The best BH209 substitute?

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Brettk

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Apr 25, 2021
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I have my first muzzleloading hunt in early September. I still haven’t shot my ML because I can’t find any BH209 besides on gunbroker for ridiculous prices.

Whats the best alternative powder/pellets? I have a CVA Accura V2, and my bullets are the Barnes 290gr T-EZ sabots.

What snake should I use when I’m at the range and have the clean the barrel after every shot?
 

michiganmuzzy

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I would suggest you find some Triple 7 ffg. I think you'll find a good load between 90gr-110gr of the T7. But start lower, like 70gr and shoot a few, then try a few with +5gr more powder. I wouldnt bother with a bore snake. A couple damp(water or windex) patches and then a couple dry patches after each shot. You'll most likely have the famous T7 crud ring after each shot or 2. The damp patches should take it right down.
 

deermanok

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I had a similar problem. I have Blackhorn but no primers.
I was able to get the CVA northwest breech plug conversion kit and switched to musket caps and Triple 7.
For target shooting, the dreaded crud ring is something to deal with after a few shots.
 

Caniborrowsomeammo

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T7 is miserable with the crud ring. I now run my wet patch down on the crud ring and leave it there a coupla to soak, which loosens it up pretty good.
Ideally, I just conservatively shoot 209. I know that doesn't help you on your search for 209 tho. You have to check stock daily wherever you shop, it is available at times.
 

ENCORE50A

HUBBARD LAKE-MI
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T7 is miserable with the crud ring. I now run my wet patch down on the crud ring and leave it there a coupla to soak, which loosens it up pretty good.
Ideally, I just conservatively shoot 209. I know that doesn't help you on your search for 209 tho. You have to check stock daily wherever you shop, it is available at times.
If you'd like to eliminate ..... some ...... of your problems with T7, change from just a wet patch to Butch's Black Powder Bore Shine. A slightly damp patch and it will take it right out. Its up to you rather you want to use a dry patch after.

I've shot cases of T7 and Butch's is by far the easiest method to swab and also clean with. I could clean a rifle with just 5 patches.... SPOTLESS.

Amazon.com: Butch's 02949 Bore Shine Black Powder (8 oz): Sports & Outdoors
 

mnoland30

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Dec 1, 2015
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T7 is much cheaper than BH209, and has just a little lower velocity. I've used Pyrodex too, and it works fine. The biggest selling point for BH 209 is the fact that you don't need to swab between shots. When hunting, it doesn't matter. I've used a looser sabot for a quick second shot. If you need more than two, then you have time to swab. At the range, swabing with a wet patch lets you take a little time between shots, and cools the barrel. I shot 777 in front of #11 caps and never knew what a crud ring was until I bought my Accura. I've had misfires with BH 209, but never with 777.
 

southdakbearfan

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Feb 6, 2021
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If you'd like to eliminate ..... some ...... of your problems with T7, change from just a wet patch to Butch's Black Powder Bore Shine. A slightly damp patch and it will take it right out. Its up to you rather you want to use a dry patch after.

I've shot cases of T7 and Butch's is by far the easiest method to swab and also clean with. I could clean a rifle with just 5 patches.... SPOTLESS.

Amazon.com: Butch's 02949 Bore Shine Black Powder (8 oz): Sports & Outdoors
I find the hoppes black powder solvent cuts through it likity split as well. Every third shot I do that treatment.

Its not some welded in mass in the barrel, although some would like you to believe you need a nuclear powered bore brush and he-man arms to get it out.
 

Widude

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I just bought some fresh B209 about two weeks ago, may of been at Farm & Fleet of all places. I didn’t expect to see it there.

If not B209 my next choice is 777, loose.
 

snapbang

Imlay City Michigan
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Yep, I use and prefer the dreaded T7 powder. With a spit patch or Windex patch its a none issue.
 

sdporter

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I prefer Pyrodex Select over T7, but I won’t use either with sabots. Just a preference thing.
Hopefully you can get some BH soon.
I just started using real black with my lead bullets and I do like that better. Haven’t actually accuracy tested it yet to see how they all compare.
 

snapbang

Imlay City Michigan
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I bought some swiss last week. Im trying to get my sidelock as close as possible to authentic. Got my home made skinner sight , a supply of .495 round balls, patched, swiss, and #11s.

For my purchased .50 TC Renegade I have Mr. Hollowpoint making some pure lead conical boolits.

:)
 

Docsv2pistol

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Try real black powder, as others have suggested.

TRULY ANALYZE the average range at which you kill your big game animal(s).

Throw out the longest & shortest distances, before you calculate the average.

If you are killing deer/elk/moose/black bear/feral hogs at any average distance under 150 yards; then the substitute powders have NO REAL WORLD ADVANTAGE over standard Goex black powder, much less the higher quality/higher energy Swiss black powder.

I know this is a hard nut to swallow, but the statistics tell the truth. If you are shooting a modern inline muzzleloading rifle wearing ANY KIND OF MODERN OPTICAL DEVICE, then the scope/red dot optic/holographic optic eliminates ANY ARGUMENT for the substitutes.

Because, the scope can be EASILY ADJUSTED to compensate for the difference between black powder, and ANY OF THE SUBSTITUTES.

Iron, open sights would be a different story. But, THAT'S NOT WHAT WE ARE TALKING ABOUT HERE, IS IT?

Yes, black powder is messier than BH209. But, I would argue that it will force the average muzzleloading shooter to start taking better care of their rifle than ever before.

IMO, BH209 has made a whole generation of muzzleloading shooters lazy as can be due to its virtually non-existent corrosive properties. It corrodes, but so slowly that most shooters can get away with not cleaning their muzzleloading guns just like they do with their centerfire guns.

The truth is that ALL of the subs were designed to compete against real black powder, to mimic the smoke of real black powder, and to provide a higher stored energy per comparable volume measurement, then real black powder.

WITH BULLETS, not patched balls. And bullets don't really come into their own with muzzleloading HUNTERS, not target shooters, until you get past 125-150 yards. Depending upon the caliber of the ball as compared to ANY caliber bullet.
 
Last edited:

brushblind

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Jul 2, 2021
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Same thing with Dutchess Meghan, I don't find bh209 all that attractive! 777 with hot #11 caps or musket caps works just fine. If you shoot in extreme cold you'll want the musket caps!
 

Bphunter1974

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I mix 2 parts rubbing alcohol 2 parts peroxide with one part Murphys oil soap. It dissolves triple 7 crud in seconds. You can put your breech plug in a little bottle with this mixture shake it a couple times and it's as shiny as new as well.
 

ourway77

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Dec 20, 2015
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When I used 777 I always cleaned between shots as that first shot is from a clean barrel I used windex to clean between shots unless you can see your way clear to get a rifle using rifle powder it 's all a pain in the arse but worth it Good thing about 777 it will go bang with just about any type primer
 
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