General Bullet/Sabot Questions

[Donny123]

I'm very new to the game, I have a total of around 20 shots out of my new Optima V2.

I reload pistol, rifle and shotgun so I'm automatically looking for components I can use to save money. I have some Hornady XTP 240gn in the green sabot and I also got a box of Hornady XTP 230grain and am shooting them in a black m&p sabot, both accurate. It has me asking what can't I put in the sabot, or can use without one. I have 230gn RN HiTek (powder coated) bullets, 230gn Copper Plated LRN, and some others.

So what are the do's and don'ts? Does it matter as long as it's the right diameter for the sabot and it's accurate? Need to be a certain hardness, below a certain velocity? Is a powder coated bullet ok? I know people like Power Belts but they are pricey and I'm actually liking the fact that with a sabot there is no direct lead or copper fouling. Do people shoot full size lead in these guns?

I will only be shooting paper and steel for the present and foreseeable future.

 

[MrTom]

As long as the bullet is contained in the sabot I don't see much issue with lead, copper jacket, copper plate, powder coat and the sabot is coded for the bullet diameter. You might get issues from bullets that are too light weight-wise and may be too short to stabilize well. In your Optima you may find good results about 50-50 when using bullets and sabots in 40 cal and under....some people do ok , others don't seem to have much luck. That 240 XTP in the green sabot can be a super accurate combination in a 50 cal.

 

[Donny123]

That 240 XTP in the green sabot can be a super accurate combination in a 50 cal.

Yep, 5-6 went in the same hole.

 

[robertb]

I just purchased a CVA Optima V2 in nitride and have the same questions as you. I've been muzzleloading since the early 90s and started out with a Knight MK-85. I then moved on to a Savage 10ML-II and have recently been wanting to get into a break action with a QRBP. With that said, I've found that the green sabots with the 44 cal 240 gr XTP were not the most accurate. Several years back, I bought the 45 gr 250gr XTPs in the 100ct box and then ordered the sabots separately from MMP SABOTS : Blackpowder Muzzleloader Sabots And Accessories. I found this combination to cut holes in both my Savage and my CVA.

Based on what I've read, the bigger the diameter bullet and the less thickness in the sabot will usually result in better accuracy. I have also purchased the Hornady .458 HPs and plan to use then with the MMP orange sabot. This here may give you an idea of what bullet works with what sabot:

https://mmpsabots.com/recommended-bullet-list/
I've found it much much cheaper to buy the bullets in bulk and buy the sabots separately as opposed buying the 15-20 pack of "muzzleloader bullets".

 

[Donny123]

The Hornady 20 pack, 240gn XTP with the green sabot is one hole groups a 50 yards for me so I'm sticking with that for now and midway had them for under $11 for 20. Loading them with 65 gn vol/50.7 by weight of 777 is around 1500-1600fps. I also got the 230gn XTP and shooting them with the black m&p sabot with 70gn/54.6. Both are literally one hole at 50 yards, going to stretch them both to 100 yards next time out.

Just a thought on the 230/240gn XTP's, I've read people are usually pushing these much faster and that might destabilize the lighter bullets. I have no need to punish my shoulder punching paper and accuracy is king anyway, especially in a hunting situation. The 240gn @ 1500fps is over 1k fpe, plenty to pass through a deer.

I also plan on experimenting with some powder coated 230gn LRN to see if they compare in accuracy.

Good shooting!

 

[Donny123]

I also plan on experimenting with some powder coated 230gn LRN to see if they compare in accuracy.

As a follow up to this subject I was curious about Brinell harness of these powder coated lead bullets. From what I've read, a full bore size bullet has to be around 10 Brinell or lower to properly expand and seal against the bore in a ML, but also to soft of a bullet can lead to leading. Of course most of the discussions relate to smokeless powdered firearms. I am interested in using them in a sabot so I guess none of that applies. My thoughts were more about if a softer bullet intended for handgun velocities will stay together at higher velocities. My amateur deduction has settled on the result that this really doesn't matter and these bullets are pretty hard with a Brinell hardness of 13.

I know that was a lot of talk for almost nothing but as a reloader of everything I shoot I like to know the details about safety, and this whole ML thing is brand new to me. The bottom line was to save on cost and not be paying .50-$1+ not including powder and all these bullets up to 255gn come in at 10 cents each.

Next time out I will get some accuracy results on the 230gn powder coated bullets .451 dia in a black M&P sabot and post the results. My estimation of powder cost is aprox 22 cents per shot, sabot 20 cents, and a bullet that is 10 cents, under 50 cents per shots would be more than reasonable.