Sabots?

[bronko220002]

Do any of you use saboted bullets in your SML?
I'm just wondering about the heat from the smokeless powder wrecking havoc with the base of the sabot.

 

[ElDiablo]

Yes a bunch of us do….

 

[bronko220002]

Yes a bunch of us do….

So I'm assuming you're using 40 cal bullets in the .45s! Which ones.

 

[10acres]

Barnes Expander MZ 195g 40 cal in a HLBS.

 

[MrTom]

I shoot 200 grain XTPs at the club, 195 grain Barnes Expanders and 225 grain Fury star Tips in the field, all with a 56 grain charge of IMR4198 in light blue Harvester sabots. Winchester 209 shotshell primers.

 

[ElDiablo]

So I'm assuming you're using 40 cal bullets in the .45s! Which ones.

Yes, and .45 in .50 cal sabots. All kinds…

 

[ElDiablo]

In .40 I’ve shot the 195 gr Barnes, 200 gr XTP, 200 SST, 200 Swift AFrame, 225 Fury, 240 OT Fury, 240 CE Maximus

 

[LBAhunter]

I've shot in my CVA Scout 45-70 conversion saboted 40 cal. 155gr to 225gr. loads Right now, I'm shooting Fury 40 cal. 200gr. with N110.

 

[Hatchet Jack]

In a nutshell.....When I first got my smokeless Encore I tried .40 cal bullets with sabots. Not a good experience for me. (I realize other guys experiences may have differed from mine) I always had to wait for barrel to cool down between shots due to sabots melting in the bore and blowing out. Was not able to shoot heavier charges as well due to blowouts.
Eventually I bought a sizing die, put a dry wool wad between the powder and bullet and never looked back. Smooth forming was the best thing I ever tried. My smokeless Encore shoots one hole groups all day long with lots of different bullets I have experimented with. Whether they be copper jacketed or solid copper.
I size my bullets to barely fit the barrel. I then slightly knurl the bullets between 2 files to give a little resistance going down the bore.
Don't want to rub anyone the wrong way but... I think smokeless rifles are made for speed and power. Not for plastic sabots.

 

[jims]

I have quite a few smokeless muzzleloaders. I have full formed, smooth formed and used sabots. It is just so much easier for me to use sabots and I still get quite good accuracy so that is what I generally do.

 

[someguy2800]

I've shot in my CVA Scout 45-70 conversion saboted 40 cal. 155gr to 225gr. loads Right now, I'm shooting Fury 40 cal. 200gr. with N110.

Mind sharing the powder load? I'll probably start with N110 because I have 8 lbs of it.

 

[LBAhunter]

Mind sharing the powder load? I'll probably start with N110 because I have 8 lbs of it.

My Scout conversion is setup to shoot sabot loads. I usually shoot from 28 to 38gr. of N110, depending on the bullet.
28gr of N110, HLBS, Eastern Maine wool wad (don't need but i use anyway) Fury 40cal 200gr is comparable to my Encore 357 Max recoil wise.

 

[BuckDoeHunter]

My daughter's 45 cal. Pac-nor barrel favors Reloder 7 with Harvester sabots. Very good accuracy, speed, and sabot friendly.

 

[DannoBoone]

Hot loads may not only wreck the base of the sabot but also create a build up of plastic
residue in the bore, which ruins accuracy. Milder loads aren't too bad, but still the
barrel gets hot if shot repeatedly without a time out to cool down. Years ago, several
of us (on Doug's) build cooling rods to get the barrels to cool down faster.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

Hot loads may not only wreck the base of the sabot but also create a build up of plastic
residue in the bore, which ruins accuracy. Milder loads aren't too bad, but still the
barrel gets hot if shot repeatedly without a time out to cool down. Years ago, several
of us (on Doug's) build cooling rods to get the barrels to cool down faster.

How do you build a cooling rod? For us DIYers, that sounds like a nice little project.

 

[The long rider]

How do you build a cooling rod? For us DIYers, that sounds like a nice little project.

buy a 7/16" aluminum or brass rod a few inches longer than your bbl. and then get a long section of 4" plastic pipe and caps drill a hole in one end of one cap large enough to slide the rod into it. You could glue the bottom cap on the pipe , but leave the top cap with the hole in it so you can fill with ice.
Once you have it all set up filled with ice and the rod running through the center of it the aluminum will get very cold. After shooting a couple of very high pressure loads and the bbl. gets hot you can pull the rod out of the ice wipe the moisture and gently push down the bore.
It only takes a minute or two for the rod to cool off the inside of the bbl. You will also notice the rod is warmer as well. This system does work pretty well when you are shooting top end loads with sabots in high heat conditions. After lugging all the extra stuff to the range I found it not worth the effort.
If you are blowing sabots it's because your load is generating higher pressure than the sabot can handle. The sabot can handle around 37.000 psi before it starts to let go. It will come out like spaghetti strings when it blows.
I stopped using the cooling rod and just started adding a wool wad under the sabot and never blew another sabot, even shooting just over 3,000 fps using 66 grains of VV-N120 with the Barnes 195 gr. or the Hornady 200 gr. SST bullets. I also shot 73 grains of Reloader #7 with the same bullets without the wool wad.
A kick ass sabot load now is the Pittman 228 .402 bullet using the harvester sabot with 72 grs. of Reloader #7 for 2675fps. This bullet/load combo will put a deer down.

 

[DannoBoone]

Thanks, Long Rider. I couldn't have said it any better.

 

[LBAhunter]

Do any of you use saboted bullets in your SML?
I'm just wondering about the heat from the smokeless powder wrecking havoc with the base of the sabot.

As you can tell from my earlier post, the loads I shoot are mild loads. I can usually shoot 3 shots and just wait a short amount of time.(If I'm on the lower end, 28 - 30gr, the wait is shorter and vice-versa) I usually have other guns along to pass the time between shots. I sometimes shoot some sabotless loads to "clean" the bore. I don't know if that helps "clean" the bore.

 

[BuffaloSoldier]

The last time I saw a sabot shoot was from a Sheridan at Ft. Carson back in the 70s out of a +150mm tank gun. It was impressive, especially at night!!

 

[bronko220002]

My Scout conversion is setup to shoot sabot loads. I usually shoot from 28 to 38gr. of N110, depending on the bullet.
28gr of N110, HLBS, Eastern Maine wool wad (don't need but i use anyway) Fury 40cal 200gr is comparable to my Encore 357 Max recoil wise.

I'm getting mixed information here. I thought you have to fill the void between the BP/chamber area or the Scout 45-70 conversion. It seems that 28 grs will not do that or am I missing something?