HELP!

[Grizz]

Well,the new DISC Extreme came last evening. So, I hit the town today looking for something to make holes with. What I came up with was a box of 370gr.TC Maxi Balls, a box of 777 pellets & some 777 primers. Here is the target I shot with 100gr of 777 and the above mentioned Maxis. The first shot went just above center in the bull. Right where it should be. The second shot is clipping the bottom of the bull and #3 is just below that. I wasn't too concerned with the big group as I was shooting off my cross sticks at 25yds. The problem came with shots 4 & 5! They are the ones at the top of the cardboard and perfict key holes! CRAP! I need some guidance here guys. I did notice the Maxi Balls didn't have much of a bite on the rifling. The first one nearly dropped in once it was started. I didn't clean any between shots either. So what is a feller supposed to do?

 

[Swampman]

Find some bullets with sabots. Wipe the bore with a Windex patch between shots. Lose the pellets.

 

[txhunter58]

You definately need to trry swabbing between shots, that may be your main trouble. A wet patch both sides followed by a dry patch, both sides and I bet you will tighten up.

You may also need to get some tighter bullets. Maxiballs almost drop down my knight KRB too and I would be worried if I hunted with them that they might come off the powder. Some people will wrap loose bullets in teflon tape to get them to tighten up in the bore, but I have never tried it.

 

[frontier gander]

may want to try a wonder wad.

 

[Underclocked]

If you want to shoot big hunks of lead, slug that bore and order some Bull Shop conicals in the proper diameter (460 MT NEx should be a good choice). Maxi's were designed for a longer, slower twist and have minimal bullet to bore contact.

 

[Busta]

Pellets and slip-fit conicals do not go together, never have, never will. They can also be dangerous since pellets need a good seal for instant ignition, and your second pellet might not be kicking in until the bullet is half way down the bore. IMO, those 370's are not a good choice for any rifle, especially a 1:28 Knight.

If you want to shoot a slip fit conical, get some 460 grain No Excuses or Bullshop's sized to .503", 70 to 80 grains of 777 FFG or FFFG LOOSE POWDER and you will be in business.

If you want to shoot a saboted bullets, your 777 pellets should be fine. You just have the wrong elements. Get some 250 to 300 grain saboted bullets, Shockwaves/SST's or whatever you like.

I am surprised you got the first three to shoot to be honest with you. My guess is that your rifling twist is too fast for those bullets, they probably were not upsetting (bellying out into the rifling) until your bore got dirty, by then you were either leaded up or overstabilizing them with that 100 grain charge.

You might be able to shoot the 370s with about 60 to 70 grains of loose powder.

You have one of the best inlines ever built IMO, you just need to feed it the right powder and bullets and you will see just how accurate they really can be.

Did your Maxi's have lube in the grooves?

 

[Grizz]

I really didn't want the pellets. But, They didn't have loose 777 there. I thought about Pyrodex, but wanted to stay with 777 if I could. They had Jim Shocky's Gold there, but I knew nothing about it, so I opted for the 777 pellets.

I would bet just about anything a saboted bullet would help a bunch, but I want to use this rifle in Colorado,so I figured I would just go ahead and start with the full bore bullets. I was wondering about custom cast bullets. I will look into the Bull Shop brand. Anyone have a link?

In a hunting situation, do you carry a few wet patches with you for a swab between shots? Or is this just to qualify a load?

I have the 5 lead/saboted bullets that came with the gun yet. If I get a chance tomorrow I will try them with a swab between shots. Just to see what she does. I could shoot anything here in PA for the general deer or early blackpowder season, but want to tune her up for Colorado.

 

[Grouse]

Grizz, What part of PA are you from?

 

[Grizz]

OK now we are getting somewhere. Thanks Busta, I never knew there was a relationship between the bullet and the type of charge used. I figured the pellets were just a conveniance thing. Now I can rearrange my thinking to get where I want to go. I guess I will go ahead and get some Shock Waves or similar to finish up my box of pellets. I will have to hunt up some different conicals and loose powder to tune her up that way. Anyone have an opinion of the Great Plains bullet in a Knight?

 

[Grizz]

I'm from between Punxsutawney and Brookville.

 

[Grouse]

How far from Rural Valley? I believe you are real close. I can hook you up with some bullets and powder if you want to meet.

 

[b_vanfossen]

wow Grouse- that's a nice gesture!

 

[Busta]

OK now we are getting somewhere. Thanks Busta, I never knew there was a relationship between the bullet and the type of charge used. I figured the pellets were just a conveniance thing. Now I can rearrange my thinking to get where I want to go. I guess I will go ahead and get some Shock Waves or similar to finish up my box of pellets. I will have to hunt up some different conicals and loose powder to tune her up that way. Anyone have an opinion of the Great Plains bullet in a Knight?

Grizz,

If you are wanting to go Elk hunting in Colorado, get some 460 Bullshop or No Excuses in .503", 80 grains to 90 grains 777 loose powder. Kills Elk DEAD. You can actually run 100 or 110 grains of powder if your rifle and SHOULDER likes it. :shock: Not really that bad, but 80 grains of powder will kill them if you use a good bullet and put it where it needs to go. The Colorado rules for Muzzleloader Season states that for Elk you need (not exact wording, but you will get the idea) .50 caliber or larger, single barrel, iron sights (fiber optics and peeps ok, no scopes), loose Black Powder or BP Substitute, bullets can be no longer than twice the diameter (.50 cal = .500" x 2 = 1.00"), 209 primers are legal.

The .503" cal 460 grain No Excuses/Bullshops come in real close to .970" in length. Another good shooting bullet is the 350 gr Hornady FPB, and by all reports this past year, they performed excellent on Elk and Deer. The FPB's will either need the tip removed or cut flush at the top of the bullet to come in under the 1.00" length rule for Colorado.

I personally wouldn't waste my money on the Great Plains, too much hollow point and hollow base in all lead makes for an explosive bullet when they hit something hard like Elk bone. You want penetration when it comes to shooting Elk, their bone mass is probably at leeast 4 to 5 times that of even a large Whitetail.

I have a torture test, I put bullets through before I even consider hunting with them, I'll post a few for you to ponder. This may, or may not have any real world effect on what an actual bullet will do on bone and tissue, but it does show me the integrity of the bullet when stressed to the limit. Sorry I don't have a pic of the 460 in Photobucket. I just need to take a pic of it an post it, but I have a pic of a 430 grain White conical that looks almost identical I will post. I will try to dig up the 460 and take a pic, I am sure it is in my junk somewheres.

385 grain Great Plains, FAILED.

348 grain PowerBelt, FAILED.

350 grain Hornady FPB, PASSED.

White 430 grain Super Slug, PASSED easily. This is the same kind of bullet that killed the elk in my avatar, with a mere 80 grains 777 FFFG. The 460 gr No Excuses/Bullshop look very much like this one, only a little better.

Some 300 gr SST's for comparison, PASSED.

Hornady .452" 300 grain XTP/MAG, PASSED.

 

[frontier gander]

348gr Aerotip is a good shootin elk bullet with 80gr RS.

I like the 405 the best when it comes to the bigger powerbelt.

 

[Swampman]

Some excellent info here

Thanks Busta!

 

[greatbasin]

370 gr. maxiballs shoot well in every GM barrel I've ever tried, but I don't use pellets so I would bet that those are at the root of your problem...the slip to fit issue is no worry because the lead will push into the rifling on ignition.
Try those the Maxiballs again with either real BP or Pyrodex Select and I'll bet it's problem solved. Just don't push 'em faster than about 1400 fps. or you'll have a new, different problem.
BTW, the only keyhole shots I've ever fired were from the skirts sticking on 348 gr. Powerbelts.

 

[Swampman]

the slip to fit issue is no worry

If the bullet slips toward the muzzle before you pull the trigger, the barrel will rupture when you pull the trigger.

 

[Grizz]

Hey Grouse, I am quite familiar with Rural Valley. I used to fish Keystone lake ALOT! Back in the 80s when the bass fishing was great in there. I shot trap at a little club in Rural Valley too a few years ago. My in-laws are from Smicksburg and my wife went to Dayton school and worked at the Cut Rate in Plumbville. I would love to hook up and have a howdy. I am expected at my mother's tomorrow though. Rats. We should get together for sure. Maybe burn a little powder once I get this thing working good. Lord knows I can use a few pointers.

You all have been a huge help. I see I went at this in a poor fashion. I need to get things straightend out so I can start enjoying this rifle. I might just carry it coyote hunting the rest of the winter. I see there are a BUNCH of different sabots available now. Is there anything I should be careful of in buying them? I think I will burn up the rest of these pellets under those while I run down some other conicals and powder.

 

[Okie Hog]

Swab between shots if you are not already doing it, reduce your powder load to about 80 grains of 777 and work up. Also use an bore button.

 

[greatbasin]

the slip to fit issue is no worry

If the bullet slips toward the muzzle before you pull the trigger, the barrel will rupture when you pull the trigger.

Swampman, I was referring to accuracy. There's a big difference between slip to fit and slip to fall out...the second is definitely a safety concern. As a general rule I foul my barrel before shooting conicals and this has served me well with both safety and accuracy. The only time this wasn't enough to snug things up was with PR conicals and an oversized Lyman Cougar barrel. For that one, I wrapped those conicals with teflon tape to keep them in place...accuracy stayed really good, too.

One note, if you have an ATV rifle case that holds barrel down like I do, be sure to check that your bullet's safetly seated before starting the hunt.