Woodman arms load development. The goal

[Samoset]

I want to Apologize for Pushing Smokeless Powder & especially the VV N110. Smokeless is Not for Everyone. I Forget sometimes that some people Don't Reload for Centerfire Cartridges. I knew a Smokeless Muzzleloader Builder that wouldn't Sell to someone that didn't Reload Centerfire Cartridges. There is a Reason that Woodman Arms Doesn't List N110 in their Manual because it is Faster Burning & Requires a lot less Quantity. Savage Arms did this with their "Book Loads" for their .50 Cal 10ML-II. They Wanted Powders that used approximately the Same 40 Grs +/-. If you aren't Comfortable & Don't have someone experienced Locally to Guide you Please either recruit them or stick to Blackpower Subs. NO DISTRACTIONS during the Reloading Process & WITNESS MARKS on All Ramrods. SAFETY FIRST

No need to apologize, I sincerely appreciate my safety and understand the severity and seriousness of the circumstances. I’m taking my time doing my research and not rushing into anything

 

[rangerod]

Sorry Samoset, but that's where I disagree. I own many rifles, rimfire, centerfire, and muzzleloaders. My way is shoot them clean them. That's the way my father taught me. He told me your gun will take care of you if you take care of it. If I ever
have the privilege of owning a Woodman Patriot, I would keep it as clean as a whistle! Hope I didn't offend you in any way, but it was the way I was taught and if I didn't, I would get a foot in my butt!

Same here. I just can't stand to leave the bore dirty after a range session.

 

[MrTom]

No need to apologize, I sincerely appreciate my safety and understand the severity and seriousness of the circumstances. I’m taking my time doing my research and not rushing into anything

And you'll be fine. Happy trigger pulling!

 

[Decay]

Samoset: I don’t think you want that scale. It measures in grams. You want a scale that measures in GRAINS

 

[LBAhunter]

No need to apologize, I sincerely appreciate my safety and understand the severity and seriousness of the circumstances. I’m taking my time doing my research and not rushing into anything

 

[LBAhunter]

I want to Apologize for Pushing Smokeless Powder & especially the VV N110. Smokeless is Not for Everyone. I Forget sometimes that some people Don't Reload for Centerfire Cartridges. I knew a Smokeless Muzzleloader Builder that wouldn't Sell to someone that didn't Reload Centerfire Cartridges. There is a Reason that Woodman Arms Doesn't List N110 in their Manual because it is Faster Burning & Requires a lot less Quantity. Savage Arms did this with their "Book Loads" for their .50 Cal 10ML-II. They Wanted Powders that used approximately the Same 40 Grs +/-. If you aren't Comfortable & Don't have someone experienced Locally to Guide you Please either recruit them or stick to Blackpower Subs. NO DISTRACTIONS during the Reloading Process & WITNESS MARKS on All Ramrods. SAFETY FIRST

Like me, just sharing your experiences.

 

[Samoset]

Samoset: I don’t think you want that scale. It measures in grams. You want a scale that measures in GRAINS

No worries given the sincerity expressed about VV N110 and how critical proper measures and safety procedures are.

I’ve started looking for a proper reloading scale.

I do believe however the one I posted above measures in grains as well.

I am open to suggestions on scales, tools and methods on measuring VV N110.

As If I commit to four pounds of the stuff it’s likely going to be the only thing I’m loading.

I’m in no hurry. I need to check the places I intend to hunt to insure in-fact I can load smokeless in all of them.

Thanks again for everyone’s advice

 

[LBAhunter]

No worries given the sincerity expressed about VV N110 and how critical proper measures and safety procedures are.

I’ve started looking for a proper reloading scale.

I do believe however the one I posted above measures in grains as well.

I am open to suggestions on scales, tools and methods on measuring VV N110.

As If I commit to four pounds of the stuff it’s likely going to be the only thing I’m loading.

I’m in no hurry. I need to check the places I intend to hunt to insure in-fact I can load smokeless in all of them.

Thanks again for everyone’s advice

Read and research. Ask questions from trusted sources. Just take your time. Most of all, enjoy!!

 

[billyboy*]

Like me, just sharing your experiences.

Agreed, Just Trying to Help a Fellow Muzzleloader Shorten the Learning Curve & Do it with:
Less Expense
Less Powder per Charge
Cleaner Shooting
Less Cleaning, None Required During the Season
Faster Velocity
Flatter Shooting
Less Recoil, Not Damage your Shoulder or Rattle your Teeth Loose

Good Luck with your Endeavors

 

[LBAhunter]

Agreed, Just Trying to Help a Fellow Muzzleloader Shorten the Learning Curve & Do it with:
Less Expense
Less Powder per Charge
Cleaner Shooting
Less Cleaning, None Required During the Season
Faster Velocity
Flatter Shooting
Less Recoil, Not Damage your Shoulder or Rattle your Teeth Loose

Good Luck with your Endeavors

 

[LBAhunter]

No worries given the sincerity expressed about VV N110 and how critical proper measures and safety procedures are.

I’ve started looking for a proper reloading scale.

I do believe however the one I posted above measures in grains as well.

I am open to suggestions on scales, tools and methods on measuring VV N110.

As If I commit to four pounds of the stuff it’s likely going to be the only thing I’m loading.

I’m in no hurry. I need to check the places I intend to hunt to insure in-fact I can load smokeless in all of them.

Thanks again for everyone’s advice

Always weigh smokeless powder. I use a Lyman 1200 DPS electric scale. Don't try to Google it. It's older than both my boys' ages added together. Lots of good products to weigh smokeless/BH209 powder. Depends on how much you want to spend. (expensive) If you like me, lazy, get a electronic scale, fill with powder, calibrate,, press a few buttons and it dispenses powder. (cheap) beam scales. Just as effective, just slow. You will have to get a trickler to add the final kernels of powder. My advice spend the money, get a electronic scale.

 

[Samoset]

Agreed, Just Trying to Help a Fellow Muzzleloader Shorten the Learning Curve & Do it with:
Less Expense
Less Powder per Charge
Cleaner Shooting
Less Cleaning, None Required During the Season
Faster Velocity
Flatter Shooting
Less Recoil, Not Damage your Shoulder or Rattle your Teeth Loose

Good Luck with your Endeavors

Sincerely appreciated,

 

[Decay]

When I get my Patriot I believe N110 will be my powder of choice, along with the lightest bullet i can find that shoots great. I want minimal recoil. Knight 170 gr RedHots, or Woodman all copper, Barnes 195gr, or a new bullet I'll cast and powder coat at around 180 grains.

 

[LBAhunter]

When I get my Patriot I believe N110 will be my powder of choice, along with the lightest bullet i can find that shoots great. I want minimal recoil. Knight 170 gr RedHots, or Woodman all copper, Barnes 195gr, or a new bullet I'll cast and powder coat at around 180 grains.

I wouldn't overlook the Barnes 10mm 155gr TAC-XP. Be worth a try.

 

[Samoset]

When I get my Patriot I believe N110 will be my powder of choice, along with the lightest bullet i can find that shoots great. I want minimal recoil. Knight 170 gr RedHots, or Woodman all copper, Barnes 195gr, or a new bullet I'll cast and powder coat at around 180 grains.

I was looking at woodmans 175 & 195 gr all copper hallows this morning myself as I was concerned the 225gr startips I currently have may be a bit to heavy for N110,

Any insight on this would be appreciated.

 

[billyboy*]

Please see Below if you Don't Believe the Lightweight Woodman Patriot Doesn't Have HEAVY RECOIL !!!

Mr. Tom wrote:
I ran Ma up to the daughter's this morning early so she could spend a few days during the daughter's birthday. I came home, and loaded up the Optima pistol and the Patriot and hit the road again for the range. When I arrived there was another person looking to set up but seemed unsure of what was proper etiquette. We chatted a bit as I explained the club rules, then started to set out the Patriot to shoot some slightly heavier IMR loads. 56.5 grains of 4198 to be exact, under a 225 grain Fury Star tip in a blue sabot.

The guy took interest in the gun right off and as I loaded, I explained it was smokeless powder and he was like... hey man that's dangerous in a smoker. I got him reassured then he and I both set off to punch paper, alternating shots between us. After 5 shots I was fairly well impressed and beginning to think I'll try the 57 grains of IMR4198 that Mountain Monkey seems to be impressed with but would have to come home and weight some charges up. I had one charge of 56'5 left and just got the gun charged when this fella asked about shooting the gun. I was happy with what the paper told me so I said "sure". Now, this guy was messing with a .264 Winnie. He seemed to handle that recoil well. One shot with the .45 Patriot. When he set the rifle back in the cradle of the rest and looked up at me, it wasn't the " WOW, does this thing kick" that got my attention, it was the 3/4" semi-circle gash that was just getting ready to spill.

I've seen bleeders and I have seen "bleeders" and I wasn't quite certain which category this dude fell in, but it was for certain he was bleeding. I helped him pack his goodies, then he left for the er. I gave him one of my tackle cards with my phone # on it and he said he'd call later after seeing the ER docs. He called just a while ago. 11 stitches to close that gaping crater. Wow. He wasn't upset at all but will miss a day or so of work. He was actually chuckling about how that "pretty rifle bit his ass", quote, unquote. We're going to meet for coffee Saturday. I just hope now that he doesn't hate me. lol

Please Don't be "That Guy"!

 

[MrTom]

Billyboy,

I can assure you that I do not shoot that load anymore. The 225's do what I need from them at 56 grains and I keep in mind that while hunting I need one shot so I'm not being beat up.

The fella that got the bite and I have done coffee a couple times since than to yack about hunting and fishing. He's been over to the shop and bought some tackle. The doc's did a bang-up job on his cut, its barely noticable.

Also, I have shot my pet 77 grain by weight BH209 charge with the 200 grain XTP in a light blue sabot 5 times in that Patriot and have zero intentions of shooting number six. For those that think that BH209 does not come with recoil, think again. This charge does well in my V2 Accura with a 250 grain Barnes XPB, but its a heavier gun and the recoil signature is different than with a .45 cal that's much lighter.

 

[LBAhunter]

I was looking at woodmans 175 & 195 gr all copper hallows this morning myself as I was concerned the 225gr startips I currently have may be a bit to heavy for N110,

Any insight on this would be appreciated.

N110 is good for up to =/>250gr bullets. N110 would be a very good choice for those 3 bullets weights.

 

[LBAhunter]

Billyboy,

I can assure you that I do not shoot that load anymore. The 225's do what I need from them at 56 grains and I keep in mind that while hunting I need one shot so I'm not being beat up.

The fella that got the bite and I have done coffee a couple times since than to yack about hunting and fishing. He's been over to the shop and bought some tackle. The doc's did a bang-up job on his cut, its barely noticable.

Also, I have shot my pet 77 grain by weight BH209 charge with the 200 grain XTP in a light blue sabot 5 times in that Patriot and have zero intentions of shooting number six. For those that think that BH209 does not come with recoil, think again. This charge does well in my V2 Accura with a 250 grain Barnes XPB, but its a heavier gun and the recoil signature is different than with a .45 cal that's much lighter.

MrTom,
Have you tried any N110 yet?

 

[MrTom]

I knew where a jug was locally and went to grab it and it had been bought. Since then I have searched high and low to no avail. I deal with a gun shop in Superior, Wisconsin and they were going to order five pounds with my name on two of the pounds but they have called and let me know that as yet, they cannot find any at a reasonable cost. They're still looking.

A friend has some N110 and he and I worked out a trade for some fishing gear. I gave him the lane's tubes and he put 10, 30 grain charge, 10, 31 grain charges and 10, 32 grain charges together for me. I split each of the three weights into three s and shot each weight with 195 grain Expander, 200 grain XTPs and 225 grain Furys. I still have one of each charge weight. Light recoil and clean. I didn't have access to a chrono but I think that even the 32 grain charge sent to three bullets down range a touch slower than the IMR 4198 at 56 grains, but that's based on the ear.... time from ignition to bullet on target.

I'm still on a hunt but also have plenty of the IMR so I'm not desperate. I can order online but I loathe that friggin hazmat and have a tough time imagining me suck up that extra expense just to soothe the government's lack of balm to its own ass. I have plenty of playthings until I find a jug but I really do like shooting the N110 since its well withing the bullet weight parameters that I shoot with.