Encore or R.E.M. 700

[Oli]

getting ready to pull the trigger on one of these, if anybody has any info that would sway me one way or the other I would like to hear from you. I had an encore 50 cal and really liked it but made the mistake of leaving it in my truck after a 2 mile Pack out and getting home at midnight! Woke up and gun and backpack were gone!! My mistake. And I live in a nice neighborhood on 2 1/2 acres or so I thought! Looking forward to any input, but no lectures please.
Thanks
Rick

 

[ENCORE50A]

By R.E.M. 700, do you mean the Remington Ultimate Muzzleloader (RUM)?

 

[Oli]

Yes

 

[Oli]

I'm actually interested in any inline under $1,000

 

[sabinajiles]

I'm actually interested in any inline under $1,000

That doesn't narrow things down much. Even the higher end Knights and the new CVA Paramount can be found for under $1000.

 

[ENCORE50A]

Having had both Encore platform and a UF rifles, I can provide my experiences...

If you intend to pack in miles and back out then weight might be a consideration. The RUM will be heavier and a quality scope will make it heavier than an Encore with a quality scope.
Both rifles have their quirks for some owners. Both, IMO, need some modifications.

Encores: I always modified the frames with trigger spring changes, firing pin springs, hammer springs, locking lug springs and hinge pins. It is not costly if you do the modifications yourself. You'll need the ability to work with small parts in confined space. They can be extremely accurate rifles to 200yds, even some beyond. They are "ready made" to shoot BH209, with no modifications required to breech plugs. The last Pro Hunter 209x50 I had, I wish I'd have never sold.

Remington Ultimate: Its a beast and heavy, which helps greatly when shooting maximum charges. Being built using the Remington 700 action, all Rem. 700 aftermarket triggers and parts interchange. It was designed to be capable of much heavier charges than production muzzleloaders. With maximum charges, I highly recommend the addition of a muzzle brake. The RUM is basically the little brother of the Ultimate Firearms Inc., BP Xpress. Both use a primed cartridge, which you just drop in the action and close the bolt. Its that easy to prime the rifle. However, the RUM's major drawback is consistent head spacing with PP primer carriers. The OEM breech plug IS NOT designed for utilizing BH209 and in fact, if you use BH209 in the rifle, Remington will not warrant the breech plug.
Arrowhead Sporting Goods (AGS) designed a replacement breech plug that entirely fixes ALL breech plug issues with the RUM. IMO, the AGS Gen2 breech plug is a necessary modification for a trouble free rifle. They can be very accurate LONG RANGE rifles. With the heavier charges its capable of, shooting bullet for bullet, no production muzzleloader can match its bullet energy at long range.

Good luck with your decision.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

I'm biased but take a good look at cva v2 Accura's and any Knight rifle.

 

[WPrather]

I’m personally biased toward the Prohunter myself. The only advantage I see to the Rem 700 is if long range shots are your goal. As far as packing way back in the woods or hunting from a treestand the Prohunter wins every time. If your hunting 200yds and under I would go with the Prohunter. If you are hunting 200yds plus I would go with the rem 700. My thumbhole stocked Prohunter shoulders and feels better than any gun I own. I don’t even get my bolt actions out of the gun cabinet during rifle season anymore.

 

[Oli]

I hunt both mule deer and elk w a muzzleloader, half day hunts on foot is the norm, getting too old for pack ins and all day hikes. The extra distance would be nice for both animals as I hunt wide open places for muledeer. Picked up a Steiner 3x15x50 which isn't light, I really liked my encore but this will be my last muzzleloader and the knock down and distance w the RUM is impressive.

 

[ENCORE50A]

I hunt both mule deer and elk w a muzzleloader, half day hunts on foot is the norm, getting too old for pack ins and all day hikes. The extra distance would be nice for both animals as I hunt wide open places for muledeer. Picked up a Steiner 3x15x50 which isn't light, I really liked my encore but this will be my last muzzleloader and the knock down and distance w the RUM is impressive.

If you decide on the RUM, i highly suggest the AGS Gen2 breech plug right off the bat. Luke is a member here and will set you up. Also a muzzle brake, which I'd suggest the LR Customs T-Rex. Then get ready to send 300gr bullets at 2,400fps and to long range.

 

[sabotloader]

I'm actually interested in any inline under $1,000

One of these - either Nitride like this one or a Stainless

Knight Ultra lite - check this wed site. Scroll down to the Ultra lite

https://www.muzzle-loaders.com/rifles/inline-muzzleloaders.html?shopbybrand_brand=4

 

[Oli]

Sabotloader, that's a nice rifle only 1 review. I'm going to have to research it a little more. Do you have one? I have a knight mk85. Nice gun but uses the old caps, I bought the conversion to be able to use 209's but it was a cluster trying to load them w tool provived and haven't used it in years. It's a backup.

 

[Oli]

Encore50a, what does the breech swap cost? And when you say muzzlebreak, how would that upgrade come to fruition? I doubt it screws on to the end. Lol Thanks for the info and advise from all who have contributed.

 

[52Bore]

Between the 2 of your post - the Encore.
The pro-hunter stock does work reducing recoil. Too bad they only make it in a 50 as I’m a 45 guy.

 

[sabotloader]

Sabotloader, that's a nice rifle only 1 review. I'm going to have to research it a little more. Do you have one? I have a knight mk85. Nice gun but uses the old caps, I bought the conversion to be able to use 209's but it was a cluster trying to load them w tool provived and haven't used it in years. It's a backup.

Yes, I do have one actually two of them...

In Idaho during ML season we have to use open sights and cap ignition so I have a ULite setup for ML season

And the one in the post that I use during regular rifle season...

Almost any ML you buy today is accurate so you can count on this rifle for accuracy - but other things I really it is a 6.5 pound rifle and it is placed in a lightweight Kevlar stock. Comes with fully adjustable Timney trigger.

In the stock is a full block of aluminum is molded into the stock to provide a non moving solid bed bedding

And the rifle flat shoots even with open sights... These are birds set out at 100 yards

This is a target from the Scoped rifle shown in the post above..

This is another shoot with the scoped rifle

Again, I would say that accuracy is good from almost any rifle - but for myself the Ulite has really been THE rifle.

 

[Lee 9]

52 bore, Bergara make a decent 45 barrel for the encore and there are several people that do custom 45 in what ever twist you like. Mine likes 140 gr. of BH and is close to 2400 with that load I do NOT recommend that load for factory made guns.
Every once in a while I see this implication that Encores are 200 yard guns I really do not understand why somebody is saying that mine both do just fine well beyond that distance.

 

[SuperKirby]

I would recommend the Encore. I’m on my 3rd one. I keep selling them thinking I’d like a bolt gun better. And I keep coming back to the Encore. I don’t see getting rid of this one for awhile. It started as a Pro Hunter. I replaced all the springs inside, added a stock and one of the Brux 1-20 twist barrels from the aforementioned Luke at ASG (great guy to deal with).

 

[WPrather]

If you want the Prohunter in 45cal. You can get the stock & frame combo for about $400. Then Haus of Arms has 1/20 twist 45cal MGM custom 26in barrels for $480. The MGM barrels from Haus of Arms arm black powder only barrels. But they don’t charge shipping so it’s actually cheaper to get it from them than MGM.

I have been trying to talk myself into one of the smokeless 45cal Brux barrels. But they are really proud of them. Lol

 

[ENCORE50A]

Encore50a, what does the breech swap cost? And when you say muzzlebreak, how would that upgrade come to fruition? I doubt it screws on to the end. Lol Thanks for the info and advise from all who have contributed.

The AGS Gen2 system: http://arrowheadsporting.com/asggen2_uml.html

Talking .50cal rifles...….

I highly recommend you contact Luke at ASG and discuss it with him about both the breech plug and a possible muzzle brake, IF you consider purchasing a RUM.
ALL and I mean ALL, of the problems that other muzzleloaders have with breech plug issues becomes non existent with the AGS breech plug. IIRC, Luke guarantees these breech plugs for life. You will not find that in ANY other muzzleloader breech plug to my knowledge. As I first mentioned, my last Pro Hunter I wish I'd have never sold, but, I went through breech plugs pretty fast with the amount of shooting I was doing, wearing out flash holes. The AGS breech plug system is extremely strong and is rated for pressures higher than production rifle breech plugs. Its an excellent system. Did I mention that it was guaranteed??? No leaking primers, no gas cut breech plugs, no "O" rings, problems resolved.

The muzzle brakes actually do screw on to the end of the barrel, and you should get a thread protector, which when you remove the brake you screw that on to protect the threads on the barrel for cleaning or, if you want or are required to shoot without a brake. BELIEVE ME... if you shoot a 300gr bullet at 2,400fps, you'll appreciate a brake! Luke will do it all if you so desire.

Don't get me wrong, I really like the Encore platform rifles, but they have their limits for what I personally want. I have owned a number of them in the past and they were all excellent 200yd rifles. However they did not get me the extended range and energy I felt I needed. I hunt mostly from box blinds, or from a pop up parked in a hedge row over looking ag fields. So weight isn't an issue for my style hunting. If I were to stalk and or hunt the mountains, I'd either have to get in much better physical shape, or I'd have to buy a lighter rifle.

Take your time making a decision. Go handle a few of the rifles you may consider. There always seems to be some kind of "trade off" and always the "Chevy vs Ford". I know as I've gotten older, my hunting methods have changed considerably, which have changed my thoughts about what type of rifle I plan on finishing up with. Good luck with your decision.

 

[Dougs136Schwartz]

This is a very interesting thread. There are very good arguments on both sides . I very much like both guns . Obvious advantage to the Encore is weight and swich barrel capability. Remington may gain you some distance. Just personal preference.

Myself i would rather have a .45 . It would seem a fast twist .45 (1-20) Knight Ultralight would fit you needs very well. Kind of best of both worlds Or buy a .45 cal barrel for your Encore ?