Blackhorn Corrosion /Pitting?

[Panhandle]

I shot out a load of Blackhorn this morning that had been loaded for 3 weeks. It hadn't been in the rain or snow and fired without a problem. The problem surfaced when I went to clean my Triumph this evening. Where the powder load was in contact with the barrel there was the beginning of pitting. I worked on getting it out for a hour....Hoppes, Butches Bore Shine, Alcohol, Windshield Cleaner, Swabs, Brass Brush and still couldn't get it all out. I left it soaking in WD-40 for the night. I think I'll treat Blackhorn just like I would treat 777 in the future. They say it's non corrosive but it's a far cry from smokeless as to being clean. Some have likened it to IMR4759 in the way it looks but that is as far as it goes. It definately smells different and is much dirtier. It's still the best out there and I'm going to continue to use it but I'll cleaning up every night from now on. I haven't heard of this happening or experienced it myself. I've left it loaded for a couple of days but not this long.
Zen

 

[cayuga]

After shooting BlackHorn I never let it sit long enough in my rifle to do any damage, but I even thought when cleaning it out.. there was a black residue on the solvent patches and that had to have some corrosive capabilities to metal somewhere down the line. No matter what they say. So I agree, if you shoot it, then clean it.

 

[jsteurrys]

Look what it does to brass. I agree it is the best powder available today. It is much more user friendly than Triple 7. I only left mine dirty for a week at the most and did not see any problems in a SS barrel.

 

[Busta]

Panhandle,

You didn't mention, was your bore fouled before loading and leaving for three weeks? Or, was that powder loaded into a clean bore? Is your Triumph blued or does it have that coating (Weathershield? or whatever its called) on it. I am sure the bores are still just blued steel anyways.

Were you taking your rifle in and out of the house everyday? Just trying to figure what panhandle you are from for a location/climate, Florida, Texas, Oklahoma? What temperature extremes was your rifle subjected to?

I have shot my SS Disc Ext, reloaded and left it loaded for 10 days to 2 weeks before firing and cleaning without any problems.

We all have to remember, this year is a learning year, we all can learn from others reports. What I would really like to know most is whether your bore was fouled or clean before leaving that load in for three weeks?

Thanks

 

[tndeer]

I first shot my Knight Disc Elite SS 50 around the first of November. I did not clean it until yesterday. I see no problems of rust or pitting in the barrel. The gun was taken in and out of my house. I hunted in rain, sleet, and a little snow. Temps were from 60 down to around 15 degrees. As far as I can tell, BH 209 behaves as advertised. My only complaint is cleaning the crud out of the receiver area . It takes some strong scrubbing with a brass brush to get the carbon off. Going to CCI mag primers solved my hangfires so far, but I may get more carbon deposits. Time will tell. I'm planning on using BH next year. Bought 2 more bottles when I ordered my primers, tried to stretch the Hazmat fee as far as I could. Hunted in TN, KY, and IL.

 

[paia]

I am curious about the details of Panhandle's problem also.

Late last May I fired about twenty rounds with Blackhorn209 out of my stainless Omega and left it unloaded and uncleaned in my basement for four weeks and it cleaned up fine and I had no signs of corrosion or pitting. But, like I said, my rifle was unloaded and in my basement (about 70 degrees) the whole time.

I also had no trouble with a dirty and loaded Omega and BH209 while hunting in the midwest for about two weeks in Nov/Dec.

I have a lot of confidence in BH209 and consider it very much "non-corrosive," but that is just me. I'd like to hear more details of other people's experience.

 

[hjbuys]

I had some areas that were hard to clean near the breech plug, but no pitting. My buddy had some pitting in his bore this year, but used 777 last year although he was meticulous about cleaning it out. I'm not convinced BH209 is safe to leave in the barrel for long and will be treating it like any other powder as far as my gun care is concerned.

 

[Panhandle]

To answer a few questions...
Dec 3 I shot a fouler in my Triumph and then loaded it. That evening my buddy wanted to shoot it so he shot it out. It was then loaded and brought home without shooting it and left in my cool basement until yesterday when I shot it so I could clean it. It was hunted with for one day [no rain or snow] and then stored until yesterday.
It's a blued barrel. I just bought the rifle this year and haven't shot anything out of it except Blackhorn. The barrel ahead of the sabot was not affected, just where the powder made contact in the first two inches of the chamber. I've left it uncleaned after firing and never had any problems.When I scrubbed it last night some of it came out, but not all. Going to give it another going over tonight.
Thanks guys, Zen

 

[toytruck]

A good rule of thumb here is once you shoot it you clean it, especially with muzzleloading guns. I also go by this for my centerfire guns and they are shiney,rust free like all my guns, blue or stainless.

 

[frontier gander]

the point of bh209 was that you didnt have to swab between shots, could leave it fouled for a long time without any corrosion problems.

I dont spend the $$ on the powder, i stick with what i know will fire off reliably and know that at the end of the day, or a couple days later, that i need to give the barrel a hot soapy bath.

Sorry to hear about your barrel, Hopefully you can get it all cleaned up and accuracy wont be hurt any. Always take good care of your investments and never give your full trust in what they say a product can or cant do!

 

[toytruck]

:? even smokeless powder will cause corrosion when not properly cleaned out after shooting, why take the chance?

 

[Redeye171]

I shoot bh209 out of my TC Triumph and have not experienced any problems like those mentioned above.

I do not foul the barrel before loading for hunting use. I go hunting and shoot out of a clean barrel every time.

Here is what I do know. One day after removing unused powder(209) from my gun (after a 4 day hunt not firing the gun) I put the 209 powder in a container and soaked it with water. It did not dissolve in the water after a few hours! I then removed the powder from the water and set it aside. After a few more minutes after it looked dry I just had to try something. I took a match to a few granules of that water soaked powder and it went off! After SOAKING in WATER for hours the powder still burned! To me this speaks volumes. It won't soak up water and if it won't do that I doubt that it will have the same corrosive affects other powders do.

I just have to believe that by firing a fouling round and then reloading it and leaving all that bad stuff from the primer in the barrel just might have more bad side affects than some might think.

Just my 2 cents.

Redeye

 

[smong2000]

Boy, you guys scared me into cleaning my stainless Omega yesterday. I shot it Sept 26th about 5 times and left it fouled. Loaded it 1st week of November, carried in rain and snow for >1 week in NH, then left it loaded until Dec 3 ish. It went bang and hit dead on at 100yds. I reloaded and hunted until Dec 11 in all kinds of weather and shot doe at 87 yds, bang/flop and reloaded in the field. It's been loaded in the safe ever since. I tape the barrel immediately after loading and always keep a spent primer on it when storing.

Pulled the plug and dumped out the powder, it was packed really tight and had to scrape the walls with a stick. The sabot was really stuck hard and i had to tap the rod to break it free (from muzzle to breech). Looked like I was going to hve a problem where the powder sat all that time. Filled the bore with Hoppe' Elite foam and left it for half hour. Two swabs and it was clean and shiney, no pitting or problems whatsoever. The breech face was really crudded up because i never took it off and cleaned it in maybe 200 shots of BH209 and I worked on it for 15 mins until it came clean.

After all my mistreatment I have to conclude that it was non-corrosive -at least for me . Note that the bore was ALWAYS sealed with tape, sabot and a primer with seconds of shooting

 

[Doohan]

I just cleaned my Encore today.. It has been uncleaned except for a few patches since our hog hunt.. I do keep my guns in a sealed, humidity controlled gun safe. ..

Dont ask me why.. .. I guess I just had to know!

Anyhow, my gun cleaned up exceptionally well. I have shot maybe 1/2 a jug through this gun. I have noted however that I do have some hard, black deposits on my breech plug... same thing happened with my omega. A tad of pitting on the face of the plugs seems to be the norm. Other than that, I have no real issues with BH209.

In short, I recommend regular cleaning intervals and breech plug maint. I am thankful for BH209 as it extends my enjoyment of all of my hunting seasons and range sessions as I can clean my guns when I want. I will treat BH209 as a much less corrosive propellant and one I readilly promote.

 

[old/new]

I too have no issues with B209 in my PH. The first time I shot the gun at the range (have only used B209) I noticed a bit of build up on the plug. Wiped it off, put it back and kept shooting.

Now I pull the plug after about 15 shots or so, clean it and re-install it. Takes about 90 secs.

I have always cleaned the gun within 3 days of shooting it at the most and have had no pitting, etc. Never tried any long period of leaving it uncleaned or loaded.

 

[huntinhard]

I just helped my buddy clean his ss omega at work and pitting was starting on the breech plug and in the first inch of the bore on the breech end. It had been shot three days earlier and had been shot four times woth B209 over a 3 week period without cleaning.

Triple 7 had been used the previous two years without any corrosion problems with the same amount of time left uncleaned.


I never clean my ss encore until the end of muzzleloader season. I take it in and out of the house and always used triple 7 pellets and never had any corrosion. I too tried the BH 209 this year and will be cleaning it tonight to see if there is any corrosion, but from what I saw on my buddys gun I am worried.

 

[lane]

To answer a few questions...
Dec 3 I shot a fouler in my Triumph and then loaded it. That evening my buddy wanted to shoot it so he shot it out. It was then loaded and brought home without shooting it and left in my cool basement until yesterday when I shot it so I could clean it. It was hunted with for one day [no rain or snow] and then stored until yesterday.
It's a blued barrel. I just bought the rifle this year and haven't shot anything out of it except Blackhorn. The barrel ahead of the sabot was not affected, just where the powder made contact in the first two inches of the chamber. I've left it uncleaned after firing and never had any problems.When I scrubbed it last night some of it came out, but not all. Going to give it another going over tonight.
Thanks guys, Zen

Well Bro, I've had my SS 45cal Disc Elite fouled, loaded and fired 3 times, and now it's loaded again, since the 6th of November :shock: Been keeping it in a cold garage-in a gun case, all this time. Got some more time-off next week, so will take her out for that Buck Will definitely clean it after the next hunt, and report back. Thanks for the heads-up

 

[frontier gander]

maybe its just an issue with TC barrels?

 

[huntinhard]

I just cleaned my 50 cal Encore tonight after reporting my buddy had corrosion and pitting with his Omega. My encore was perfectly fine, no pitting present and I hadn't cleaned it since mid October and had shot it probably 10 times bringing it indoors after each hunt most of the time and had reloaded outdoors in snowy conditions.

I have no idea what happened with his Omega since we both hunted in similar conditions and left our guns loaded and never cleaned until season was complete. I have no signs of corrosion and he does.

We both love how the powder worked and had acceptable accuracy (1.25 inch groups at 100 yards) at the full 120 grains so we wish to continue using this powder. hope we can figure out what happened to his.

 

[BIGT]

Sounds like operator error. ANY gun will rust if moisture is present !
If the the ML was left loaded with pyro or black, it would be scrap iron.

fg, if it isn't cva or power belt$, it ain't $hit to you, is it ?

Try this after pyro cleaning: wait a few days to a few weeks and then swab with a quality bore solvent (shooters choice) and see what you get.