Opinions, please: will this scope do as a backup?

[Mountain Man]

Well, since I've not been very confident in my Burris Fullfield II for some time, and since I've ruled out about every other cause of such poor groups (2.5" to 4"), I think I need to take steps to verify that that it's the scope or rule that problem out, too. I think Burris is a good brand, but I can hardly imagine it being anything other than the scope at this point. And, I guess even the Sightrons, Leupolds, and others conk out on occasion.

I looked at a bore sight/collumnator (sp?), but didn't see any very good way to index it radially within the bore with any real accuracy (after all, we're talking about tenths and hundredths of a degree of difference here). I called Burris, they said it would be about a two week turnaround time. Since there are only three weekends between now and ML season, that makes me nervous, ESPECIALLY if Burris were to send it back saying that the scope was fine all along! Then I'd have to start figuring out why the gun won't do better than 3" groups anymore.

Anyway, I figured if I was going to spend $37 to overnight the scope to Burris, I might as well spend a little more, buy a new scope of a lesser quality than I would use for my primary scope, mount it and see if things come back together. So, I paid $79.95 plus tax for a Bushnell Banner 3-9 x 40mm. If things come back together, then I can send the Fullfield back to Burris and go ahead and sight in with the Bushnell until the Burris gets back. I got a second set of rings that will work with the Warne Maxima quick release bases, so when the Burris gets back (if it is bad), I can leave the Bushnell sighted in and go back to work on the Burris. If the Burris isn't bad, I guess I've just got a backup scope.

Here's my question for you before I go and mar up the finish on the Busnell by putting it in rings: do you think a Busnell Banner 3-9 x 40mm has enough likelihood of holding up to 10ML loads to be worth spending the $87.00 on? If you think it's likely to croak after a couple dozen shots, I'll just return it and take the risk that I won't get the Burris back before season. I sure wouldn't mind having a backup I can always slap on the gun, though, even if it's not up to par with the Burris, or a Leupold, Zeiss, or Sightron. It would just be for getting by on until the Burris could be repaired. And, no, I can't afford a second high-dollar scope like Leupold, Burris, Zeiss, Nikon, Sightron, etc.

So, in all honesty, what would you recommend? Keep the Bushnell Banner or return it?

 

[schoolmaster]

Mountain man do you have the option of shooting iron sights on the rifle. I believe I would try the irons while the scope is being evaluated. I don't believe the cheaper Scopes will hold up on the savage. I believe you will just throw good money after bad. The cheaper scopes certainly didn't hold up on various slug guns I have used.

 

[Mountain Man]

Not arguing, just asking: Do you really think that using open sights I'll be able to bring in groups at one hundred yards that are enough below 3" to 4" that I'll be able to say, "Yep, that scope was bad?" I think I'm a fair shot with a rifle, but I've only rarely lined up a pair of iron sights in the last ten years. I've even removed the ones that were on my 10ML. I can put them back on, but that gives you an idea of how much I use them.

 

[Doohan]

Have you checked and cleaned your breech plug lately? Installed a new ventliner? This MAY fix your problem...

 

[schoolmaster]

You might surprise yourself at how accurate you are with the irons. If you shoot groups that equal the scope then the chances are that the scope was bad. If you have shot any 50 yard groups with the scope then try the irons at that range. My 58 year old eyes are not the best but I have shot 3 to 4 inch groups at 100 yards with the right target. I use an 8 inch solid black circle on a white background and hold at 6 o'clock making a figure 8 out of the front sight and the circle. With careful holding and squeezing it can be done.

 

[dwhunter]

Get rid of the Bushnell. I think Doohan in on the right track asking about your breech plug being dirty. Also what powder/bullet combo with weights are you using? Have you gotten good groups before using this combo. If you have it points back to the breech plug.

 

[Mountain Man]

I got good groups out of the gun with the first 40 shots or so out of the box. Things fell apart, and after about 20 more shots I cleaned the breech plug and replaced the vent liner. Next 12 shots still grouped badly, and then I realized my action was not tight and barrel not floated due to a stripped out allen head on the rear action screw. Replaced that, and the next three groups (shots 13-21 since cleaning the breech plug) were good.

Then, things fell apart again. Shot for three hours on Saturday, using loads and components that had shot consistently to 1.3 and 1.4 inches before, but was getting 3" to 4" groups now. Six groups, or shots 22-40 since cleaning the breech plug.

Would the breech plug really foul after only 20 shots, and would that amount of fouling cause that much decay in accuracy? :shock:

 

[dwhunter]

I got good groups out of the gun with the first 40 shots or so out of the box. Things fell apart, and after about 20 more shots I cleaned the breech plug and replaced the vent liner. Next 12 shots still grouped badly, and then I realized my action was not tight and barrel not floated due to a stripped out allen head on the rear action screw. Replaced that, and the next three groups (shots 13-21 since cleaning the breech plug) were good.

Then, things fell apart again. Shot for three hours on Saturday, using loads and components that had shot consistently to 1.3 and 1.4 inches before, but was getting 3" to 4" groups now. Six groups, or shots 22-40 since cleaning the breech plug.

Would the breech plug really foul after only 20 shots, and would that amount of fouling cause that much decay in accuracy? :shock: :
(

According to what I've seen in my Savages yes I think the breech plug is dirty. I clean mine every 20 or so shots. I also would use RW's long life vent liners if your not already.

 

[Mountain Man]

Problem solved. See "diry breechplug" thread.