for the 50/50 pellets.

I quit working in the gun shop a bit over 10 years ago, so Hodgdon may or may not have changed some of their parameters since then. I only use 777 powder and only in my Renegade these days as I have changed over to using smokeless conversions for the bulk of my muzzleloader hunting.

 

[GM54-120]

2 Triple7 pellets are nearly the same as 100grV of Pyrodex or 2 Pyro pellets in velocity. Roughly 15% reduction when using Triple7 loose powder is correct. 3 Firestars are supposed to equal 2 of the older pellets but its clearly more of the same propellant by weight.

Im just trying to make it more clear about older T7 pellets vs Firestar. You cant replace the 2 or 3 with 3 or 4 and expect similar speeds. Although 4 Firestars would be much closer than 5 to the old 3 pellet "mag load".

 

[TR1Hemi]

2 Triple7 pellets are nearly the same as 100grV of Pyrodex or 2 Pyro pellets in velocity. Roughly 15% reduction when using Triple7 loose powder is correct. 3 Firestars are supposed to equal 2 of the older pellets but its clearly more of the same propellant by weight.

Im just trying to make it more clear about older T7 pellets vs Firestar. You cant replace the 2 or 3 with 3 or 4 and expect similar speeds. Although 4 Firestars would be much closer than 5 to the old 3 pellet "mag load".

Hodgdon web page states the Firestars are 50 cal and 33 gr eq, not sure why your scale shows 24.3. As far as post just stating a # of pellets is not smart, first we can't just assume we are talking 50 cal, second T7 have come in 30,50 and now 60 gr eq to accommodate just about any charge, but to my knowledge Firestars only come in 33gr eq. Clearly your scale shows a FireStar weighing in at 24.3, but the package says 33gr eq. Somebody is gunna get hurt just talking # of pellets. I guess my point is 3 50's or 5 30's, or 2 60's and a 30 =150 gr eq

 

[TR1Hemi]

We start talking 5 pellets are safe, referring to FS's, and some new guy puts 5 50gr T7 pellets in........you see where I am going...

 

[TR1Hemi]

For the Record I measured 2 of my (3 pellets=100gr eq) Firestar pellets and I got 24.3 and 24.7 So due to them being marketed as *gr eq pellets, T7, White Hots, or Firestar pellets are not going to scale the same. To be honest it was the first time I had put a pellet on a scale.

 

[MrTom]

I think the confusion comes from the idea that "gr eq" on the packaging isn't offering anything to compare it to. Is "gr eq" based on loose powder or another pellet of other ilk of identical size? Is the "gr eq" based on volume measure of powder or is it based on actual weight? I'm not a fan of pellets of any brand simply because they confine what the gun might require as far as developing an accurate load since pellets are offered only in "X" size.

 

[ported45]

I think the confusion comes from the idea that "gr eq" on the packaging isn't offering anything to compare it to. Is "gr eq" based on loose powder or another pellet of other ilk of identical size? Is the "gr eq" based on volume measure of powder or is it based on actual weight? I'm not a fan of pellets of any brand simply because they confine what the gun might require as far as developing an accurate load since pellets are offered only in "X" size.

The grain equivalence does offer a comparison, it is always comparing against a volumetic measurement of black powder. 50 grain equivalent pellet = 50 grains of black powder by volume. The FireStars would be = to 33.3 grains of black powder by volume. It does not matter what the pellet weighs. Differing weights of pellets per lot would be no different than different lots of smokeless powder giving different velocities for the same powder weight charge due to chemical makeup variances. Differing weights of pellets in the same lot would just be a QC issue or small enough to be a non-issue possibly.

 

[GM54-120]

Hodgdon has never posted load data exceeding 100gr EQUIVALENT except for 54cal. So called "Mag loads" of Pyrodex or the older Triple7s has always been 100gr by volume max or 2 of the T7 mag pellets.
http://ns.hodgdon.com/PDF/muzzleloading_manual_2008.pdf?CHECKBOX_1=on

They have never approved a 3 Pyrodex or Triple7 pellet load ever. Muzzle loader manufactures took that upon themselves. Oddly, Traditions now states in their new manuals to go by Hodgdons max load data in several new manuals i looked at. Same for Blackhorn load data,...follow Westerns max. 3 Firestars falls between 2 T7 pellets and 2 T7 mag pellets in weight. They are all the exact same powder.

When in doubt always go by the max listed by the company that made the powder and make sure it does not exceed the max of your rifle.

 

[ported45]

Did "magnum" muzzleloaders even exist when 777 was introduced? That would be a very close timeframe. Hodgdon has not strayed from their very first 777 equivalency recommendations.

Hornaday probably didn't help things when they introduced the quick load sabots with the tails that accommodated 3 pellets; they even recommended trimming the tail if using less than 3.

On the other hand, Hodgdon (knowing people were using 3 pellets) never did issue a warning to not go over the 100 grain equivalent in the magnum guns.