Barnes 300 gr Expander MZ

[treepotato]

The Barnes muzzleloader data spec sheet has a footnote on the 300 gr Expander MZ that says:

"*For 300-gr bullets use in guns with 1:16" to 1:26" twists."

I was considering trying these in my new Optima V2, which has a 1:28 twist barrel. Anyone tried these in a 1:28 barrel? Is there a known issue with stabilization? Worth trying, or is it most likely to keyhole?

 

[Steelheader323]

I have shot them from my omega in supplied sabot..no issues..but had better accuracy with the 250 Tez


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[Lee 9]

worked best with heavy loads of BH or 777.+

 

[GM54-120]

Run the numbers based on bullet length. I think you will see a hotter load is better in a 1-28.

Length 1.036
https://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmstab-5.1.cgi

http://kwk.us/twist.html

 

[treepotato]

Re: RE: Re: Barnes 300 gr Expander MZ

Run the numbers based on bullet length. I think you will see a hotter load is better in a 1-28.

Length 1.036
https://www.jbmballistics.com/cgi-bin/jbmstab-5.1.cgi

http://kwk.us/twist.html

Excellent, thanks. It looks like hot loads should provide acceptable stability, especially since I don't plan to shoot beyond about 150 yards (more likely under 75) and as long as velocity stays above about 1200 fps at distance it should stay nose forward.

Looks like it's worth trying. Appreciate the help! Those are handy calculators.

 

[dbowling]

just killed 2 big does tonight with T/C Firehawk .54 and the 325 gr Barnes Expander.

 

[treepotato]

Re: RE: Re: Barnes 300 gr Expander MZ

just killed 2 big does tonight with T/C Firehawk .54 and the 325 gr Barnes Expander.

Nice looking does! Hope the butchering went smoothly today.

 

[MSalyards]

I shoot 300 gr Deep Curls in a CVA Accura 1-28 bbl with a Harvester crush rib sabot and get very good accuracy. 77 gr w of Blackhorn.

 

[treepotato]

Looking for a little sabot advice with these. I bought a 24 pack of the Barnes 300 Expander MZs and they came with smooth black sabots. Those things are extremely tight, so much that I doubt I'd reload in tree stand. After a few shots trying those I switched to using Harvester black crush rib sabots, which go down the barrel pretty easily and possibly too easily as it may only take 5-10 lbs of pressure to push them down. Is there a sabot sizing option between those two?

 

[52Bore]

[QUOTE="treepotato, post: 266887,
I was considering trying these in my new Optima V2, which has a 1:28 twist barrel. Anyone tried these in a 1:28 barrel? Is there a known issue with stabilization? Worth trying, or is it most likely to keyhole?[/QUOTE]

I made and shot a 500gr HP Paper Patch bullet for my 1st in-line (1:28 twist) for the 1st NMLRA in-line match in 2013 or 4 over 85gr Black Powder - MV about 1300 fps. It shot wonderful, even with only a 4x scope as I placed 2nd in the annugural event in terrible conditions out to 330yds.
I like your choice of Big HP heavier bullet - good luck.

 

[ShawnT]

Looking for a little sabot advice with these. I bought a 24 pack of the Barnes 300 Expander MZs and they came with smooth black sabots. Those things are extremely tight, so much that I doubt I'd reload in tree stand. After a few shots trying those I switched to using Harvester black crush rib sabots, which go down the barrel pretty easily and possibly too easily as it may only take 5-10 lbs of pressure to push them down. Is there a sabot sizing option between those two?

The black sabot that came with the Barnes might be an MMP-HPH12. The next down in the MMP line is the MMP-HPH24, in the Harvester line up the next one Up from the crush rib would be the Smooth Short Black. The MMP-HPH24 and the Harvester Smooth Short black are about the same size and work interchangeable for me in my Ultra Lite.

https://www.harvestermuzzleloading....abot-for-451-452-cal-300-grain-or-less-bullet
http://mmpsabots.com/store/black-hph24-sabot/

 

[treepotato]

The black sabot that came with the Barnes might be an MMP-HPH12. The next down in the MMP line is the MMP-HPH24, in the Harvester line up the next one Up from the crush rib would be the Smooth Short Black. The MMP-HPH24 and the Harvester Smooth Short black are about the same size and work interchangeable for me in my Ultra Lite.

https://www.harvestermuzzleloading....abot-for-451-452-cal-300-grain-or-less-bullet
http://mmpsabots.com/store/black-hph24-sabot/

Thanks! Just ordered sone MMP-HPH24 sabots so will see how they load.

 

[Pymahunter1]

The 300 grainexpander mz’s do come with the mmp-hph12 sabots. ShawnT’s advice is spot on.

 

[sabinajiles]

Another option is the red crush rib, which is a few thousands larger than the black crush rib, although I usually use the Harvester short, smooth, black over the red crush rib or MMP HPH-24.

 

[treepotato]

Another option is the red crush rib, which is a few thousands larger than the black crush rib, although I usually use the Harvester short, smooth, black over the red crush rib or MMP HPH-24.

Thanks!

I'll see how the MMP HPH-24's do. If they're still too tight, I'll look into the red crush ribs.

All the help here is much appreciated.

 

[BILLDOGGE]

I've had great luck with them.

 

[Dougs136Schwartz]

I have a Knight Woverine with a tight bore . I use MMP 24 sabots but the shorter sabots with 300 grain Expanders . Less bearing surface while loading. I see no difference in accuracy long sabot vs short sabot but i also am not shooting max loads.

 

[treepotato]

Oddly enough I'm not seeing a noticeable accuracy difference in my gun with these based on powder charge or sabot.

I've only shot one box of 24 bullets, with charges varying from 60-80 gr by weight of BH209, with Federal 209A primers, MMP HPH-12 sabots (too tight), black Harvester crush ribs (too loose), and MMP HPH-24 (seem about right).

3 round groups have varied from 13/16" to 1" at 50 yards, with most at 15/16", with no discernible pattern of change based on either charge or sabot. The 3/16" difference among these groups seems random, so that is probably as much me as the gun and loads.

Will probably try an 84 gr group next, but if it's not tighter I'll probably just go with a 70 gr load and call it good enough for minute of deer out to 125 yards.