Big Bore Problem

[BlackPowderGuy (AJHS)]

I got a little range time in today...A couple of months back I bought a Cabela's Investarm .50 cal from a guy on the sister site. Gun was in pristine condition. Here's the thing, everything I shoot out of it is loose. I bought the No Excuses sizing pack and even the .504 slides down with no pressure...used and XTP 300 grain in a black sabot, it felt like there was some resistance when it went down the bore but when I recovered the sabot after the shot, the petals had not opened at all, looked unused, leading me to think it did not engage the rifling. I began to think I was crazy and maybe it was a .54, but the barrel is stamped .50 cal!

I am going to try the red harvester sabot, which is the thickest one I know of, but...anybody have thoughts?

 

[HC]

X paper patch the conicals.

 

[deermanok]

Never been a fan of using non traditional bullets and sabots in a traditional gun.
Patched round ball or a lead conical like a TC Maxi Hunter or a Hornady PA Conical are about all I ever used.

 

[Dave951]

Either paper patch or PRB. Quit insisting on screwing around with sabots and other modern stuff designed for inlines.

 

[BlackPowderGuy (AJHS)]

Either paper patch or PRB. Quit insisting on screwing around with sabots and other modern stuff designed for inlines.

I am not "insisting" on sabots or modern projectiles...I am trying to find a load that works well for my gun and that I feel comfortable with... I am not a purist, if a saboted XTP stabilizes just fine out of my 1:48, then why the heck shouldn't I use it!

For my Deerhunter, this has not been a problem, it did great with the Great Plains bullet and with the No Excuses .501...all good.

This other gun is trickier . I am open to trying paper patching {though since I have no idea how to do it, I will play around on youtube...unless anyone has a link to a video they recomment}...I also did buy balls and patches though they did not group well and while I KNOW that a well placed ball can bring down a deer with no problems, due to property lines, I need a deer go down within 50 yards or less. The doe I shot with a GP bullet dropped right there and I DO have more confidence that a well placed 400 grain pure lead conical or a 300 grain XTP has a greater probability of a DRT than a 230 grain ball. Not that the PRB won't kill, it will...but again,I do not have a huge margin for error.

 

[Hatchet Jack]

Sounds like your bore is a wee bit over sized. I would not let that discourage you though. My experience with some of the NO Excuses conicals with my guns is, they seem to be slightly smaller in diameter than my Bullshop conicals. My .504 Bullshop conicals fit perfect in my White M98 barrel, where as my No Excuses .504 conicals are too loose for my liking.
I remedy this by rolling my No Excuses between two flat bastard files.(Knurl them up) Once fattened up from the knurling they fit perfect in my barrel.

 

[BlackPowderGuy (AJHS)]

Sounds like your bore is a wee bit over sized. I would not let that discourage you though. My experience with some of the NO Excuses conicals with my guns is, they seem to be slightly smaller in diameter than my Bullshop conicals. My .504 Bullshop conicals fit perfect in my White M98 barrel, where as my No Excuses .504 conicals are too loose for my liking.
I remedy this by rolling my No Excuses between two flat bastard files.(Knurl them up) Once fattened up from the knurling they fit perfect in my barrel.

Is that the .504 Mountain Mould 460 grain?

 

[Hatchet Jack]

Yes, .504 Mtn Mould NEX 460 gr

 

[coupe]

JHSA president, squash a lead ball flat enough to be larger than the bore so it will scrape some off the ball when loaded. Before you load it get a brass rod less than bore size in the bore abt. 8 to 10" long in first, then carefully load the ball just far enough in to the bore say 6" down. Use some thing stout but don't hit the lands with the tool, now hold the rifle and tip the butt down to put the rod back to the breach, thrust forward stop quickly and repeat till the soft rod pops the ball free measure the lands and the bore, now you know what you are dealing with. (SOFT ROD FOR BORE PROTECTION) works every time.
coupe

 

[Dave951]

I am not "insisting" on sabots or modern projectiles...

Sure sounds like it. You've complained about the lack of standards in traditional style muzzleloaders in another thread and I'll just reiterate here, they do NOT conform to SAAMI standards.

I DO have more confidence that a well placed 400 grain pure lead conical or a 300 grain XTP has a greater probability of a DRT than a 230 grain ball. Not that the PRB won't kill, it will...but again,I do not have a huge margin for error.

DRT, well, that isn't a certainty even with a modern centerfire. The ONLY certain DRT with Bambi is a CNS shot, Central Nervous System, ie, head or spine. Take a shot at one that's just been spooked by a guy over the ridge, it's possible that without a CNS shot, it's got enough adrenaline to run into the next property or even the next county before it expires. It all comes down to where you're hunting and who's on the next lease/property over. Mid-season, most deer in publicly hunted lands are seriously spooked from the start.

With a CNS shot, huge power isn't required. It's possible with a 22lr but you have to be able to shoot and that is really the crux of this issue. So back to my original comments, get your gun shooting extremely accurately and practice, practice, and practice some more.

 

[UndeadPoet]

Has the bore possibly been rebored to a larger caliber?

 

[BlackPowderGuy (AJHS)]

Thank you everyone for the helpful advice!

 

[Bad Karma]

Thank you everyone for the helpful advice!

Can you beg or borrow a few pin gauges?

 

[Dirty Mike]

Have you measured the barrel yet?

 

[Nit Wit]

Dial calipers will tell you for sure, a bunch of guns have been bored and rifled to the next caliber. Drop a AAA battery down the bore and see if you have cur rifling or shallow button rifling.
Nit Wit

 

[Okie Hog]

QUOTE="JHSA-President, post: 381642, member: 25480"]
I am not a purist, if a saboted XTP stabilizes just fine out of my 1:48, then why the heck shouldn't I use it!
[/QUOTE]

i use what works for me. Give the red sabot a go,

 

[Confederate rifleman]

My TC Hawken dotes on a sabot load. I shoot what my rifles tell me they like.
My Firehawk is actually more accurate with full caliber lead than the Hawken.
It's ALL good.

 

[BlackPowderGuy (AJHS)]

UPDATE: So, on the advice of some folks here, I ordered some bullets from the Bullshop, the NEX in 460 grain .5045 in diameter. I took it to the range today and while it still went down the bore with very little pressure, it did not just slide down. I turned the gun muzzle down and shook extremely vigorously and then checked and the bullet had not migrated off the powder…bullet shot spot on at 50 yards over a wad and 60 grains of powder. So…I feel like my search for a load for this gun is now done! Thanks to everyone for their help. Now, I just have to order a healthy supply of these bullets, vacuum seal them to keep the lube fresh and I can stop worrying!

 

[deermanok]

Good deal. I'll bet those bullets will put the smackdown on a deer, no problem.

 

[brad502a]

I will no longer do business wiht No Excuses bullet company. The bullets I ordered on two separate orders were all undersized. Garbage