No blood trail required. All your bullets issues are solved!

[Underclocked]

Yep, just havin' some fun with ya.

 

[elkstalkr]

Still no response from them so I sent this email this morning. Maybe it will get thier attention. I would really like to see a reply.


I emailed your company this on March 10th, 2006.

Ok guys I think your claim is a little ridiculous and I am calling you out on it.

"No blood trail required" and "Drops game in thier tracks"

I TOTALLY fail to see how this bullet is going to stop even a whitetail deer from running 50-100 yards after I make a clean shot right through both lungs. I am not talking about a neck or through both shoulders shot. Thats not how I was taught to shoot an animal. I mean right behind the shoulders through both lungs. Your trying to tell me thier is NO CHANCE that deer is going to kick and run?

I believe what you are claiming is physiologically IMPOSSIBLE! It will take time for any "clean shot" deer to die. Maybe just a few seconds, but they will still be able to run, lay down, stand their stupified, etc...... They won't just fall over dead.

If I am wrong please tell me why and convice me otherwise.

Chris Griffin

Still I have recieved NO response? Why not? Do I speak the truth? It would appear so.

Are you going to let me get away with calling your bullet a complete farce on the many hunting and muzzleloading forums I frequent? Just so you know the forum at www.modernmuzzleloader.com you appear to be a laughing joke with your claims.

Check out this thread. http://www.modernmuzzleloader.com/phpBB ... php?t=3220 I am not the only one who thinks this bullet is a SCAM!

 

[cur_dog]

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:

Way to go!

It would appear that they do not care. If they had a valid claim they would defend it and maybe sell bullets.

 

[eagleye]

Interesting. But shouldn't you give them a call to find out the real deal instead of slamming something you haven't tried yourself?

 

[dwhunter]

Whats the difference in a call or email their not answering cause it's a impossible claim. 8)

 

[elkstalkr]

Well I finally roused them. They sent me this:

Chris,

Why don't you give us your phone number and I'll have the bullet engineer give you a call. The technical aspects and ballistics of our bullet are way too lengthy to discuss online.

Maybe you should reserve judgement until you have spoken with someone who can give you all the facts instead of believing what you hear on the street. You may be surprised.

Lori Sanborn

Lori Sanborn
MDM
802-676-3311 office
802-676-2679 office/custom shop
802-676-3322 fax
www.MDM-muzzleloaders.com
www.Dyno-Core.com

And I responded:

LOL, I didn't hear this on the street! I read the statements on your WEBSITE and used my own brain to come to the conclusions I did.

You are more than welcome to call me. My # is ***-***-****.

Chris Griffin

 

[elkstalkr]

Eagleye,

I am not afraid to talk on the phone. It really doesn't matter to me how I communicate.

And YES I am slamming them. Have you seen the claim on thier website??? It is crazy!! Do you not think so?

Maybe thier "engineer" will convice me otherwise, but I doubt it.

 

[eagleye]

Actually, it's not impossible. I know some guys who use the bullet and it performed exactly as claimed. Have some writer friends using it and they said the same thing. Just an fyi. That bullet design works. Give those MDM guys a break and hear 'em out. It's not very good "customer service" to try to answer an email like that with enough detail anyway. Ask them to call you on their dime - what do you have to lose?

 

[elkstalkr]

Actually, it's not impossible.

Would you please elaborate on how its not impossible?

I did give them my phone #.

 

[big6x6]

Interesting. But shouldn't you give them a call to find out the real deal instead of slamming something you haven't tried yourself?

When one HAS an email address one assumes that they are able to handle anything that is able to come thru email. That should include info/technical aspects etc. So why HAVE an email address if not to answer questions? Barnes does, Sierra does. If the company is unable to answer questions then disable the email and don't list it...

I AM glad they FINALLY responded!

 

[dwhunter]

I just read about it on their website....... :lol: :lol: what a hoot! Looks like a regular ole T/C Maxi bullet.

 

[elkstalkr]

Alright guys they called me.

The first thing he did was make a brief mention of not having to take any legal action at this point regarding my statements. Everything I wrote to them in the email is posted here. So you can make of that what you wish.

After that I can say he was very friendly. He did fail to convice me that his bullets worked as he stated, at least 100% of the time.

Basically (if I understood him right) he said these bullets produce so much energy that shock of the impact simply drops deer or stupifies them and they wobble and fall. He also said these bullets leave NO exit wound and completely destroy the chest cavity when they mushroom.

He stated that he has never heard of a deer running after being shot with these bullets and all thier field trials and video footage back up this statement. BUT he did agree with me that it was entirely possible for a deer to run off. He said after shooting an animal it was still capable of running off, it just never had.

I did state my concern that IF a deer did run off, with no exit wound, trailing him would be much harder. He stated the entry wound would still bleed suffienctly. Personally I disagree, a 50 cal entry wound is a 50 cal entry wound. I have shot animals with no exit wound right in the lungs, and found only a few specs of blood.

That being said, I really don't want a bullet that doesn't leave an exit wound.

One more thought I just had and REALLY wished I would have asked him about is penetration!!! They claim great penetration, but I don't think you can have a bullet that mushrooms like that and great penetration at the same time. Can you? I'm no ballistics expert so I wouldn't know

Just from his statements I definetly would not want to shoot an elk with these! Seems like to me they wouldn't penetrate a shoulder shot if needed. He did state they had killed caribou, bear, and deer with the results stated. But I didn't ask him about elk. We all know how tough they can be.

Finally he suggested I try the bullets. Me field testing it would be the only way I would ever be conviced these bullets drop deer in thier tracks even 50% of the time. It just doesn't add up from a physiology stand point. Or at least hearing testimony from some of you guys, would convice me to try them.

At 13 bucks per pack of 8, I know I will not be trying them out anytime soon. Maybe one of you rich fellars could pick some up and try them out next deer season.

 

[Grouse]

DeadCenters would be cheaper. And you would have pretty close to the same results.

 

[Hunt 4 Bucks]

The first thing he did was make a brief mention of not having to take any legal action at this point regarding my statements.

What kind of deal is that, was that supposes to scare you. Or just make you feel lucky that they are nice guys. Definitely sets the wrong tone to start out. I want to be convinced by reason, not because of the possibility of legal action.

Why don't you give us your phone number and I'll have the bullet engineer give you a call. The technical aspects and ballistics of our bullet are way too lengthy to discuss online.

There must be a reason they will not put this writing. Could it be legal reasons.

At 13 bucks per pack of 8, I know I will not be trying them out anytime soon. Maybe one of you rich fellars could pick some up and try them out next deer season.

If they really wanted to sell their product, they would send you a free pack or two to try. There is no better advertising than convincing a non-believer. Or maybe that is not possible.

Basically (if I understood him right) he said these bullets produce so much energy that shock of the impact simply drops deer or stupifies them and they wobble and fall.

I know a guy who have shot WT deer with a .338 mag through the lungs and it knocked the deer down, but the deer got up run for about 60 yards. I would find it hard to believe that this has more shock than a .338 mag with 4000 ft-lbs of energy.

 

[dwhunter]

I agree about wanting my bullets to shoot through not just explode inside. No way would I even think about trying them. Also I don't want full bore bullets.

 

[big6x6]

If they really wanted to sell their product, they would send you a free pack or two to try. There is no better advertising than convincing a non-believer. Or maybe that is not possible

EXCELLENT point! And..how much BETTER would that make them look in everyones eyes! Instead they bring up a LAWSUIT? Certainly not in the first chapter of "How to win Friends and Influence People!"

 

[elkstalkr]

Hunt,

I agree, I was hoping he would offer to send me some free rounds but he never did. Just suggested I buy some. You could tell the guy truly believed the product was gonna take off, but you have to convice people of these claims first. I believe they will have an awful hard time convincing people, and at that price not many are going to be willing to try them out.

I also agree that high powers will not knock deer down, so why would this?

 

[Hunt 4 Bucks]

I agree about wanting my bullets to shoot through not just explode inside. No way would I even think about trying them. Also I don't want full bore bullets.

No kidding, that?s just what I want do when butchering the deer is pick through the meat for lead fragments.

 

[cur_dog]

I agree, offering 2 packs to everyone that has voiced an opinion on this would go a long way to proving his claims or not proving his claims. I know someone in their company is reading this, how about it? 2 packs for us? I'll shoot them at a big old bore hog. Probably have my 270 there for a follow up shot, just in case it runs. :wink:

Threating a lawsuite?

 

[Underclocked]

Have you guys ever seen those bullets aside from pics on a webpage?

I thought I was bored!! :wink: