Cva Paramount

[souperdouper75]

So back in early December, I sent my Paramount back because, well, it just wasn't consistent. Took them awhile to get around to it, but today, unannounced UPS delivered it. I immediately knew something was up as it was in a smaller box. When I sent it back, I sent it with the original box and in the Actual soft case it came in. Well, they sent me a new rifle, but no case. so, I open it up. And there it is. A new rifle. Evidently the gunsmiths found it to be unrepairable. But then, I find this target in the box. I am curious as to how they consider that to be less than a 1 inch group. And at 100 yards yet. The gun was shooting like that when I sent it there. I hope that i am able to get better groups than that, or it's going back. My grandsons wolf shoots that good at 100.

 

[Mango1]

Hi, I have a CVA Paramount Hunter 40 cal that shoots 1.0 inch groups at 100 yards. Suggestions...What powder load are you using and are you using the ELR Powerbelts with BH 209? Are you using a spin jag? I do not use the max load which will likely never allow the best accuracy. Lastly is there a scope on the ML? First thing to check when groups are erratic. You probably know all of the above but not knowing they are just suggestions.
When we purchased the Paramount I bought the muzzle break as well. They did not align the brake properly which caused a baffle strike which caused erratic down range results. Once I figured that out I called them and they sent me a .45 cal brake which reduced felt recoil and allowed sub-moa accuracy.
It's pretty lame of them to send you a target for a ML that they state will shoot sub-moa and this not sub-moa.

 

[deermanok]

Sucks that they didn't send back the case. Y'all paid for it some kinda way when you bought the gun.

 

[birdog]

Is that the actual target they sent you or a zoomed in copy of the target? It looks to be zoomed in to me and then printed out with the specs.

 

[souperdouper75]

Hi, I have a CVA Paramount Hunter 40 cal that shoots 1.0 inch groups at 100 yards. Suggestions...What powder load are you using and are you using the ELR Powerbelts with BH 209? Are you using a spin jag? I do not use the max load which will likely never allow the best accuracy. Lastly is there a scope on the ML? First thing to check when groups are erratic. You probably know all of the above but not knowing they are just suggestions.
When we purchased the Paramount I bought the muzzle break as well. They did not align the brake properly which caused a baffle strike which caused erratic down range results. Once I figured that out I called them and they sent me a .45 cal brake which reduced felt recoil and allowed sub-moa accuracy.
It's pretty lame of them to send you a target for a ML that they state will shoot sub-moa and this not sub-moa.

I am using blackhorn 209 and fury 250gr. Star tips. It was ok out to 100, but. Ithing like it should have been. Out to 250-275 it would shoot 3-4"groups, but after that the wheels fell off. Especially after 350 yards. The groups would open up to 10-15". Powerbelts shot alot better, but still not anything like I wanted. You didn't really. Notice the inconsistency in the bore with the powerbelts, but when going bullet to bore, it was blatantly obvious. I moved all over with charge weights, ranging from 70 grains by weight to 105 by weight. Didnt make a difference. I have talked with guys who have Paramounts that shoot the 105 by weight of BH209 who say that is the best load. As far as my brake goes, I installed an arrowhead muzzle brake, but immediately had issues with it. Turns out there was some that had made it through quality control that dis not pass and had burrs inside them.i sent it to them and they fixed it. I will find out with this one. Hopefully this one is ok. I gotta get the scope back on it and get it sighted in. I am running an Riton RTS Mod 3 4-24x50 scope. And, funny you should mention the spin jag. So, back in the fall when I was shooting it, I didnt realize that when I seated the bullet, the jag had spun off of the rod and was in the barrel. Of course, I fired it and didn't realize it until went to seat another bullet. Well, just last week I was shooting my 22/250 and found the jag in my backstop. I think it may still be useful. Lol

 

[Mango1]

I think you’re right bird dog. I didn’t look that closely at the picture. It says right on it the group size .981, powder load and projectile.

I am using blackhorn 209 and fury 250gr. Star tips. It was ok out to 100, but. Ithing like it should have been. Out to 250-275 it would shoot 3-4"groups, but after that the wheels fell off. Especially after 350 yards. The groups would open up to 10-15". Powerbelts shot alot better, but still not anything like I wanted. You didn't really. Notice the inconsistency in the bore with the powerbelts, but when going bullet to bore, it was blatantly obvious. I moved all over with charge weights, ranging from 70 grains by weight to 105 by weight. Didnt make a difference. I have talked with guys who have Paramounts that shoot the 105 by weight of BH209 who say that is the best load. As far as my brake goes, I installed an arrowhead muzzle brake, but immediately had issues with it. Turns out there was some that had made it through quality control that dis not pass and had burrs inside them.i sent it to them and they fixed it. I will find out with this one. Hopefully this one is ok. I gotta get the scope back on it and get it sighted in. I am running an Riton RTS Mod 3 4-24x50 scope. And, funny you should mention the spin jag. So, back in the fall when I was shooting it, I didnt realize that when I seated the bullet, the jag had spun off of the rod and was in the barrel. Of course, I fired it and didn't realize it until went to seat another bullet. Well, just last week I was shooting my 22/250 and found the jag in my backstop. I think it may still be useful. Lol

Prior to purchasing another jg check this out.
https://www.spinjag.com/spinjag_for_powerbelt_aerotip_elr_bullets.phpWhen I started using this product my down range results improved.

 

[lwh723]

Ya actually that does look like just under a 1" group center to center. Right about 0.9" is my estimate. Did you actually measure it?

 

[Mango1]

I think you’re right bird dog. I didn’t look that closely at the picture. It says right on it the group size .981, powder load and projectile.

Prior to purchasing another jg check this out.
https://www.spinjag.com/spinjag_for_powerbelt_aerotip_elr_bullets.phpWhen I started using this product my down range results improved.

My groups at 200 yards are around 2.5 inches and at 300 around 4. 300 yards is kind of my max for larger game as the energy in the round tapers off pretty drastically. I use a Leopold Mark 6 on my 50 and a Mark 4 on my Paramount. That may seem extreme but I also do a lot of long range hunting with my rifles which I've upgraded to the M5HD's and NF.

 

[souperdouper75]

Update. I sent them an email and they are sending a new case, which is fine with me because the small pouch had one zipper that was messed up from the get go. . As far as the target, that is the target they sent. Not zoomed in or anything. I did not measure it, but i always measured group size outside to outside. I haven't even had time to mount the scope but plan on it this week. i want to run a fury down the barrel first to see how it feels before i go through all that. i have talked to a couple guys who have had problems with theirs and one was sent a new rifle that was worse off than the one he sent.

 

[souperdouper75]

I think you’re right bird dog. I didn’t look that closely at the picture. It says right on it the group size .981, powder load and projectile.

Prior to purchasing another jg check this out.
https://www.spinjag.com/spinjag_for_powerbelt_aerotip_elr_bullets.phpWhen I started using this product my down range results improved.

The Paramount brake you bought, was that from CVA itself or aftermarket? I heard that they had alot of problems with the CVA brakes actually breaking (no pun intended) so that steered me in other directions.

 

[Mango1]

It was from CVA. They did send me a new one and twp packs of the 40 cal EDL rounds for the trouble.

 

[Mango1]

The Paramount brake you bought, was that from CVA itself or aftermarket? I heard that they had alot of problems with the CVA brakes actually breaking (no pun intended) so that steered me in other directions.

It was a CVA Brake. A piece of crap but they did send me a new one that seems to be working.

 

[gmstack]

Have you tried the brake being sold by anarchy ourdoors ??

 

[souperdouper75]

Soooooo, update to this old post. I FINALLY got around to sizing up some bullets to get this thing sighted in. I ran an ELR down the barrel first. It went down pretty consistent until around the last 4 or 5 inches and then started to get "snug". Next I started sizing some fury star tips. I put the first one in the barrel and it went down most of the way without too much struggle, but then, same thing, five inches from seating, it got tight. Really tight. So tight that i forced it and couldn't get it seated. I had to use a hammer and rod to hammer it out the rest of the way. I sized one down a little more and it was extremely easy to push down until that same depth then got tough. But I was able to get it pushed through. Needless to say, it isn't looking too promising. Gonna shoot it this weekend at some point to see if I am going to have a useable LR muzzeloader or another $1200 POS.

 

[Mnt monkey]

I just got a barreled action from a reputable builder and I won't mention name because I'm sure he's going to resolve the issue,, the barrel is a medium Palma,, the bore relaxes so much and changes dimensions where the shank starts ,where the contouring starts, I have the same issue, if I size a bullet for the bottom shank to fit the way it should the bullet will just fall down the first three quarters of the barrel. I tried some size 325 grain furys, one bullet hit the target at 100 yards the others hit the ground I could see the dust flying,, I tell you what if I were you I would send that Paramount to Woodman arms or I would call Woodman arms he's got a really neat Paramount rebuild with the Brooks barrel that will shoot lights out I've been shooting it for a month now. Do the Woodman Paramount rebuild it will not be wasted money!

 

[MeatMachine]

I am using blackhorn 209 and fury 250gr. Star tips. It was ok out to 100, but. Ithing like it should have been. Out to 250-275 it would shoot 3-4"groups, but after that the wheels fell off. Especially after 350 yards. The groups would open up to 10-15". Powerbelts shot alot better, but still not anything like I wanted. You didn't really. Notice the inconsistency in the bore with the powerbelts, but when going bullet to bore, it was blatantly obvious. I moved all over with charge weights, ranging from 70 grains by weight to 105 by weight. Didnt make a difference. I have talked with guys who have Paramounts that shoot the 105 by weight of BH209 who say that is the best load. As far as my brake goes, I installed an arrowhead muzzle brake, but immediately had issues with it. Turns out there was some that had made it through quality control that dis not pass and had burrs inside them.i sent it to them and they fixed it. I will find out with this one. Hopefully this one is ok. I gotta get the scope back on it and get it sighted in. I am running an Riton RTS Mod 3 4-24x50 scope. And, funny you should mention the spin jag. So, back in the fall when I was shooting it, I didnt realize that when I seated the bullet, the jag had spun off of the rod and was in the barrel. Of course, I fired it and didn't realize it until went to seat another bullet. Well, just last week I was shooting my 22/250 and found the jag in my backstop. I think it may still be useful. Lol

I would think shooting a spin jag out of your old barrel didn’t help it any.

 

[Mnt monkey]

Spin jags group well if you keep powder charges light!

 

[MeatMachine]

Update. I sent them an email and they are sending a new case, which is fine with me because the small pouch had one zipper that was messed up from the get go. . As far as the target, that is the target they sent. Not zoomed in or anything. I did not measure it, but i always measured group size outside to outside. I haven't even had time to mount the scope but plan on it this week. i want to run a fury down the barrel first to see how it feels before i go through all that. i have talked to a couple guys who have had problems with theirs and one was sent a new rifle that was worse off than the one he sent.

If you measure a group from outside to outside you have to deduct for the bullet diameter.

 

[Mango1]

Soooooo, update to this old post. I FINALLY got around to sizing up some bullets to get this thing sighted in. I ran an ELR down the barrel first. It went down pretty consistent until around the last 4 or 5 inches and then started to get "snug". Next I started sizing some fury star tips. I put the first one in the barrel and it went down most of the way without too much struggle, but then, same thing, five inches from seating, it got tight. Really tight. So tight that i forced it and couldn't get it seated. I had to use a hammer and rod to hammer it out the rest of the way. I sized one down a little more and it was extremely easy to push down until that same depth then got tough. But I was able to get it pushed through. Needless to say, it isn't looking too promising. Gonna shoot it this weekend at some point to see if I am going to have a useable LR muzzeloader or another $1200 POS.

That is really interesting. I have never experienced that with my 40 Paramount Hunter. One thing I did notice is that when sizing I did it when the barrel was fouled. The bullet goes in pretty easy when clean and gets harder to install the more times I shoot it. For this reason i'll shoot 5 max and then clean it at the range. I am a hunter and have never shot more then twice at an animal. BTW I did chronograph 5 shots with 92.5 grains (w) and the Parker 250 bullets. They shot pretty consistently at 2500-2550 f/s in a one inch group. As expected the MV increased slightly with each shot.

 

[Ninering62]

I would think shooting a spin jag out of your old barrel didn’t help it any.

I once shot an alum ramrod downrange out of an Omega. It didn’t hurt the accuracy at all. Perhaps I should have just stuck with shooting the spin jag & not the whole ramrod.