Questions answered? Triple Seven pellets.

[DeathValleyMike]

Hello All
I signed up and glad I did! Looking forward to the discussions and learning some stuff along the way.

Triple Seven Pellets:
I started these pellets not long after they came out .
My Knight in-line I had at the time threw bullets all over paper at 100 yards.
Several years ago I bought a CVA OPTIMA 50 and my groups got tighter , but no where near what I wanted!
I took several deer, including my personal best with this rifle, but 4 inch groups at 100 were common.
I kept allof my shots in the mountain thickets of SC and Georgia to less than 80 anyway.
2 years ago I bought the Optima V2 and didn’t see much if any improvement.

This past deer season I decided to do a test.
I was using 3 Triple Seven Pellets . So I loaded 3 and then a Powerbelt 245.
I pushed it to my mark on the Ram rod.

Then I removed the breech plug and poured everything out.

There was busted up powder, small chunks of pellet and larger chunks.

I then repeated the process 3 more times and each time my mark on the rod was just a touch different . Not much.

I measured the distance from the end of the Ram rod to the barrel and found that I was getting 1/16 - 3/32 difference every time!
A freind told me about Blackhorn 209 and the Barnes bullets with the blue tip.
( Sorry don’t have the name between my ears right now)

I tried this setup and was getting 1.5-2.0 inch groups at 100 quickly!

My theory is that the “crush” of the pellets wasn’t consistent and therefore bullet seating wasn’t consistent.

During those tests I had a couple of pellets that only crushed about 50% and half the pellet still had the mass with an in tact hole through the center.

Between seating issues and air voids in the powder column , this has to be my issue.
I’ve been shooting and testing quite a bit and started my third can of Blackhorn.
I have had zero issues!

I would love to hear what others have to say!
Thanks
Mike

 

[kerryman71]

I'm fairly new to ML, and have never used pellets. I have BH209 and 777 powders. I feel that using powder you can tweak your recipe better and have it tuned into your round of choice, distance and rifle better than pellets.

The question I have is were you shooting using three pellets? Three pellets is 150 grain by volume, which is pretty high up there. I'd imagine rounds would be erratic, amongst other things. I'm sure pellets users can chime in to help, and correct me if needed.

Good luck and welcome to the forum.

 

[deermanok]

Welcome from Oklahoma.
Interesting information on your tests.
I don't use pellets but I can see that if they crush when loading, you could experience differences in accuracy.

 

[MrTom]

The pellets need to stay intact to be accurate. Over- ramming them breaks them and not only gives inconsistent results but creates uneven pressures when fired, not good. Granular T7 delivers better consistency and likely far better accuracy. Personally, I think that if one can find and afford BH209 powder he's a step up from even T7.

 

[snapbang]

Id go to 2 pellets and push the bullet slowly and firmly down.

 

[ENCORE50A]

.................................. Over- ramming them breaks them and not only gives inconsistent results but creates uneven pressures when fired, not good................

This is 100% correct. Pellets work well and a rifle can be extremely accurate with the right sabot/bullet combination.

Seat the bullet until you feel it on the bullet and STOP. I'd also suggest swabbing between each round with a BARELY DAMP PATCH of Butch's Black Powder Bore Shine.

Pellets............................

 

[Rvrrat14]

I use White Hots in my Optima 2. I unload mine without issue.

I’d check how hard you’re pushing on the ramrod. I take mine to the bottom and add just a tad of pressure.

 

[DeathValleyMike]

I use White Hots in my Optima 2. I unload mine without issue.

I’d check how hard you’re pushing on the ramrod. I take mine to the bottom and add just a tad of pressure.

That is pretty much what I do as well.
I’m not cramming the ramrod with extreme force.
If some folks don’t seem to have an issue that’s great!
I’m just saying that I was having an issue. I switched to BH209 and use Triple seven primers and I have the tightest groups I’ve ever shot with a muzzle loader.
I have an old Hawken 54 with percussion caps and an even older flintlock that I haven’t shot in 30 years I wanna pull out.
Different powder obviously ( pyrodex) but never had a problem with them if it’s not pouring rain.
Other folks may have different results .
Cheers

 

[SparkPlug]

I use 2 of the same pellets in my Traditions Buckstalker shooting a 275gr BoreLock. What I found is using the max load (150gr) my shots were erratic. Backing down to 2 pellets (100gr) they evened up and gave me 1/2" groups at 100 yds with sabots. Than I switched to the BoreLock and can shoot cloverleaf at 100 yds on a bad day.

My loading method...
Hold barrel at 45° and pour the pellets from my load tube. Allow them to gently slide down.
Place the bullet in the muzzle and push in.
Ram slowly until the bullet is seated against the powder.
Drop the ramrod on the bullet 3 times.

Prime and shoot.

This has always seated the bullet on the powder without crushing to give a consistent burn each shot.

 

[BigBoresmokepole]

I use whitehots and I don't crush them at all

 

[earlthegoat2]

There is many anecdotes out there that three pellets of Pyrodex/T7 will open groups up.

The first thing I would try would be going to only 2 pellets and keep ramming the same way you have always been.

If things don’t improve try to ram more carefully.

Then if the results are the same, go to loose powder.

I’ve also personally never had good groups with power belts. Switching to sabots or a GPB always improved things.

 

[a cloud of smoke]

I put a paint mark on the ram rod, so when I get close to bottom, I go slow but firmly till the paint mark lines up with the crown, a trick to see if the bullet is set on the pellets or powder is to drop the ram rod from just a few inches above the bullet and see if it bounces or not, if it does then your good to go, if not, the bullet is not seated all the way...and gently push but never hit the rod down..