.50 Cal Pedersoli Hawken Hunter 1:24 twist vs Rice barrel

[earlyg]

Hello everyone,

I'm new here and I recently purchased a .50 Cal Pedersoli Hawken Hunter 1:24 twist (my first BP rifle, just had BP revolvers before w/RB) and although it's a solid rifle, there are things that I'm not a fan of - no tang, mediocre sights - ghost ring, chambered breech (just found out about this, had some misfires due to fouling), etc.. I'm currently using 460g Bullshop conicals (previously No Excuses) and an over the powder .54 cal wad. Decent accuracy, with the sights being my largest limitation - just ordered a Williams FP 1340 and 17A front globe for longer distances.

I've spent a lot of time reading stuff on this site, it's been a wealth of knowledge and I've found better ideas for sidelock muzzloaders on this site than I have on other sites...ironically. Obviously I have numerous questions (being a newbie and all), so bear with me. For starters, what do ya'll think is better, Pedersoli or Rice barrels? I've got my long range sight options covered, but I've gotten mixed suggestions and reviews for twilight hunting sights, any recommendations? (had a buck at twilight - couldn't see my sights) I am more concerned with functionality over being traditional, not trying to ruffle feathers, just being practical. I will be using this for hunting and long distance target - needed .50 cal for elk restrictions. Also, by cleaning in between shots I have had misfires that I think are caused by fouling in the chambered breech area, initially by not cleaning it (didn't know about it) and maybe by swabbing in between shots and pushing fouling into the antechamber - if that's the right term. Any thoughts? What do you put on the patch when swabbing between shots? What do you use to clean out that area?

I ask about the barrels because I may keep this for a short range hunting setup and then get a longer barrel for Elk hunting, etc. - such as a 32" Rice barrel or Pedersoli Missouri River Hawken.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

Sorry that i dont have first hand experience with Pedersoli or Rice. I've heard good things about both tho. Hawken sights are what they are but I am a big fan of the Williams FP peeps and 17 globes. I have that setup on several guns. For cleaning down into the breech plug chamber i like to use a TC scraper tip. They come in a couple shapes that can be easily filed if they aren't the right fit.

 

[Bad Karma]

I don’t have any Pedersoli barrels but have heard good things about them. The one Rice barrel I have is a thing of beauty (on the inside) and a great shooter. That being said, if I had the pedersoli I believe I would learn to work with it. Probably after swabbing you might try popping a couple caps before loading and then when loading drop your powder and settle it into the breech with a few thumps on the side of the breech.

 

[Offshore]

Tagging in. I'm on the fence about pulling the trigger on a new .45 cal. Rice fast twist.

 

[Bad Karma]

Tagging in. I'm on the fence about pulling the trigger on a new .45 cal. Rice fast twist.

Great barrels from a good guy. It’s hard to go wrong!

 

[Bushfire]

I in no way am being sarcastic or rude but if you look after the barrel properly you won't have misfires. I have 3 pedersoli's, 2 of which have the patent breech you mentioned, I've had one misfire and it was 100% on me.

Make sure you clean it well, and then before use run a dry patch down to get out some of the oil, squirt some isopropyl alcohol in the flash hole bore facing down and then run another dry patch which will pull alcohol through to remove the remainder of the oil. Shouldn't have an issue.
Edit: forgot to mention popping a cap after running your patch can also work.

You can run a 243 or similar brush down into the patent breech to loose the fouling but if you just draw up water and force it out hard through the breech end it does a good enough job.

I wouldn't have taken my hawken hunting dangerous game earlier this year if I had any doubt about it firing when needed. Didn't skip a beat.

I had actually ordered a hunter but changed my order to a Missouri River. Glad I did but I'm confident the hunter would have been a great gun too.

 

[Fyrstyk]

I have several Pedersoli guns and the patent breech is not a problem for me. the biggest problem I see other shooters do is when swabbing between shots the push the fouling down into the patent breech area causeing future mis-fires. The best way to swab is to use an undersized jag. I use a .45 sag in my 50 caliber guns and a .50 jag in my .54 guns. Moisten a cleaning patch with DENATURED alcohol and push the patch down with your undersized jag. There should be very little resistance as the patch rides over the fouling. Then pull the patch out. The fabric will bunch up on the jag and pull out the fouling. The alcohol dries very quickly, so you should be able to load right after swabbing. You can also run another dry patch down after you remove the fouling if you want to be really sure the bore is dry before you load. The basis of the smaller jag is to NOT push the fouling into the patent breech, but to pull it out of the barrel. I have been using this method on my guns for years, and have not had any issues with mis-fires, or hang fires.

 

[earlyg]

I have several Pedersoli guns and the patent breech is not a problem for me. the biggest problem I see other shooters do is when swabbing between shots the push the fouling down into the patent breech area causeing future mis-fires. The best way to swab is to use an undersized jag. I use a .45 sag in my 50 caliber guns and a .50 jag in my .54 guns. Moisten a cleaning patch with DENATURED alcohol and push the patch down with your undersized jag. There should be very little resistance as the patch rides over the fouling. Then pull the patch out. The fabric will bunch up on the jag and pull out the fouling. The alcohol dries very quickly, so you should be able to load right after swabbing. You can also run another dry patch down after you remove the fouling if you want to be really sure the bore is dry before you load. The basis of the smaller jag is to NOT push the fouling into the patent breech, but to pull it out of the barrel. I have been using this method on my guns for years, and have not had any issues with mis-fires, or hang fires.

Makes sense, I’ll definitely give it a shot. Thanks.

Just curious, why denatured alcohol? Is it because it's stronger than Isopropyl alcohol? Also, is grain alcohol acceptable, or is it the added methanol that makes a difference?

 

[eekjellander]

I have several Pedersoli guns and the patent breech is not a problem for me. the biggest problem I see other shooters do is when swabbing between shots the push the fouling down into the patent breech area causeing future mis-fires. The best way to swab is to use an undersized jag. I use a .45 sag in my 50 caliber guns and a .50 jag in my .54 guns. Moisten a cleaning patch with DENATURED alcohol and push the patch down with your undersized jag. There should be very little resistance as the patch rides over the fouling. Then pull the patch out. The fabric will bunch up on the jag and pull out the fouling. The alcohol dries very quickly, so you should be able to load right after swabbing. You can also run another dry patch down after you remove the fouling if you want to be really sure the bore is dry before you load. The basis of the smaller jag is to NOT push the fouling into the patent breech, but to pull it out of the barrel. I have been using this method on my guns for years, and have not had any issues with mis-fires, or hang fires.

Sounds worth tryin but with my luck that is gonna require a patch removal / retrieval tool and some wasted time but I still have time (I hope)/E#d

 

[Fyrstyk]

Makes sense, I’ll definitely give it a shot. Thanks.

Just curious, why denatured alcohol? Is it because it's stronger than Isopropyl alcohol? Also, is grain alcohol acceptable, or is it the added methanol that makes a difference?

I use the denatured alcohol as it does not contain water, whereas Isopropyl alcohol contains only 70% alcohol and the rest is water. Denatured evaporates really fast, so I have little worries about moisture left in the barrel.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

Iso-Heet is 98.5% ethanol and 1.5% proprietary ingredients. It's what ive been using. Although you can buy 91% isopropyl alcohol, instead of the 70%, at drug stores and malwart.

 

[earlyg]

idaholewis - I think I read somewhere that you have a pedersoli hawken hunter and I know you have quite a few rice barrels, what are your thoughts between two?

 

[Idaholewis]

idaholewis - I think I read somewhere that you have a pedersoli hawken hunter and I know you have quite a few rice barrels, what are your thoughts between two?

Both are very good I personally prefer Rice Barrels in TC Stocks. I use to own a Pedersoli Hawken Hunter but i Sold it, I wasn’t crazy about it being a NON Hooked Breech, I prefer the Hooked Breech Setup for Ease of Cleaning

 

[Idaholewis]

The 1:24 Twist is awesome in .50 Cal, I shoot mine all the way out to 1,200 Yards

 

[rfd]

I prefer Rice bbls over Pedersoli, but the Pedi's aren't bad at all and I've used a few to win BPCR matches in their rolling blocks.

As to that damned patent breech, the only sure fire way for ME to address fouling control, let alone final gun cleaning, is to first swab the bore down to the chamber with a proper patched jag, then swap the jag for a brush (I use a 6mm for a .50 and 6.5mm for a .54) that's one turn wrapped with a patch, wetted, and down into the breech flue - this Must be followed by a dry patch(es). Make SURE both the flue and bore are dry before reloading. Patent breech plugs SUCK - they should be outlawed.

 

[earlyg]

Both are very good I personally prefer Rice Barrels in TC Stocks. I use to own a Pedersoli Hawken Hunter but i Sold it, I wasn’t crazy about it being a NON Hooked Breech, I prefer the Hooked Breech Setup for Ease of Cleaning

Thanks, I’ve seen the 1200 yards videos…impressive

 

[earlyg]

I prefer Rice bbls over Pedersoli, but the Pedi's aren't bad at all and I've used a few to win BPCR matches in their rolling blocks.

As to that damned patent breech, the only sure fire way for ME to address fouling control, let alone final gun cleaning, is to first swab the bore down to the chamber with a proper patched jag, then swap the jag for a brush (I use a 6mm for a .50 and 6.5mm for a .54) that's one turn wrapped with a patch, wetted, and down into the breech flue - this Must be followed by a dry patch(es). Make SURE both the flue and bore are dry before reloading. Patent breech plugs SUCK - they should be outlawed.

Thanks for the info, I’ll get me a 6mm for my .50 cal. And I agree on the patent breech.

 

[Idaholewis]

Thanks, I’ve seen the 1200 yards videos…impressive

There is nothing wrong with the Pedersoli Hawken Hunter, They are good Rifles Like i said my only complaint is the NON Hooked Breech, Since i shoot Tang Mounted Peep sights the Last thing i want to do is Loosen, or Remove my Sight to remove my Barrel each time for cleaning, With Hooked Breech TC’s I simply pull the Wedge Key and lift the Barrel out of the Stock, Very simple The Pedersoli on the other Hand Requires the Tang to lift out with the Barrel as it’s attached. A guy could always clean with a Flush Nipple setup, But I personally am not a Fan of Cleaning that way

 

[earlyg]

yes sir, I agree. I hate that I have to remove my sight every time I remove the barrel, it will be even worse when I put my Williams FP sight on it for longer distances. Also, I wish it had a proper tang to attach sights to. Hind sight is 20/20

 

[Idaholewis]

I have no complaints about a Patent Breech, I have been shooting them exclusively from my Beginning in Muzzleloading and They have never caused me any kind of trouble.