A modern flintlock setup for deer

[EthanRubin_123]

I’m a 15 year old boy that’s 5’5 and 111 lbs. I’m looking to buy a flintlock to extend the notoriously strict Pennsylvania hunting season. I want a flintlock that has more modern specs and can shoot sabots/powerbelts as well as can shoot black powder substitutes. Price isn’t a massive issue, but would prefer to keep the budget under $500. Are there any rifles that jump out? Also, what sabots/Powerbelts would you recommend and with what powder and what amount of powder? Thanks in advance, Ethan Rubin

 

[eekjellander]

I’m a 15 year old boy that’s 5’5 and 111 lbs. I’m looking to buy a flintlock to extend the notoriously strict Pennsylvania hunting season. I want a flintlock that has more modern specs and can shoot sabots/powerbelts as well as can shoot black powder substitutes. Price isn’t a massive issue, but would prefer to keep the budget under $500. Are there any rifles that jump out? Also, what sabots/Powerbelts would you recommend and with what powder and what amount of powder? Thanks in advance, Ethan Rubin

What you want does not exist unless you get a custom built ,at least in a rifle . Most common barrels are slow twist shooting round ball . I personally have never heard of sabots being used (well maybe the patch on a round ball) counts .And forget subs ,Black powder is the only thing that works with a rock lock ! /Ed

 

[Saxtonyoung]

Although not common , I have seen a few Flintlock 50 caliber Thompson Center White Mountain Carbines that would have either a 1:20 or 1:38 twist depending when they were made that would be ideal for shooting sabots or conical bullets. Infact one sold recently on gun broker for $615.

 

[edmehlig]

I would go to this web site and order the 300gr Elite using 90 gr of Black 3F powder or try 777-3F.
http://www.prbullet.com/ee.htm

 

[Semisane]

You've got a few problems to work through Ethan.

If you want to shoot sabots you will want a faster twist barrel than what's found on most flintlocks. The round ball shooting flinters typically have a rate of twist of 1:66, 1:70 or 1:72. That slow twist will not shoot sabots well.

The Lyman Great Plains Hunter has a twist of 1:32, which so far as I know is the fastest twist available in a production flintlock. The Lyman guns are excellent but typically above your $500 target. Also, they are hard to find at this time.

Thompson Center made flintlocks in 1:48 twist. That rate of twist can handle some sabot loads fairly well, but take some experimentation with the bullet/sabot/powder charge to get satisfactory results. However TC discontinued production of those so you'll have to search the used market for one.

Traditions makes a 1:48 twist flintlock that is under $500, though not of the quality of either Lyman or TC. Check out the rifles at Graf & Sons. Rifles - Muzzleloading - Graf & Sons

Your second problem is wishing to use black powder subs. Most work poorly or don't work at all in a flintlock. To assure acceptable ignition with subs it's usually necessary to duplex the load, with about five grains of real black powder as an igniter under the sub (i.e. load 5 gr. of black, then X grains of the sub, then the bullet. It's almost a certainty you will need real black powder in the pan. I know of no sub that will reliably ignite in the pan by the flint strike.

Flintlocks with real black powder and patched round balls kill deer reliably and have done so for hundreds of years. If your hunting situation typically presents shots in the range of 100 yards or less I recommend you give traditional flintlocking a try.

 

[EthanRubin_123]

What you want does not exist unless you get a custom built ,at least in a rifle . Most common barrels are slow twist shooting round ball . I personally have never heard of sabots being used (well maybe the patch on a round ball) counts .And forget subs ,Black powder is the only thing that works with a rock lock ! /Ed

Traditions makes a gun called a pa pellet ultralight that has a 1:28 twist and can from videos I’ve seen can shoot black powder subs. The biggest reason for wanting to use a sub is due to the corrosive properties of black powder. However it seems that traditions is not held in high regard. Also the tc firestorm, although not in production also seemed to be a good “modern” flintlock. So I feel like it definitely does exist, just is not plentiful by any means.

 

[BrantSFGDS]

TC Firestorm is probably the closest thing to what you want, but I don't remeber the twist and who knows where you would find one. A Great Plains Hunter would work, especially the new Pedersoli version if they offer it in flint. Honestly, you would be well suited to find a good used TC Renegade or Hawken and shoot conicals and eeal black powder. Search for Idaho Lewis on here and on YouTube and you'll discover that you can make a 1:48 twist barrel shoot conicals very well.

 

[Saxtonyoung]

With a muzzleloader you will need to more diligent in cleaning than you would be with smokeless firearm. Dont let Black Powder scare you in fact it's more responding to spark than a lot of the subs.

 

[michiganmuzzy]

Although not common , I have seen a few Flintlock 50 caliber Thompson Center White Mountain Carbines that would have either a 1:20 or 1:38 twist depending when they were made that would be ideal for shooting sabots or conical bullets. Infact one sold recently on gun broker for $615.

I had a WMC and it was great lite little gun. No idea why i got rid of it. If you find one in flint you would have a great gun that will be everything you're looking for, imho.

 

[Aaron871]

Pedersoli Hawken Hunter Flintlock has a 1:24 twist.

 

[Saxtonyoung]

Providing you find one available the Pedersoli is well built rifle.

 

[Idaholewis]

@EthanRubin_123

I wish i could be more help to you here Bud, All of my Rifles are Cap locks. Flintlock ignition is something i have ZERO experience with, In fact i have never even fired one. I don’t know what is Available in Flintlock Rifles?

If it were me, I would try and find a Pedrsersoli Hawken Hunter Flintlock, I had that Same Rifle in Percussion and they are VERY WELL Built They have a “Snappy” 1:24 Twist, Specifically designed to Shoot Bullets. Since you want to Shoot Bullets, i would NOT get Anything with a Slower Twist Rate than 1-48

You might find a Lyman Great Plains “Hunter” in Flintlock? They are a 1:32 Twist

 

[Bushfire]

@EthanRubin_123

I wish i could be more help to you here Bud, All of my Rifles are Cap locks. Flintlock ignition is something i have ZERO experience with, In fact i have never even fired one. I don’t know what is Available in Flintlock Rifles?

If it were me, I would try and find a Pedrsersoli Hawken Hunter Flintlock, I had that Same Rifle in Percussion and they are VERY WELL Built They have a “Snappy” 1:24 Twist, Specifically designed to Shoot Bullets. Since you want to Shoot Bullets, i would NOT get Anything with a Slower Twist Rate than 1-48

You might find a Lyman Great Plains “Hunter” in Flintlock? They are a 1:32 Twist

Did you end up offloading your pedersoli? I remember in your video there were a few things you didn't love about it.

 

[Idaholewis]

Something to keep in mind, The Pedersoli Hawken Hunter is a Shorter, more modern Rifle, Where as the Lyman Great Plains Hunter is a Loooooooong, Traditional style Rifle

 

[Bushfire]

Pedersoli Hawken Hunter Flintlock has a 1:24 twist.

I was going to suggest this, I did seriously consider it as I love the idea of flintlocks but the extra hassle over a caplock turned me away.

 

[Idaholewis]

Did you end up offloading your pedersoli? I remember in your video there were a few things you didn't love about it.

I sold it to Forum member @Saxtonyoung here, The Pedersoli is a ROCK SOLID, VERY WELL BUILT Rifle, I am just a Die Hard TC Renegade & Hawken Guy, The Pedersoli just Sat in my Gun Safe, I decided to get rid of a Few that I didn’t Shoot. They deserve to be with Somebody that will Shoot em I am so tied up with my TC’s that I don’t have time for others, to do them Justice anyway

 

[Bushfire]

I sold it to Forum member @Saxtonyoung here, The Pedersoli is a ROCK SOLID, VERY WELL BUILT Rifle, I am just a Die Hard TC Renegade & Hawken Guy, The Pedersoli just Sat in my Gun Safe, I decided to get rid of a Few that I didn’t Shoot. They deserve to be with Somebody that will Shoot em I am so tied up with my TC’s that I don’t have time for others, to do them Justice anyway

Fair enough mate, I'm hanging out for the day I see your video entitled "hawken Missouri River" though!

 

[Idaholewis]

Fair enough mate, I'm hanging out for the day I see your video entitled "hawken Missouri River" though!

That one is a HIGH Possibility!

 

[Potato boy]

Pedersoli Hawken Hunter flintlock

 

[EthanRubin_123]

Pedersoli Hawken Hunter flintlock

I can’t seem to find one that’s under 1k, which is def over budget. They seem to be a rare occurrence.