Heavy lead with a smokeless.

[MeatMachine]

I recently purchased a hankins 45cal bullet sizer die to size my .458 home cast bullets for my cva optima elete 45-70 conversion. I’m impressed with the die and the load I worked up for it shoots great with no swabbing required. One pic is before sizing and the other after sizing.

 

[smokepolehall]

Hankins sizer is a good one

 

[MeatMachine]

I like it and wish I bought one a long time ago.

 

[MeatMachine]

I forgot to mention it’s a 405gr bullet and I plan on thumping a bear with it this fall.

 

[Mnt monkey]

I've been shooting some 400 grain jacketed bullets with black horn and a little bit of smokeless 4198 is done okay but I know it's not the ideal powder for a 400 grain bullet I was just curious on your smokeless loads what you were shooting being a lead bullet I know you're not pushing them too hard and being a 400 grain bullet for me I'm not really interested in pushing them too hard I've been shooting 84 grains of Blackhorn and sometimes 85 getting excellent accuracy My Smokeless loads have been okay 3/4 to 1 in but not as accurate as the Blackhorn loads with the big jacketed bullet I'm still learning an experimenting a lot I guess what you do with big lead smokeless would be interesting it might help me I'm curious keep us updated

 

[michiganmuzzy]

Im interested in your load development, too. I have been using a couple different powders with 340-350 grain lead bullets. Its slow going working up loads for those heavier bullets

 

[MeatMachine]

I was going to use H322 because I saw a 400gr compressed load data for a 450 marlin. I was going to use a reduced load of it because I could see it was safe in a compressed load. I didn’t have much of H322 so I jumped to imr4198 because I have about six pounds of it. I started at 25gr and worked up to 27gr and I think I can move up but right now it’s shooting great. When the snow melts and my backyard dries up from mud season I’ll have more time to work on load development but I might not have to change a thing.

 

[Mnt monkey]

I have a lot of other smokeless powders that I could dabble with I don't have 110 and 120 I do have a lot of Sr 4759 too I thought about trying a real light load around 27-28 grains of that with the 400 grain bullets I'm a experiment a little bit back to the Blackhorn I think I've really found something that's clicking very well with the fury 400 and the northern Precision 400 the combination of those bullets and a stiff load of Blackhorn is really shooting lights out with a baffle muzzle brake it's very manageable to me much lighter than a smokeless load, I agree with Michigan muzzy no point in getting in a big hurry with those big bullets work it up slow

 

[MeatMachine]

My rifle is a cva optima elete 45-70 conversion with no brake. I’m just trying to match the old 405gr bp load or maybe a little more. I use imr4759 with saboted 200gr and full bore up to 300gr. I just thought the 4198 would be a better choice but I might give the 4759 a try. I think I have room to move up with the 4198 though.

 

[Mnt monkey]

I want to experiment with some other powders with 400 grain bullets so far Blackhorn has blown 4198 away which I didn't expect sometimes there's not a lot of information on the big bullets all the more reason to proceed with caution.

 

[GM54-120]

Hodgdon has a good list of powders/loads for bullets from 405-460gr in hard cast. I just dont see any of them listing if the load is compressed or not.

You MIGHT be able to create a air space by using a couple dry wool wads.

 

[MeatMachine]

I did try a 50cal lubed wad with my 45-70 cartridge rifle with imr 4759 405gr bullet and did see my primer flatten out more but a dry 45cal wad may not have done that.

 

[45-70]

looks like your grease grooves are are to small for enough lube

 

[MeatMachine]

The sizing process pushes some lead into the grease grooves. I just lube them to run through the die and shooting them with a lubed 50cal wool wad. No sign of barrel leading after ten shots so far.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

@MeatMachine, what lube are you using?

 

[MeatMachine]

Something I whipped up a long time ago and to tell you the truth I don’t remember all and what ratio of ingredients I used.

 

[MeatMachine]

I just remembered I used paraffin wax crisco and some canola oil but I just wagged it didn’t measure the amounts.

 

[HV-Muzzleloaders]

I've been shooting some 400 grain jacketed bullets with black horn and a little bit of smokeless 4198 is done okay but I know it's not the ideal powder for a 400 grain bullet I was just curious on your smokeless loads what you were shooting being a lead bullet I know you're not pushing them too hard and being a 400 grain bullet for me I'm not really interested in pushing them too hard I've been shooting 84 grains of Blackhorn and sometimes 85 getting excellent accuracy My Smokeless loads have been okay 3/4 to 1 in but not as accurate as the Blackhorn loads with the big jacketed bullet I'm still learning an experimenting a lot I guess what you do with big lead smokeless would be interesting it might help me I'm curious keep us updated

How much pressure is your limit?

You might try 90 grains Acc4064

QuickLoad predicts less than 45,000psi with a 405 gr Lyman bullet set at 100% fill in a 458 Win Mag case.

2475 fps from a 26 In. barrel

 

[Mnt monkey]

I don't have any ACC 4064 I will take a look at that though I appreciate the heads up

 

[HV-Muzzleloaders]

I don't have any ACC 4064 I will take a look at that though I appreciate the heads up

It works well in my heavy 50 caliber smokeless barrel I got from Arrowhead. It is the 1.125" Savage-type barrel.

Some of the groups are not the best I have ever shot, but OK for deer hunting, and have good velocity.