Utah bans trail cameras

[deermanok]

I was just reading about this. Utah has banned the use of trail cameras for the 2022 season.
Their reason is that it gives hunters an unfair advantage and takes away from the idea of fair chase in hunting.
There's a lot of high tech stuff today. Night vision scopes, long range rifles and ammunition.
Hunters do have an advantage today with all the gadgets that weren't available when I started hunting nearly 50 years ago. Is it a bad thing?
I'm pretty low tech myself and am happy with that.
The thrill of the hunt and the idea of fair chase to me may not be the same idea for someone else?

 

[Jitterbug]

Interesting, for sure!

I don’t use trail cameras (nor do I hunt Utah), so it won’t affect me personally, at this point.

I kind of like the idea, but I have to think that it will be hard for the Game Wardens to enforce. It might end up being a case of “keeping the honest folks honest.” I’ll bet there are plenty of poachers who will just use cheaper, “sacrificial“ cameras.

If I were in UT, and had just spent a fortune on trail cameras, I’d probably be pretty unhappy.

 

[SDK]

From what I understand, they have gotten more problematic with the advent of the cellular cams that give practically real time photo information. Poachers are using them, and hunters are setting them up as remote cameras around them while actively hunting.

 

[Jitterbug]

From what I understand, they have gotten more problematic with the advent of the cellular cams that give practically real time photo information. Poachers are using them, and hunters are setting them up as remote cameras around them while actively hunting.

That makes sense!

I wouldn’t have thought of that… even though I know folks who have equipment of that sort!

 

[SDK]

Most of us are ethical, so things like that don’t even occur to us. It’s always the few cheaters who ruin things.

I want to pick up a couple of the cellular cams myself for off-season scouting, but only so I don’t have to haul my butt out in the freezing New England cold, just to change SD cards.

 

[toytruck]

I just bought two Bushnell No Glow cameras on sale from Natchez last month. This will be my first attempt to use cameras, like SDK I just would like to see what's moving where I hunt. I'm gonna use them around my house for now to get used to them. I have something using my yard to make deposits would like to know what....I might have a surprise for them.

 

[SDK]

Let me know how they work out. I will try and post some pics when I get mine up and running…

 

[fishhawk2700]

Good for Utah. I wish they would ban them here in MI. IMO, they are just like bait. Just one step closer to "getting" as opposed putting your time in learning about the animal you are "hunting".
The cell connected trail cams to me are no different the drones. Real-time video of a animal you are hunting. Drones are illegal here.

The aspect of trail cams that really pisses me off is that some outfitters use the pics to sell specific stands where certain trophy animals have been photographed. The hunter that maybe saves up for "the hunt of a lifetime" can't afford the extra cash for a prime stand. So much for fair chase.

 

[retrieverman]

Banning trail cams is just political grandstanding and is totally unenforceable.

 

[52Bore]

Never used one, being Aug-Dec, rule makes sense to me..

 

[Treedancer]

Mine is used purely for entertainment
Love to get those pictures
I don't care if it's a buck or a chickadee

 

[retrieverman]

Mine is used purely for entertainment
Love to get those pictures
I don't care if it's a buck or a chickadee

I run at least 7 game cameras year around (on my own property), and at this point in my hunting life, I get about as much enjoyment out of checking cameras as I do actually hunting. I get to see things that I would never get to see without them.

I will say this publicly and definitively. If Texas and/or Oklahoma attempt to ban cameras, I will be an outlaw. I only hunt my own places and generally spend about a grand a year in licenses to maybe kill one buck, and if I want to use cameras, I’m going to and quite frankly don’t think the local law dawgs can stop me.

 

[Idaholewis]

Good for Utah, As i’ve said before, Cellular Trail Cams that send Real time photos to your Phone, Ipad Etc. should be Banned. This is a Ridiculously unfair advantage over Game Animals. There are guy’s using these to monitor and Pattern Deer from OTHER States, They get enough Data, Jump in and Drive to another State and Hunt a Certain Buck that they have been seeing at a Certain time on their Camera. Can ANYONE here say this is FAIR CHASE? Its NOT!! LEARN HOW TO HUNT, and Put your time in, Don’t cheat the Game

I hope ALL states Follow suit with Utah, I would sign a Petition in a Rapid Heartbeat

 

[phalanx]

Well, Mr.. Lewis, while I have great respect for the knowledge and skills you have shown and shared for the use in sidelock firearms, I STRONGLY disagree with your opinion and am happy you are not one of my VA state representatives. I am 65 years old and have been hunting nearly my entire life and I do know how to hunt and believe in FAIR CHASE. I run about 40 cell cams (OMG, the horror) all year long at my own expense on property that is over 150 miles from where I live for the enjoyment of myself and 5 of my friends. All of us believe in FAIR CHASE and I cannot think of one instance in the 15 or more years that I have been using cell/trail cameras where one of us was able to kill a deer or turkey by saying, "Gee I'll go hunt this location because I've seen the "big dog" on Camera X." It doesn't work like that in fair chase and you know it, no guarantee that deer will ever walk by that cam again. We have gone years without killing ANYTHING on that property, despite having many beautiful pics of wildlife, trespassers, farmers doing their thing and making timelapse pics as the crops grow, etc.. IT IS SIMPLY ENJOYABLE TO US. This is what's partly wrong with our country, lets BAN something others enjoy because you don't like it. I (we) are not harming a damn thing and I am learning new things just from the pics. You would never hear me say, we should ban the making of ones own bullets which is something you obviously enjoy. If you don't like the technology then don't use it but to advocate the banning of it in every state is a bit narrow minded, especially if you have never used it and don't know the environment that I hunt in. My state also uses dogs to hunt with, not my thing but I surely don't advocate against it, as I can see that in many of the swamps hunted in VA would not be successful without the use of dogs. How about learning to live with each other.

Just my $.02.
John

 

[Idaholewis]

Like I’ve said before as well, These threads really should be titled “How to Flush out the Guy’s that hunt over Bait, and use Cell phone Trail Cams”

Here is Forum member retrieverman, He was able to Pattern this Buck from 500 Miles away, and ultimately killed him because of it.

In 2015, I had a buck so patterned I drove 500 miles just to make one evening hunt, and I killed the buck.

 

[Idaholewis]

All of us believe in FAIR CHASE and I cannot think of one instance in the 15 or more years that I have been using cell/trail cameras where one of us was able to kill a deer or turkey by saying, "Gee I'll go hunt this location because I've seen the "big dog" on Camera X."

@phalanx Scroll down and read post #9 in this thread
https://www.modernmuzzleloader.com/threads/before-trail-cams.39718/

 

[rgell1017]

Well, Mr.. Lewis, while I have great respect for the knowledge and skills you have shown and shared for the use in sidelock firearms, I STRONGLY disagree with your opinion and am happy you are not one of my VA state representatives. I am 65 years old and have been hunting nearly my entire life and I do know how to hunt and believe in FAIR CHASE. I run about 40 cell cams (OMG, the horror) all year long at my own expense on property that is over 150 miles from where I live for the enjoyment of myself and 5 of my friends. All of us believe in FAIR CHASE and I cannot think of one instance in the 15 or more years that I have been using cell/trail cameras where one of us was able to kill a deer or turkey by saying, "Gee I'll go hunt this location because I've seen the "big dog" on Camera X." It doesn't work like that in fair chase and you know it, no guarantee that deer will ever walk by that cam again. We have gone years without killing ANYTHING on that property, despite having many beautiful pics of wildlife, trespassers, farmers doing their thing and making timelapse pics as the crops grow, etc.. IT IS SIMPLY ENJOYABLE TO US. This is what's partly wrong with our country, lets BAN something others enjoy because you don't like it. I (we) are not harming a damn thing and I am learning new things just from the pics. You would never hear me say, we should ban the making of ones own bullets which is something you obviously enjoy. If you don't like the technology then don't use it but to advocate the banning of it in every state is a bit narrow minded, especially if you have never used it and don't know the environment that I hunt in. My state also uses dogs to hunt with, not my thing but I surely don't advocate against it, as I can see that in many of the swamps hunted in VA would not be successful without the use of dogs. How about learning to live with each other.

Just my $.02.
John

I totally agree with you and the Texas statement I use 7-8 card cameras my hunting partner maybe same I also tried one of the forbidden cell cameras and will continue to as long as I want to , I enjoy seeing animals and it's interesting before season when bucks run together seeing several to maybe a dozen all ages and sizes then they do what bucks do separate and disappear like the interesting animals they are and after season I like to see what made it through or just came back they do relocate. This trail camera controversy reminds me of when compound bow was invented it's unfair all the deer will be killed cheating. Then the awful cheating unfair inline same thing terrible. Don't forget the evil people who are using smokeless heaven forbid now I know all the deer will die BS stop whining and fighting antis love this Crap join together and fight for the future. CWD and antis are the threat and problems not trail cameras not X Bows , In lines smokeless I forgot the unfair scope on a muzzleloader I had a very not so good with an idiot dressed in buckskin on a WMA about my first year introduction MK85 I still remember about what I told him but try not to use that terminology any more. Stop fighting and join together

 

[MTY]

That some people are butt heads does not mean the state should regulate the most mundane details of my life. This applies to more than game cameras.
Game cameras are not the issue, butt heads are. It used to be quite common for idiots to drive the logging roads of Idaho all night while bugling. Stop & bugle, stop & bugle. A good response would lead to phone calls to buddies who then would surround the area at day break. Should this have lead to outlawing elk bugles? For most of our issues, better parenting is the answer, not a rush to imitate CA, WA, or NY.

 

[Fire Hawk]

I am a Utah resident. I was surveyed by the DWR about these changes while they were surveying hunters. My thought is that they are getting out of hand and needed some regulation. That said, I really don't know how they will be able to regulate their use. Seems a difficult issue with the vast expanses of wild country one who wanted to "skirt" the law could be in and use a camera. I am ultimately on the fence about this issue, leaning toward the support of it, but can certainly see why this change can lead to other more aggressive changes.

By the way, one caveat is private land owners have the ability to use them in monitoring their property and livestock. And...no one will know how they use them otherwise. And it is important to understand that they are outlawed during any of the big game hunting seasons, thus the August 1-January 31 moratorium.

This said, I harvested a large bull elk this year. In prepping for my hunt, a friend put out several trail cams as they were prepping to guide an out of state hunter who had purchased a special hunt voucher. Seeing some of those photos/videos were so awesome in prepping for my hunt. Gave me an idea, beyond the days I spent out there in the field scouting, of the bull quality and some of their natural patterns. The bull we killed, we don't think was ever on one of our trail cams, but we sure did get some cool footage of others.

In the same RAC and Wildlife Board meetings, they unanimously passed the motion to scale back on muzzleloader technology again. Used to be that we couldn't use a magnifying scope at all during Muzzleloading season. About 6 years they removed that rule and have allowed powered scopes. It sure didn't take long for them to see the writing on the wall that the Muzzleloader season had essentially just become a "single shot rifle" season. Especially with the recent surge in "long range muzzleloader availability".

I am torn with this change back. Where I much preferred the "old way" with using my rifle with a peep sight etc., the older I get, the more I have appreciated the help of using a magnifying scope. Sure made it easier on my eyes.

I just got my CVA Accura MR-X for Christmas and specifically chose the option with the rail for a scope to be installed, rather than the NW edition. Spent money I didn't need to it appears. The rings are already holding my Burris Signature scope on that rifle. Although it hasn't been shot, they could not take back the rings or the rifle in exchange for the NW edition. And 209 Primers would likely still be allowed as they were originally as well.

So...yesterday I ordered a new peep sight/rail combination and a front sight (marble, green fiber) for my new CVA so that I have them in time for the hunting season. Hope to find the right combination of bullet/powder etc. soon, and plan to leave the scope on my rifle until I hear that the changes are official for this September season. But I won't know until June officially, so I will shoot and prep a lot in the meantime. Personally, I think that they will have to give a grace period of one more season to give hunters time to round up the needed parts to make their rifles compliant. In today's inventory state, it would be really hard to round up those parts if only given a couple of months to get them. Shoot, some back orders from Williams Sight and others are stating 5-7 months. Either way, both my Knight Wolverine and my CVA Accura will be set up to shoot either way. Better safe than sorry.

Selfishly, I hope it eliminates some of the pressure during ML deer season I have seen increase each year. I moved toward Archery just so that I could more easily have some public ground to myself on occasion. But muzzleloader season has always been my favorite. There is just something about being in the mountains in late September, that speaks to my soul.

FH

 

[Fire Hawk]

That some people are butt heads does not mean the state should regulate the most mundane details of my life. This applies to more than game cameras.
Game cameras are not the issue, butt heads are. It used to be quite common for idiots to drive the logging roads of Idaho all night while bugling. Stop & bugle, stop & bugle. A good response would lead to phone calls to buddies who then would surround the area at day break. Should this have lead to outlawing elk bugles? For most of our issues, better parenting is the answer, not a rush to imitate CA, WA, or NY.

AMEN!!!!