What is in the days ahead

[JonE]

If the anti lead environmental groups get their way.... bills like this one in California could ruin muzzleloading with patched round balls made of lead. I'm thankful this hasn't hit where I live, but I can see it happening down the road.

California’s AB 3071 Lead Ammo Bill Risks Public Safety and Environmental Damage
https://www.americas1stfreedom.org/articles/2020/3/14/california-s-ab-3071-lead-ammo-bill-risks-public-safety-and-environmental-damage/?fbclid=IwAR0H0pJ0_FiNvTPNMhT6rolYELJMnBrdz7jVXwXLLSbya0K9v6WcRVog2tc

 

[Hanshi]

It's ridiculous and counterproductive. Just me, but what they are not aware of won't hurt them anyway.

 

[bobbythehunter]

lead was an issue in massachusetts a number of years ago. the massachusetts department of environmental protection started by working with gun ranges to contain and presumably recover lead shot at ranges. the state (fish and wildlife) has since gone on to ban lead fishing sinkers and lures up to a certain size. i think it was loons that drove the fishing tackle ban in massachusetts and other new england states. In california i think it might have been condors that triggered the ammunition ban in califirnia. from what the experts say lead is incredibly toxic to wildlife and humans (children especially). yeah it would be a bummer for anyone who has large amounts of ammunition. hey maybe that's the plan !

 

[muzzleloader48]

lead was an issue in massachusetts a number of years ago. the massachusetts department of environmental protection started by working with gun ranges to contain and presumably recover lead shot at ranges. the state (fish and wildlife) has since gone on to ban lead fishing sinkers and lures up to a certain size. i think it was loons that drove the fishing tackle ban in massachusetts and other new england states. In california i think it might have been condors that triggered the ammunition ban in califirnia. from what the experts say lead is incredibly toxic to wildlife and humans (children especially). yeah it would be a bummer for anyone who has large amounts of ammunition. hey maybe that's the plan !

Most of us baby boomers and our parents grew up with lead paint, lead on our cribs and God knows where else and we're doing just fine and living in to the 80's, 90's and even 100's. I'm more than happy to giv'em back the lead

 

[Hylander]

The lead ban here in California has zero to do with wild life, No Condor in history has ever died from consuming
a lead bullet.
It is nothing more than another attempt to take away our 2nd amendment and disarm law abiding Americans. It is just one more step to making us subordinates.
If this passes it will be the end of shooting ranges and small gun stores in the state and that is what their goal is.

The average person can not afford to buy lead free ammo for range practice, not to mention that there are dozens of calibers that there is no lead free ammo made for them.
Muzzle Loading with round ball in California will be gone, the only lead free round balls made that I know of are
not round and they cost $1.00 a ball, no one I know can afford that and even if they could there will be no range to shoot at.
All shooting sports in the state of California would cease to exist.
And don't think for a minute that this will stop with California, it will spread to every other state like cancer.
Please think about this whenever you vote and the company's you support.
.

 

[exMember]

Eventually something will come out for a new patched round ball. Just not a market for them right now due to the limited users in the field actually hunting with them.

 

[muzzleloader48]

The lead ban here in California has zero to do with wild life, No Condor in history has ever died from consuming
a lead bullet.
It is nothing more than another attempt to take away our 2nd amendment and disarm law abiding Americans. It is just one more step to making us subordinates.
If this passes it will be the end of shooting ranges and small gun stores in the state and that is what their goal is.

The average person can not afford to buy lead free ammo for range practice, not to mention that there are dozens of calibers that there is no lead free ammo made for them.
Muzzle Loading with round ball in California will be gone, the only lead free round balls made that I know of are
not round and they cost $1.00 a ball, no one I know can afford that and even if they could there will be no range to shoot at.
All shooting sports in the state of California would cease to exist.
And don't think for a minute that this will stop with California, it will spread to every other state like cancer.
Please think about this whenever you vote and the company's you support.
.

What a shame. You can't use lead balls for hunting, but you can crap on the sidewalk. Tyranny.

 

[Hanshi]

Hylander brings up a good point; lead bans have nothing to do with with the health and safety of wildlife or people. If that were the case then the Civil War would have wiped out every living thing here. And that's not even including the Rev War & the 1812 misunderstanding. Then, of course, there were centuries of colonial/French/Indian wars and massive civilian use of lead ball ammo. There are simply too many people happy to give up liberty and freedom for nothing in return. So sad.

 

[Marty1]

lead was an issue in massachusetts a number of years ago. the massachusetts department of environmental protection started by working with gun ranges to contain and presumably recover lead shot at ranges. the state (fish and wildlife) has since gone on to ban lead fishing sinkers and lures up to a certain size. i think it was loons that drove the fishing tackle ban in massachusetts and other new england states. In california i think it might have been condors that triggered the ammunition ban in califirnia. from what the experts say lead is incredibly toxic to wildlife and humans (children especially). yeah it would be a bummer for anyone who has large amounts of ammunition. hey maybe that's the plan !

Unfortunately the element (Pb) lead has been clearly shown to be highly toxic to our natural environment...particularly with respect to potable drinking water. Massachusetts made great effort and success in working with gun ranges to keep their spent lead shot out of wetlands.

 

[Marty1]

Eventually something will come out for a new patched round ball. Just not a market for them right now due to the limited users in the field actually hunting with them.

Pure lead has VERY unique properties which make it uniquely ideal for traditional sidelock muzzleloaders. Lead projectile prohibitions may force some traditional lead RB hunters to go to a bigger bore just to get an adequate weight bullet. In .54 caliber, a lead RB may weight 230 grains, where a non-lead RB may be as little as 190 grains.

 

[Hylander]

The local range here has been an official range since 1929
They cleaned out the lead a few years ago.
City came in and had the land and water tested, no abnormal lead levels found.
We shoot cast matches 9 months a year.
So all the health concerns are pure BS.

 

[muzzleloader48]

Hylander brings up a good point; lead bans have nothing to do with with the health and safety of wildlife or people. If that were the case then the Civil War would have wiped out every living thing here. And that's not even including the Rev War & the 1812 misunderstanding. Then, of course, there were centuries of colonial/French/Indian wars and massive civilian use of lead ball ammo. There are simply too many people happy to give up liberty and freedom for nothing in return. So sad.

That is an excellent point Hanshi. It's all about control.

 

[Philgumbo]

AT least for now, we can use lead in Maine....

 

[Squint]

AT least for now, we can use lead in Maine....

I had the same opinion about Montana until the federal government banned all lead from federal sites like the CMR in the middle of Montana. This place is surrounded by BLM land, so I'm waiting for the other shoe to fall.
Squint

 

[muzzleloader48]

Hylander brings up a good point; lead bans have nothing to do with with the health and safety of wildlife or people. If that were the case then the Civil War would have wiped out every living thing here. And that's not even including the Rev War & the 1812 misunderstanding. Then, of course, there were centuries of colonial/French/Indian wars and massive civilian use of lead ball ammo. There are simply too many people happy to give up liberty and freedom for nothing in return. So sad.

Hanshi, how true you tell it. Some of our founding fathers said it right: "those who would give up their freedom for a little security, deserve neither and get neither". I was a deputy for 2 different counties in Colorado and we always had the attitude that by the time we get there, you could be robbed, raped or murdered. Protect you and your loved ones first.

 

[Sonny Rich]

It's ridiculous and counterproductive. Just me, but what they are not aware of won't hurt them anyway.

YET!!!!!

 

[Sonny Rich]

Eventually something will come out for a new patched round ball. Just not a market for them right now due to the limited users in the field actually hunting with them.

Lead is soft,soft is good.! what would replace that!

 

[Philgumbo]

Hanshi, how true you tell it. Some of our founding fathers said it right: "those who would give up their freedom for a little security, deserve neither and get neither". I was a deputy for 2 different counties in Colorado and we always had the attitude that by the time we get there, you could be robbed, raped or murdered. Protect you and your loved ones first.

I have read that the type of lead used in ammunition and firearms is not easily soluble in water.......I seriously doubt that any eagles that they have been finding with lead poisoning in them got the lead from bullets. They probably had it build up in their systems via the fish they eat.

 

[JonE]

There is a new product available but expensive and looks like it's made of tin, just guessing though.

non-toxic roundball (12 balls)

But I agree with thought from Squint living here in Montana...

 

[Fyrstyk]

I have read that the type of lead used in ammunition and firearms is not easily soluble in water.......I seriously doubt that any eagles that they have been finding with lead poisoning in them got the lead from bullets. They probably had it build up in their systems via the fish they eat.

Lead is not soluble in water. The eagles and condors ingest the lead pellets or balls from carrion they eat. Their highly caustic gastric juices partially dissolve the lead and it is absorbed into the blood stream until fatal levels are achieved. The number of birds killed by lead poisoning is so low that the idea of banning lead projectiles is ridiculous. Lead has been used for projectiles for over 2 centuries. This is just the tree huggers at work using any method they can to eliminate hunting.